Canadian Economy Pricing

[FOREVER ENDEAVOR]

so far ive read traces post and seen that episode innumerable times and still dont get it.

really, its a joke..and should not be taken seriously... not based solely up this post and thread in particular, but more on others as well..rip me apart,... i'm going to go watch some football...

 

[THECHAMMAN]

no, i was just saying that i dont get the joke. nothing serious about it.

 

[FOREVER ENDEAVOR]

chamman- you dont get the point of the episode?

 

[FOREVER ENDEAVOR]

I do! However that link doesn't work up here in the Great White North. Something aboot Canadian content rules I'm sure.
BLAME CANADA!

haha darn.. its the "smug" episode

 

[Vibrant Chameleons]

Wow... some interesting opinions... loosely supported at that.

Veiled chameleons lay more eggs and have a lower mortality rate. They are bound to be cheaper than Panthers. Personally, I think they should cost more than we see in the retail world, but thats only my opinion.

I would also argue that other chameleon species are dramatically underpriced and that is evidenced by the lack of domestic breeding programs.

Last year , the wholesalers in Eastern Canada had driven the wholesale price on Veileds down to $16 each. It forced a lot of veiled breeders to drop out of breeding them. This year , with the reduced supply, the wholesale price is back up to $30+.

I can't imagine how a breeder of Panthers can support a program of 16+ separate bloodlines across 2 locales and not require a return on investment. If cheap chams are so easy and cheap to breed , then I'd like to know why 3 breeders in Eastern Canada have quite the business in the past 6 months.

If the market demand shrinks faster than the loss of supply , I will have to re evaluate my business plan. So far , I'm tapped out for the Christmas season and already presold well into February.

And for all the basement breeders... feel free to refer your customers my way, when they are looking for a second bloodline.

Lastly, I still maintain that $300 is a fair price for a Panther , of which , I can produce a history and bloodline lineage. I don't line breed due to lack of genetic depth. I have deliberately invested in sufficient bloodlines to take my programs well into the future. Thats not greed... thats care and concern for the hobby!

Like I said earlier, if a breeder can get $300+ for a Panther, by all means, all the power to you for that. Who wouldn't like $300+ for a Panther? But as I see it right now, the supply and demand is in trouble with Panthers here in Canada. That itself lowers the pricing of them, not to mention the very poor economy we've seen in recent months.

 

[summoner12]

I think you need a lesson in economics if you don't understand the difference between a commodity like oil and a luxury good. The entire market for chameleons is artificial, as they are a completely non-essential item, like the diamond market. The price of diamonds is not controlled by supply and demand, rather controlling internal forces and the perception of scarcity.

The problem with the reptile market is that every person you sell to becomes your competitor, and will even use your name to allow them to compete with you more effectively.

yeah... i guess oil is a bad example...... but maybe cheerios is better?

 

[Orchidartist]

"the going rate for a Panther is $175-200 and I've seen people selling 2 for $350."

REALLY? WHO? WHERE? LOL

 

[Vibrant Chameleons]

"the going rate for a Panther is $175-200 and I've seen people selling 2 for $350."

REALLY? WHO? WHERE? LOL

Another Canadian Forum. PM if you want details. I can't type that here. lol

 

[eisentrauti]

Why wouldn't anybody answer to my questions ? I couldn't understand it why a species like pardalis cost more than all trioceros species ? They are harder to breed and harder to keep.

 

[Vibrant Chameleons]

Why wouldn't anybody answer to my questions ? I couldn't understand it why a species like pardalis cost more than all trioceros species ? They are harder to breed and harder to keep.

Also another reason you'll hear Trace chime in, very soon

 

[eisentrauti]

What do you mean with "Trace chime in" ???

 

[Vibrant Chameleons]

What do you mean with "Trace chime in" ???

I just simply meant that she doesn't agree with the high Panther Chameleon pricing as well. She likes the rare species.

 

[chequepoint]

Why wouldn't anybody answer to my questions ? I couldn't understand it why a species like pardalis cost more than all trioceros species ? They are harder to breed and harder to keep.

Because the readily available and cheap nature of the WC animals undermine any true captive breeding efforts. Quality captive bred specimens would have to cost 3 times what a WC animal is available for to make it worth somebody's effort, since no one will pay that due to how many WC animals are available, nobody is making the breeding efforts.

 

[summoner12]

Why wouldn't anybody answer to my questions ? I couldn't understand it why a species like pardalis cost more than all trioceros species ? They are harder to breed and harder to keep.

I think because they can.........

 

[summoner12]

my CH Melleri will sell for 500k when He is done growing. Because that is what I want to charge.

 

[ColorCham427]

So if you pay top dollar for your chams, that breeder must love your business... Any returning customer deserves a break. How does it make your animals better by paying more? This statment is pretty weak.

I do get breaks.

I trust my suppliers, I've purchased off of a few other people, and wasn't nearly satisfied as I am with the people I deal with now.

I pay top dollar with the people I know, because they have never let me down in any way.

I don't know about love my business, It's not like I buy a few every other week.

I could see that breaks are cool with returning cumstomers, BUT, I think it's better if you get "other" oppurtunites rather than 50-75 bucks off your next purchase.

It makes me feel awwwesome knowing that I'm buying a chameleon that won't disappoint me.

 

[THECHAMMAN]

Why wouldn't anybody answer to my questions ? I couldn't understand it why a species like pardalis cost more than all trioceros species ? They are harder to breed and harder to keep.

probably because of the color. normal people dont really care how hard the animal is to keep, they care how pretty it is. usually people go for the flashy colorful one *panthers* and not so much with trioceros. not many people want the gratification of keeping and breeding animal that is hard to keep or breed, they want to keep and breed an animal that they consider "prettier" than the others. trioceros is cheaper because not many people want them so they are just trying to sell them as easy as possible, while people want panthers more, so the breeders can charge more.

 

[Sang]

OK. ill chime in here.

i payed 250 for my sambava, which i am so happy with. i got him from gesang, a known and respected forum member.

i would gladly pay that price again.....

as opposed to another member who had bad reputation and poor personality and overall respect to forum membrs.

BUt he sold his animals for 150 less. why would i not pay that? an animal sold for that price is bound to come with hidden attachments, true origin? health? over all care and treatment.

reptile farms do what they do for profit, while granted some forum members do as well, but they are small private breeders that still maintain a serious passion for their animals, and are on a far more greater personal level then others ever could be, your not just their next paycheck.



i also have purchased a WC jacksonii, although i know his overall health is OK, he still has to put some weight on him he is quiet small, impossible to cup feed, if he is eating i never see it which is fine, as long as he eats.

 

[jernlee]

my CH Melleri will sell for 500k when He is done growing. Because that is what I want to charge.

I bought a horse for alot and sold it back for the same price 3 years later and the owner turned around and sold it for twice as much. Because he was well known in the horse business. Thats way harley charges more cause they can.

 

[cham2cham]

I think thats great that the Panthers are selling for a much cheaper price. That is a great marketing strategy. It's business to a lot of you breeders here on the forum ,in my opinion, so I can see why some of you are getting defensive and not agreeing. Not saying its just breeders getting upset, but the big picture is many of you breeders raise quality chams and put forth energy (understood), while sitting on your arses playing video games thinking $$$$ Then you sale your clutches for a very high price. (DONT MEAN THAT LITERALLY) Truth is, its all about supply and demand with chams. Their is a demand of course, and the supply is huge compared to years ago. Trust does come into play, as with anything. Value of course and location (INTERNET). The person who started this thread is very correct, IMO, with regards to the economy. Its an economic fact actually. I'm in the business world and feel the sameway. The chams will be around $100 at some point and maybe $175 for the bizarre colored and awesome bloodline. Its the same with everything. Its all about supply and demand. WH or CH, they still came from the same original place. It matters with many supply chains are available. The Parsons for example: Many of you are breeding selling, breeding, selling, breeding, selling, and so on. I'm sure you get the picture. They will be easily available. Same with illegal drugs.
I was listening to Suzie Orman last night mentioning to someone to sell their house for $200 less if you just want to get rid of it. She added, of course the neighbors would get mad, because it would lower their house value.

(This is just my thoughts, I am sure many of you may disagree, which is fine. I respect everyone opinions, and I meant nothing literally about the stereotypes exampled above)