Male Veiled - General health and checkup

SangrelX

New Member
Cage Info
Cage Type
Screen/Metal combination
30L x 17W x 56H
Metal Cage interior lined with vinyl pet safe screening

Lighting
Repti sun 5.0 -- 6 months or so old (time to replace!!)
100W standard incandescent light
on for 13 hrs a day 7am sun up to 8pm

Temperature
Basking spot has a vine right beneath it 85-92ish
General temperatures outside basking range from top end away from basking zone to bottom of cage 68-83F
The cage is tall and wide he has ample space to regulate from down to the 68 range up to the 92 range. When in basking zone his skin temp reaches around 81-83. Measured with IR thermometer.

Overnight temps where he sleeps sticks around 70ish he can choose to move higher to a warmer zone and sleep if need be

He knows about time for lights out because he moves down into mid section of cage and gets ready for sleeping

Humidity
I do not have a very good read on humidity in this large enclosure it seems to be around 50%. I have a 24/7 supply of dripping water. The cage is misted twice sometimes up to 4 times daily for about 3 mins a day. I have a nice hand mister that I pump and spray. Works Great

Plants
2 Pothos vines intertwined with repti-vines and spread all around the enclosure from top to bottom

Location
Reptile room kept at around 80-83F daily. Night time drops naturally to 70s. Room is quiet and is occupied by 3 Ferrets, 1 Snakes, 1 Roach bin, 1 Cricket bin. Activity in room is mild. 7am I go in top off the dripper. Feed some crickets and mist the cage.

Chameleon Info
Your Chameleon
Male Veiled Chameleon. Been in my care for about 6 months now.

Handling
Only handled when moved in and out of enclosures. In the summer time I will keep him outside from time to time for natural sun light. I am thinking whenever I go for mowing the lawn I will set his cage outdoors. This will give him about 3hrs out doors during summer time twice a month.

Feeding
I am feeding crickets mainly, occasional meal worms to treat and sometimes a Dubai roach. Still waiting on my roaches to breed and colonize to use for main feeders. I currently feed about 6-8 crickets in the morning. sometimes when I come home from work he is at his bowl so I toss another 5-6 in or sometimes like 3 meal worms. I think I might be overfeeding him. His crickets are fed on flukers cricket diet and nothing else. Flukers cricket diet I assume is enough for gut loading them? please provide clarity on this.


Supplements
Sometimes I skip a day and give no supplements. Normal schedule is Calcium w/OUT D3 daily. Calcium w/ D3 twice a month (generally once start of month and once end of month. Multivitamin twice a month same routine start of month and end of month. I use repti-cal products for everything except my plain calcium its a liquid calcium in spray bottle from zilla without phosphorus (I cant seem to find calcium dust without phosphorus anywhere!)
URL to Calcium spray
http://www.petco.com/product/108569/Zilla-Calcium-Supplement-Reptile-Food-Spray.aspx

Watering
Took the valve from a little dripper container and used it and hose on a much larger container. Drips daily 24/7 maybe a slight 1 or 2 hour not dripping before I refill it but never more then that. I mist the cage daily 2 times on average some days when off work its misted about 4 times.

Fecal Description
generally bright white urate and brown stool. With his old dripper I noticed some yellowing in his urate due to lack of drip. I have solved this by using the dripper I made with the valve and hose from a little dripper. much longer lasting drip. Back to bright white urates now..

History
Petco chameleon. Bought on a whim however I had done research previously because I had always been interested in a Chameleon. Future reptile purchases will ensure I have a fully setup closure to fit the animals needs before ever bringing it home. This will keep re-arranging to a minimum and stress to a minimum.

Current Problem
I want any and all advice offered. I would like someone to address some concerns listed in the information above & I want someone to view the photos of him currently to see if any issues are noticed. I am just after a general checkup thats all. I want to be sure he is healthy and enjoying himself to the fullest

I welcome all creative/constructive criticism. But do be polite remember we
are not all experts with chameleons

I am worried about MBD. I am not sure exactly what is normal when it comes to leg appearance. He looks bow-legged to me but please view images and come to your own conclusions.

Below are links to a image dropbox
the dropbox has a variety of images just ignore them. all G rated LOL
the latest pics are at the end of the lineup.. after all those shots of toys and star wars stuff LOL

https://picasaweb.google.com/102475220097254872974/DropBox?authkey=Gv1sRgCNiT_8Ogsfe8wgE

tried to add video but youtube sucks -- gonna have to upload it later somewhere else
 

ataraxia

Avid Member
Pretty boy you have..

Temperature
Basking spot has a vine right beneath it 85-92ish
General temperatures outside basking range from top end away from basking zone to bottom of cage 68-83F
The cage is tall and wide he has ample space to regulate from down to the 68 range up to the 92 range. When in basking zone his skin temp reaches around 81-83. Measured with IR thermometer.

Overnight temps where he sleeps sticks around 70ish he can choose to move higher to a warmer zone and sleep if need be

Location
Reptile room kept at around 80-83F daily. Night time drops naturally to 70s. Room is quiet and is occupied by 3 Ferrets, 1 Snakes, 1 Roach bin, 1 Cricket bin. Activity in room is mild. 7am I go in top off the dripper. Feed some crickets and mist the cage.
How is the rooms ambient temps 80-83 during the day and the animals cage ambient can reach 68? Also with a rooms ambients being 80-83 and the combination of a 100 watt...unless his basking spot is greater than 16 inches his basking is getting much warmer than 92*.

Overnight temps where he sleeps sticks around 70ish he can choose to move higher to a warmer zone and sleep if need be
..how is this accomplished?

Feeding
I am feeding crickets mainly, occasional meal worms to treat and sometimes a Dubai roach. Still waiting on my roaches to breed and colonize to use for main feeders. I currently feed about 6-8 crickets in the morning. sometimes when I come home from work he is at his bowl so I toss another 5-6 in or sometimes like 3 meal worms. I think I might be overfeeding him. His crickets are fed on flukers cricket diet and nothing else. Flukers cricket diet I assume is enough for gut loading them? please provide clarity on this.
At his age you need to feed the little piggy. 6-8 is fine.

Cage Info
Supplements
Sometimes I skip a day and give no supplements. Normal schedule is Calcium w/OUT D3 daily. Calcium w/ D3 twice a month (generally once start of month and once end of month. Multivitamin twice a month same routine start of month and end of month. I use repti-cal products for everything except my plain calcium its a liquid calcium in spray bottle from zilla without phosphorus (I cant seem to find calcium dust without phosphorus anywhere!)
URL to Calcium spray
http://www.petco.com/product/108569/Zilla-Calcium-Supplement-Reptile-Food-Spray.aspx
Could you post a link to the multivit you use or the full name of product.

Cage Info
I am worried about MBD. I am not sure exactly what is normal when it comes to leg appearance. He looks bow-legged to me but please view images and come to your own conclusions.
I dont see any obvious signs of mbd in the two limbs i am able to see. I would look online for plain calcium. many vendors sell the stuff :)
 

SangrelX

New Member
Pretty boy you have..

How is the rooms ambient temps 80-83 during the day and the animals cage ambient can reach 68? Also with a rooms ambients being 80-83 and the combination of a 100 watt...unless his basking spot is greater than 16 inches his basking is getting much warmer than 92*.

The room during daytime stays in room ambient temp around in reality more like 79-83ish
his lowest cage temp hits 68-69ish and thats at the bottom plant area where he could easily sit and hide in shade/cooler temps

the 100w normal light bulb for basking I know sounds high but I have taken the temperatures on the vine itself right under it and it just gets to 92F if i measure it for a few mins. Now when he is sitting on that vine naturally his body is closer to the light so I have measured his actual skin temp while basking and he keeps himself normally at a range of 78-80F skin temps now I have seen him go upto like 81F but thats the highest I have ever seen his skin temp goto

he seems to regulate himself very well..



Overnight temps where he sleeps sticks around 70ish he can choose to move higher to a warmer zone and sleep if need be
..how is this accomplished?

By this I mean where he settles down at night to sleep is about 68-70ish degrees I check it often and monitor the temps where he is sleeping and he always sleeps within this temperature zone...

He can climb to the higher spots in the cage to get to a warmer zone because heat rises naturally the room is hotter near the top he is only sitting ohh what 2.5 feet from ceiling or so.

This height of the cage is how I can provide a wide range of temperature zones for him. bottom of his cage base of plants has gone down to about 67 before at night. I am not totally sure how the bottom zone of his cage is staying so consistent even at night. Possibly the plants, the high walls of the container at the bottom kind of keep the heat in?



At his age you need to feed the little piggy. 6-8 is fine.



Could you post a link to the multivit you use or the full name of product.
Rep-Cal Herptivite
http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2754047

Rep-Cal Calcium with D3
http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2754048


I dont see any obvious signs of mbd in the two limbs i am able to see. I would look online for plain calcium. many vendors sell the stuff :)
Additional Information
He seems to be a healthy boy to me. Please let me know your thoughts on the answers I provided

MORE INFO
Ok... I did a temperature scan instead of pinpoint temperature with my IR gun... the scan in the basking area maxed out at 99F
so it is getting hot... I held my hand under the light at the height he sits when there and it got to 100F within 1 minute

but yet when I scan HIS body temperature when he sits there it is like 79-82ish
how does he manage that? I guess thermo-regulation is working its like his skin absorbs the heat and spreads it evenly throughout his body

I have never seen him gape or anything either.. I did have a 65W bulb in there but I was afraid it was not hot enough to properly assist in digestion etc..

I also read that adults can and will bask at temps of 100-105 max before on a veiled chameleon care sheet once so 99 is not to high according to it?

anymore advice? please let me know your thoughts
 

SangrelX

New Member
Ok totally new information and routine here..

im going to set back to a 65W bulb. Did further reading on a site I had seen recommended many times by users in this forum.

Basking spot no higher then 95F and even for his age basking even at 80F should be ok

so I will put 65W in and go from there. Will have to post new basking spot temps shortly....



--Scanned temps again before changing bulb--

Confused here I think when I first scanned the temps I was way to close to the basking zone and it registered it up in the light as well.
I stood back about 12 inches scanned again and it went to 95F at one time but no higher

im confused how or what method is used to properly get a reading for the basking zone? should I stick a thermometer there or a digital one with sensor and put the sensor there?

lol help..
 

ataraxia

Avid Member
IR temp guns are good for reading off of a surface. so if you are reading off of a vine, limb, etc. the heat absorption properties within the material it is made of will produce improper/variable temps IMO. go to walmart and buy a digital therm with a probe. place the probe on the highest branch he can get to the bulb and let that stand for 30 minutes or so.

if i were you, i would buy some 40 watts also :p
 

SangrelX

New Member
IR temp guns are good for reading off of a surface. so if you are reading off of a vine, limb, etc. the heat absorption properties within the material it is made of will produce improper/variable temps IMO. go to walmart and buy a digital therm with a probe. place the probe on the highest branch he can get to the bulb and let that stand for 30 minutes or so.

if i were you, i would buy some 40 watts also :p

I bought the IR thermometer based on advice from people here who suggest its the most accurate way to measure the temps

I do have digital thermometers with probes here at home

tomorrow I will attach probe to the vine and let it monitor for a few hours see what I get

I will attach it where he sits and hope he doesn't sit on it while trying to read LOL

sound good?
 

faye

New Member
My recomendation is dust your crickets with Nutrabol and change your UV at least once a year, if pos every 6 months.. He's a very handsome young :rolleyes:man!
 

SangrelX

New Member
My recomendation is dust your crickets with Nutrabol and change your UV at least once a year, if pos every 6 months.. He's a very handsome young :rolleyes:man!
never heard of nutrabol
the UVB is changed every 6 months
the bulb just turned 6 months and was changed yesterday

I figure 6 months was a good time to take photos and ask people if he looks good and to be in good health
 

whereswaldo

New Member
ive never herd of it either what is that?
u do need a supplement with no d3 for everyday dustings i dont skip it if im using crix there not high enough in calcium. i ordered repashy no d3 like their products, actually waiting on an all in one they have that some experts use ive seen some beautiful colored veileds that it was used on.
 

SangrelX

New Member
ive never herd of it either what is that?
u do need a supplement with no d3 for everyday dustings i dont skip it if im using crix there not high enough in calcium. i ordered repashy no d3 like their products, actually waiting on an all in one they have that some experts use ive seen some beautiful colored veileds that it was used on.
I use liquid calcium daily no phosphorus (sometimes I skip a day maybe 2-3 days total in a month skipped randomly)
 

ataraxia

Avid Member
Skipping supplements from time to time is ok.

I would also implement a multivitamin like reptivite with a preformed source of vit A (twice a month).
 

SangrelX

New Member
Skipping supplements from time to time is ok.
well for some reason in my head -- I always sort of thought skipping a day or two here and there would be beneficial

it gives the body time to process and balance out a bit from what is being dosed with already

just my idea behind it -- so i randomly skip some days here and there... help prevent a build up of calcium / over supplement

I also put a sensor on his vine and dropped heat to 60W bulb last check that spot on vine went to 92F tops going to check again in a minute


ADDED INFORMATION
Just checked probe reads 98F now
I did a pinpoint scan with my IR thermometer it reads 88F
exact same spot right on the probe

Sooo 2 devices one known to be extremely accurate the IR
and one known to be a 3~5 difference as stated on package

Which numbers should I trust??

either way 100W was getting to hot im sure
I had only had that 100W in for 2 days so no harm no foul thankfully
 

ataraxia

Avid Member
If i were in your shoes..I would go off of the digital therm. I would back my light off about 6-8 degrees. 100* indoors is not the same as 100* outside.

If you really want to nail this..go buy another digital therm to confirm :)
 

SangrelX

New Member
If i were in your shoes..I would go off of the digital therm. I would back my light off about 6-8 degrees. 100* indoors is not the same as 100* outside.

If you really want to nail this..go buy another digital therm to confirm :)
could raise the light sure -- but everything im reading says a basking zone can go upto 105F with no issues as long as the animal can escape the basking zone

whats your take on that?
 

faye

New Member
Nutrabol, I live in England, if u r in America I guess you'll have different products, all the best...:)
 

ataraxia

Avid Member
I wouldnt keep any of mine at 105* indoors. not saying they couldnt exist at 105. i just dont recommend it..

I do however keep mine outside in the summer and temps are extreme. I dont replicate outside temps inside though. Many different variables allow different care from indoors to outside. Main things outdoors is that they have a breeze and here in indiana consistent humidity.
 
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