flukers wasted my money

[chameleon97]

i bought flukers repta calcium (i wanted pure calcium) and fed almoste every cricket with it. i just realized that in tiny (you need a magnifying glass almost to read it) writing it said Vitamin D3 enriched calcium. I CANT TAKE IT BACK! i only used half a pinch of it. and the stuff aint cheap. i now have two containers w/D3 and overdosed her with D3. shes fine though. can someone recommend a brand of calcium?
to protest nobody should buy from flukers. i will tell them to make the writing bigger.

 

[Sara270]

You can use Miner-All O (outside) with red top. It has calcium in it with no D3. It is "outside" because it is meant to be used when cham is outside and getting sunshine and no need for D3. Many people use it indoors on a more frequent basis, and you can supplement with CA + D3 less frequently.

 

[ciafardo 4]

rep cal minerall has minerals you dont want to use that daily

zoo med makes repti calcium without d3 i use it

 

[chameleon97]

zoo med makes repti calcium without d3 i use it

ok thanx! I will look for it

 

[Chameleon Company]

Well ...

I have never heard of, or observed, a chameleon over-dosing on D-3 using any of the common commercial products regardless of whether it was kept inside or out. The tolerance window for D-3 is broad enough, and the amounts in all the commercial products so small, that I can't envision a scenario where normal use would cause toxic levels of D-3. While it is true that a chameleon receiving higher levels of UVB, up to the real deal, natural sunlight, has less of a need for supplemental D-3, that does not equate to meaning that a supplement with D-3 is therefore a toxic product to such critters. I have used D-3 every way one can, as a store bought additive in a calcium supplement, as pure D-3 where I added it to my own calcium concoction, and dosed it via twice-a-week dusting to indoor and outdoor chameleons. I cannot argue with the concept that you do not need to dose it to outdoor chams, but also cannot support, based on producing and raising thousands of chameleons, that its use in standard moderation hurts either.

 

[Robert Johnson]

I give my new chameleon Flintstone's Vitamins exclusively!
He gets all are growing boy needs as wee as added color enhancement

 

[Chameleonboy]

You should alwase read through the whole entire bottle. Even if that means you need to take a magnifying glass loll.

 

[chameleon97]

You should alwase read through the whole entire bottle. Even if that means you need to take a magnifying glass loll.

ok lesson learned. ill go to the pet store armed with a magnifying glass

 

[Eric Adrignola]

No real need to worry - When I was "learning", about 15 years ago, I was giving all my animals heavily dusted crickets (repcal with D3) every day, every feeding on EVERY insect. Starting at their first feeders (pinheads and fruit flies) out of the egg...

...and I never had an animal show any signs of OD on the stuff. If that wasn't gonna do it, not much will!

 

[chameleon97]

No real need to worry - When I was "learning", about 15 years ago, I was giving all my animals heavily dusted crickets (repcal with D3) every day, every feeding on EVERY insect. Starting at their first feeders (pinheads and fruit flies) out of the egg...

...and I never had an animal show any signs of OD on the stuff. If that wasn't gonna do it, not much will!

ok i will dust w/d3. the pet store doesnt sell w/o i will probably order online.

 

[THECHAMMAN]

No real need to worry - When I was "learning", about 15 years ago, I was giving all my animals heavily dusted crickets (repcal with D3) every day, every feeding on EVERY insect. Starting at their first feeders (pinheads and fruit flies) out of the egg...

...and I never had an animal show any signs of OD on the stuff. If that wasn't gonna do it, not much will!

when i got my veiled cham, for about 2-3 months i dusted with only D3 and nothing happened. i have stopped, but it doesnt seem too bad.

 

[ciafardo 4]

jim im glad you brought this up i to have dusted every feeding with d3 calcium in the past before i heard not to i never had a problem alot of people on here swear you can o.d. a cham on d3 i really never believed it but didnt want to take the chance . how do you feel about the so called o.d. on vitamin a by using a muti vite more than a couple times a month ? i understand that everyones heart is in the right place but i just think they are really causing a panic i would like to see someone come forward who o.d. a cham on d3 or had their cham eat toxic plants and die i just think that we are all being way to critical about these things i have plants in my chams enclosures for years that are listed toxic again this was before i knew and never had a problem i noticed they dont eat them. pothos all have bite marks out of them in my veileds enclosures but some have schefflera actinophylla or umbrella tree and i have noticed no bite marks they dont eat them they survive in the wild amongst all kinds of foliage is there problems there i dont know again its just an opion

 

[Chameleonboy]

ok lesson learned. ill go to the pet store armed with a magnifying glass

lol you got it.

 

[MutantHybrid]

"...and I never had an animal show any signs of OD on the stuff. If that wasn't gonna do it, not much will! "


Agreed,

I dust a handful of crickets every other day with calcium / D3 powder and have seen no ill effects as of yet in my juvenile.

 

[sandrachameleon]

"...and I never had an animal show any signs of OD on the stuff. If that wasn't gonna do it, not much will! "
Agreed,
I dust a handful of crickets every other day with calcium / D3 powder and have seen no ill effects as of yet in my juvenile.

I think the key word in your post is "YET"

There is no good reason to provide excessive D3.
There ARE reasons not to over do it.

So while I wouldnt panic about providing it once a week, I certainly wouldnt promote providing excessive D3. Your chameleon should be producing the Vit D it needs via the UVB lighting you provide. Supplementation should be a "just in case" back-up, not something to force bucket loads of into your chameleon. I strongly suggest the use of a quality UVB-generating bulb and very little dietary vitamin D

 

[Chameleon Company]

Sandra,

I re-read the thread. I saw no instance of anyone remotely suggesting to give a chameleon "bucketloads" or "excessive" D3. Just a modest reading of all posts here reveals that the issue being addressed was an attempt to determine what is or is not "excessive" or "safe", based upon experience. There is no finer guide than actual observation and experience, and just such anecdotal information was being presented. Since you recommend providing "very little" dietary vitamin D, can you tell us how much is "very little", and what results you base that recommendation on ? Can you also point to anything that shows that the regimens described are "excessive" and why? Thanks.

 

[MutantHybrid]

I think the key word in your post is "YET"

There is no good reason to provide excessive D3.
There ARE reasons not to over do it.

So while I wouldnt panic about providing it once a week, I certainly wouldnt promote providing excessive D3. Your chameleon should be producing the Vit D it needs via the UVB lighting you provide. Supplementation should be a "just in case" back-up, not something to force bucket loads of into your chameleon. I strongly suggest the use of a quality UVB-generating bulb and very little dietary vitamin D

Thanks Sandrachameleon,

That is why I included the word "yet" since it is apparent with all the inconsistency between breeders and keepers that little is actually known about vitamin deficiencies and lighting other than low UVB=bad, oversupplementation=bad. We are all seemingly thrashing about in the dark seeking the light (perhaps the UV light) in these matters. Some say to supplement every day, some once a week, others twice a week with calcium, multivitamins, and/or D3. I decided to go with a hopefully happy medium with only 3-4 crickets lightly dusted every other day and a good gutload.

 

[sandrachameleon]

I re-read the thread. I saw no instance of anyone remotely suggesting to give a chameleon "bucketloads" or "excessive" D3. Just a modest reading of all posts here reveals that the issue being addressed was an attempt to determine what is or is not "excessive" or "safe", based upon experience. There is no finer guide than actual observation and experience, and just such anecdotal information was being presented. Since you recommend providing "very little" dietary vitamin D, can you tell us how much is "very little", and what results you base that recommendation on ? Can you also point to anything that shows that the regimens described are "excessive" and why? Thanks.

To me, the above sounds defensive and confrontational - I appologize if my opinion upset you.

I made my previous comments to ensure that anyone else reading this thread received an opinion to balance comments such as this: "I was giving all my animals heavily dusted crickets (repcal with D3) every day, every feeding on EVERY insect." I consider this excessive, and I believe there are serious potential consequences to the chameleon for doing so. You can read the many other threads on this forum on this subject to understand those potential consequences.

I provide a very light dusting of a calcium with D3 powder only once or twice a month, regardless of the age of the chameleon. My chameleons live long, healthy lives. My first chameleon, Simon, a male panther, lived to be over seven years old despite (like most newbies) his being my learning experience. Like Simon, none of his babies received D3 more than twice a month, yet they are well on their way to living similarily long, healthy lives. Chameleons naturally produce the vitamin D they need from UVB. There is therefore no reason, in my opinion, to over supplement.

Anyhow, the subject of this thread was chameleon97 being upset about not reading the label until too late, discovering D3 in the product, and asking for a recommendation of a D3 free product.
I recommend the Rep-Cal Calcium Supplement powder in the 4.1 oz. jar. This product does not contain vitamin D-3. I suggest using it lightly on all crickets. I suggest using your Calcium with D3 bi-weekly, up to once weekly.

There are many threads already regarding supplementation schedules. I would suggest anyone looking for other opinions read a few of them. Here are some:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/calcium-d3-without-15065/
https://www.chameleonforums.com/vitamin-d3-10858/
https://www.chameleonforums.com/supplementation-mbd-1-a-2451/
https://www.chameleonforums.com/supplement-schedule-14739/
https://www.chameleonforums.com/supplimenting-schedule-issue-13515/
https://www.chameleonforums.com/my-supplementation-schedule-ok-16028/
https://www.chameleonforums.com/feeding-d3-supplements-15789/

 

[Orin]

Requesting someone to quantify a vague claim should not be read as confrontational. The original post mentioned that the animal was 'overdosed' and Chameleon Company was just letting that keeper know that it would probably take far more than he realizes.

 

[Chameleon Company]

Sandra,

Your opinion did not upset me. I did think, and still do, that you grossly mischaracterized what others had said in a detrimental way. I explained that.
In a discussion such as this, I for one would hope that when one uses terms such as you have, to include "excessive", "forced bucketloads", and "over-supplementation" that you provide some reference to how these terms are quantified. Specifically, to help someone such as the OP, who has a commercial D-3 product, has read some of the forum chatter, and like many, is looking for some basis on which to make a decision. Eric and others provided some substantial anecdotal experience and opinions in the hopes of providing that basis. Hppy New Year !