New owner needs help!! sick female veiled

[trill22]

Hi! I'm a new chameleon owner - bought a pair from my local pet store about 2 weeks ago. Everything was fine - both chams have been eating well and looked fine. I purchased the entire cage/kit from the store. Both chams are in the same cage - this is how they were kept previously. The store owner told me they would only be sold as a pair, which was fine with me, and that it was likely the female would be ready to mate within the next couple months at most. While I'm fairly new to reptiles, my boyfriend has kept various reptiles/amphibs for years (bearded dragons, crocodile skink, pacman frog, snake) and he lives with us.

About 4 days ago, the male decided the female was old enough to start mating. She was receptive, not stressed colors or trying to get away or anything. Yesterday was feeding day - she ate just fine, maybe a little more than usual but I figured the mating behavior probably made her hungry.

But today I found her laying on the bottom of the cage - obviously weak, shaking (not the leaf shake kind of shaking), and barely moving. When I tried placing her back on the branch she layed on the branch, climbed a little, but after a little while I found her hanging upside down. At about 2pm today, we put her and the cage in the shower (as described on various websites to help with hydration) and she seemed to perk up a little bit. But she just literally fell off her branch to the bottom of the cage. She is very shaky, and is crawling instead of walking - as if she can't lift her own weight. I'm very concerned and not sure where to turn. Please help!!


Your Chameleon - Female Veiled Chameleon, unsure of age but she's about 6" not including the tail. New owner - only had the pair about 2 weeks.
Handling - daily, previous owner also regularly handled regularly according to local pet store
Feeding - crickets, superworms. free range crickets every other day, 4 superworms as treats 3 times since purchase.
Supplements - ZooMed vitamin supplement used once
Watering - mist the cage several times daily, have seen her drink but she doesn't drink from the spray bottle the way the male does.
Fecal Description - colors normal,
Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites? unknown
History - local pet store is wonderful - they are not a chain store and care for a variety of reptiles and amphibians. The pair of chameleons was traded to the store because the previous owner was getting bored with them, although they appear well cared for. Both have been handled regularly and are not aggressive to people or each other. Was told by pet store that they would only be sold together, and that she was likely to be ready for breeding soon if I wanted to.

Cage Info:
Cage Type - screen cage, 2'x2'x4'
Lighting - double lamp - UVB tube light and basking light, usually on for 12-14 hours
Temperature - haven't measured temps in cage. house temp is 75-80 throughout the day
Humidity - haven't measured humidity - live in SC so air is generally fairly humid, plus misting several times daily
Plants - no live plants - artificial vines and leaves
Placement - cage is in living room window to access natural light. Top height at about 6' from floor. no direct vents or fans. fairly busy household, but living room is fairly quiet.
Location - SC

 

[kinyonga]

I would separate her from the male immediately.
Please post photos of her. It could be a number of things hhat is wrong with her but I would get her to email good reptile vet immediately.

 

[LLGabriel]

Hey there and welcome to the forums. I'm sorry to hear your little girl doesn't seem to be doing so good.

First, I would separate them. The cage size is great.. but for 1 of them. They can be aggressive towards each other with a blink of an eye. It may be that she is really stressed out by him. Do you have any pics of her right now?

Also, as far as supplementation.. they should be getting calcium w/ NO D3 at almost every feeding and a multi vitamin and calcium w/ D3 each twice a month. I alternate Mondays with my calcium w/ D3 and the multi vitamin. It just makes it easy on my brain. Haha!

You definitely want to measure temps and humidity too. I also live in SC and monitor all my little ones very closely. Here is the veiled caresheet for more information. https://www.chameleonforums.com/care/caresheets/veiled/

I am sure more peeps will chime in soon.

 

[carol5208]

The pet store was ok in selling them as a pair, but not a pair that should be housed together. One chameleon-one cage. Is there a reason why you want them to breed? Will you be set up and know how to care for a possibility of 40 babies or so to take care of when the eggs hatch?? I would master chameleon keeping first, before I make an attempt at breeding. If and when you want to breed, you introduce the male to the female and then you separate them after they have bred. No housing together.

 

[trill22]

Thanks for the welcome! I have already separated the chams. For now, she is in a small glass tank with screen top. The temp is about 90 and humidity is at 90% - although I expect both will drop some now that the lights are off. House temps cool to about 78 at night. There are damp paper towels on the bottom and an artificial leaf bunch to hide under, but no sticks/vines since I don't want her falling again.

Carol - I had not decided whether or not to breed the chams, but was also told it was likely to be a couple months before I'd need to worry about it. We have bred beardies and others before, so I'm aware of what needs to be done although every breed has it's specifics.

As I said originally, I was told these chams had been housed together since they were young. The pet store owner did say I'd need to upgrade to a larger enclosure once they were older, but didn't mention separating them. I have been researching the specific needs of chams, and of course I'd seen that they prefer to be alone. But since they had always been together, I didn't think I had to worry much right away.

Anyways, I'm adding a pic of my cham as requested. She is still showing great colors, eyes are open, etc. She almost looks like she ate so much she can't move (kinda like after a big Thanksgiving meal!). Her front legs are very shaky and she kind of drags her stomach along or crawls. I haven't seen any wastes since moving her into the tank, so I can't confirm she is still producing normal fecal material. I'd add a video of her movements, but I can't figure out how

Maybe she just ate too much yesterday? Or was mildly dehydrated and the shower/extra misting is helping?

Thanks for any help!

 

[Djturna4thakidz]

As previously stated, I don't think it is a good idea for you to breed them. You need to do the proper research before rushing into things. Chameleons are very difficult to master, even for those of us who have been keeping for years.

90 degree basking temp? If that is your ambient temp that is way too high! If it is your basking temp I would lower it to 85 immediately. How are you measuring temps?

78 is much too high for a day time temp, let alone your night temps. Your temps may be a major problem.

Your cage should be around 70 degrees during the day, with a basking temp around 85. At night your temps should drop approx. 10 degrees down to around 60 degrees. This drop is important for chams. 78 is much too high at night. I try to get my temps into the high 50's but it's hard during the summer months.

Get your temps under control and you may see a big difference. It's also very hard to keep temps down in a glass tank.