breeding

[AZJ0SH]

Any forum post without factual evidence should be treated as a personal opinion, I don't think it's a problem for new members to provide advice, it should just be taken with a grain of salt.

The issue is some new members might not be internet savvy, and not understand if the poster is someone offering their opinion or is a professional chameleon breeder, which is why I believe it's important to provide a refrence for your answer, or at least add in a little tid bit about you've kept and bred chameleons for years, or something along those lines.

 

[SonTigerPantherCham]

I have read everyones answers, thank you for posting
I do want to reiterate, it wasn't a question of whether new members or new keepers have useful info to add, it was why a really new keeper is wanting to breed. Some are having a hard enough time figuring out how to keep their single Cham alive, and now they want an entire clutch. That is what I am not understanding.
I think this is a fabulous place to learn, gather, and add information

 

[Seeco]

I personally am very pro-breeding. I think that someone without too many obligations should just go for it. Quickest way to learn.

 

[Texas Panther Man]

If you have done your research and have the time, space & $$$ to breed. Go for it! For every cb chameleon produced to me thats one less we have to pull from the wild. But a newb should at least have a yrs prior exp with chams before attempting any type of breeding project. Just to be able to have the hands on exp needed to recognize subtle physiological changes that gravid females go thru.

To me our ultimate goal should be to have self sustaining cb populations in place. We may see the day where imports cease and if that day comes we need to have as many diverse healthy pure bloodlines as possible to work with.

 

[pssh]

If only we could figure out how to sustain a captive population without the need for new wild blood. I believe veileds are the only ones that we have been able to get past the F5-6 mark or so without new blood being needed for overall health.

 

[sandrachameleon]

... it was why a really new keeper is wanting to breed. Some are having a hard enough time figuring out how to keep their single Cham alive, and now they want an entire clutch. That is what I am not understanding.

Its hard to understand Because its not logical.

Some people have a more than healthy confidence, coupled with ignorance, coupled with excitement, and possibly coupled with an erroneous idea they will make money at it.

Few do it because they are horrible people. If they realized they were not ready, they'd likely not do it. They just dont GET what its going to mean.

I feel the same way about people who buy a chameleon but cant afford a vet, or buy before they even try to find if there is a qualified vet they can get to. Or people who buy chameleons but hate bugs, or have a partner or parent that hates bugs.

Not sensible, but not uncommon either.

 

[DavidBuchan]

Some are having a hard enough time figuring out how to keep their single Cham alive, and now they want an entire clutch. That is what I am not understanding.
I think this is a fabulous place to learn, gather, and add information

Over-enthusiasm, coupled with this fabulous forum, and all the info and help need at your fingertips..........the forum itself provides a lot of the inspiration for breeding (and what I consider to be over-handling - but if I'm honest about it I wouldn't have photographed and videoed my chams near as much if it weren't for the forum........)

I personally am very pro-breeding. I think that someone without too many obligations should just go for it. Quickest way to learn.

Quickest, yes - but when was that ever best for a Chameleon? Patience is the thing we want from new owners, surely?

If you have done your research and have the time, space & $$$ to breed. Go for it! For every cb chameleon produced to me thats one less we have to pull from the wild. But a newb should at least have a yrs prior exp with chams before attempting any type of breeding project. Just to be able to have the hands on exp needed to recognize subtle physiological changes that gravid females go thru.

To me our ultimate goal should be to have self sustaining cb populations in place. We may see the day where imports cease and if that day comes we need to have as many diverse healthy pure bloodlines as possible to work with.

Agreed, I'm sitting on the fence a bit, here.........but we want a healthy captive bred population so we can leave the wild in relative peace, we also want the balance of less dead chams now, because so many people don't have the hands on experience, but still feel confident enough to give it a shot

Its hard to understand Because its not logical.

Some people have a more than healthy confidence, coupled with ignorance, coupled with excitement, and possibly coupled with an erroneous idea they will make money at it.

Few do it because they are horrible people. If they realized they were not ready, they'd likely not do it. They just dont GET what its going to mean.

Not sensible, but not uncommon either.

It's not logical, and you are right, it all comes from ignorance of the risks, and the possible problems encountered, and the amount of work involved. Unfortunately this is a democracy , and sometimes freedom comes at the price of a Chameleons life. At least we can console ourselves that next time they do it they will have learned something ............There's very little anyone can do about it, but it's annoying sometimes, right?

 

[Bernie]

 

[flareonnlw]

Can of worms.....my thoughts exactly lol......

 

[okiroo]

...not only breeding, but also giving suggestions on husbandry - lighting, housing, feeding-...is it maybe in 2 -3 months of having a reptile gives them the necessary - not just basic - knowledge to "help" other keepers?...?

i myself have been on for about 3 months or so and give advise;however. you must understand iv also worked with alot of animals and many reptiles before. and usually when i post if im not shure than i always put this is what i think could be wrong but i would like soemone to back me up on it. my whole entire life(not all that long) iv always had lizzards. as soon as i could walk i was playing with them. id like to think i know a thing or to ^^


---ps- breeding so early without keeping a cham for a good while(1.5+years seems kinda stupid. you havent even kept this speices for its lifetime. people need to see its not easy to do something like that. and theres really little profit to be made, or so i hear. lol).

 

[ShortStack]

Everyone has to start somewhere...

Ive had my cham for just under a year... November will be the 12 month mark. Shes about 1.5 years old.

I will admit, yes, i have bred her. I felt comfortable enough raising 3 babys (Got 2 at about a week old) and they are doing wonderfully. I felt that i wanted to experience every aspect of having a chameleon, and i felt confident enough to believe that i would be able to successfully breed. So far so good.

Its all about how you take critizism. If you are able to learn from your mistakes and your false statements, then you can become very knowledgeable. Reading everyday helps a lot as well.

About "newbies" posting... think of it like this.... If they didnt post a completely wrong idea, and kept it to themselves... wouldnt it be that THEIR chameleons feel the crap end of the stick, since thats how they would do the husbandry themselves?

In the end, its all about learning who and who not to listen to...

 

[bigian]

^good post...

 

[Ace]

but you see people that are willing will succeed and have a great experience

and people should post, even newbies and be sure if their facts are right, if not then the best thing they ccan do is learn from it

what is hard on everyone is a person not willing to change their husbandry or change their attidue andending with their cham suffering....

people like you should breed, because you want to,because you want to experience and learn,

but there are others that dont give time to think, or dont care but possiblly trying to get fast cash, which they wont

but i do agree on this last thing

"In the end, its all about learning who and who not to listen to"

Everyone has to start somewhere...

Ive had my cham for just under a year... November will be the 12 month mark. Shes about 1.5 years old.

I will admit, yes, i have bred her. I felt comfortable enough raising 3 babys (Got 2 at about a week old) and they are doing wonderfully. I felt that i wanted to experience every aspect of having a chameleon, and i felt confident enough to believe that i would be able to successfully breed. So far so good.

Its all about how you take critizism. If you are able to learn from your mistakes and your false statements, then you can become very knowledgeable. Reading everyday helps a lot as well.

About "newbies" posting... think of it like this.... If they didnt post a completely wrong idea, and kept it to themselves... wouldnt it be that THEIR chameleons feel the crap end of the stick, since thats how they would do the husbandry themselves?

In the end, its all about learning who and who not to listen to...

 

[Emily K]

I don't have an answer but I agree with you. I'm a PhD student working on Florida exotic reptiles. I recently adopted a female Oustalet's chameleon that had recently been a part of a wild Florida population resulting from multiple releases (probably because someone couldn't take care of all their animals).
I consider myself a pretty good herpetologist but was totally unprepared for when it came time for her to lay. I did all of the typical things to do when they are gravid but got a curveball. She is burying herself instead of excavating a true tunnel. It is nerve-racking. She stays buried for hours with no ventilation. How can anyone with limited experience deal with such a situation? I'm still freaking out. Anyways, my point is your right, inexperienced keepers create dead animals or invasive species issues.

My chameleon is doing the same exact thing right now, she is staying buried in the dirt, but I thought I heard her trying to lay them... I hope she makes it...

 

[Fchamel]

My chameleon is doing the same exact thing right now, she is staying buried in the dirt, but I thought I heard her trying to lay them... I hope she makes it...

My chameleon did the exact same thing. do you have a lay bin for her? get some playsand and put it in a container or box. about 5-7 inches of sand.

 

[Pearl Fields]

(this thread is from 2011 lol, just fyi.)

 

[Mrjamwin]

How far down did one have to dig to necro this post?

 

[Emily K]

How far down did one have to dig to necro this post?

Probably me honestly lol I am going crazy I am so scared of losing my little Cleo

 

[Mrjamwin]

Probably me honestly lol I am going crazy I am so scared of losing my little Cleo

What are the issues and have you made a post about it and filled our the health questionnaire?

 

[Emily K]

My chameleon did the exact same thing. do you have a lay bin for her? get some playsand and put it in a container or box. about 5-7 inches of sand.

Hi yes, I actually have a big pot of soil I mixed up, it's a mix of clean gardening dirt, cocoa core and a lot of v

My chameleon did the exact same thing. do you have a lay bin for her? get some playsand and put it in a container or box. about 5-7 inches of sand.

Hi, ya I have a big pot about half way full of vermiculite, soil and cocoa core. I just checked on her and she turned around so her face is out in the open now, I figured the mix I have is pretty breathable, so I just am hoping she has success, I will update !