Tumor or skin problem?

[GrimCamel]

I'm going to get this sheet covered first

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - Male Panther Chameleon, been in my care for almost a month. He is 1.5 years old and ofc captive bred!
Handling - Barely touch him since he isn't used to me yet. Only held him when I needed to.
Feeding - I'm currently trying to find the right amount to feed him. He gets about 4 feeders a day, crickets and dubia roaches dusted in calcium powder. I gutload the feeders with fresh fruit and greens, müsli and rabbit pellets.
Supplements - Zoo Med Repti calcium without D3 daily. Havent started with calcium D3 but I'll do that once or twice a month. Also been using a powder my breeder gave to me. I don't know the brand.
Watering - I use a spray bottle and spray heavily my terrarium 3 times a day. I also use a dripper which I havent seen my cham using in a week now.
Fecal Description - Normal with a slight discoloration of yellow due to dehydration which I'm working with. Might be solved with even more mistings a day?
History - Not much. He recently injured is back foot when he got stuck in the ceiling. Lost to claws, no blood, no swollen toes just half claws. Although he seems more careful now, have been hiding for the last days and I think these are connected.

Cage Info:
Cage Type - Glass exo terra with screen top and bottom ventilation. 90x45x90 cm. Bioactive with lots of living plants. (No I am not interested to switch to screen it won't help him, he will just be too cold due to the climate)
Lighting - I am using a stronger uvb so he will get a decent amount even with all the leves in the habitat. Its a Exo Terra Reptile UVB 150 (10.0). I use two basking lamps in each side of the terrarium due to recommendation from breeder. Both are not always on, either one or both. 3 Wide/full spectra bulbs for the plant growth and lighting. Light goes on pretty late on the day because I haven't installed a timer yet, around 9.30 - 10.00 AM and goes off around 10.00 PM.
Temperature - Measuring the hottest spot which is about 31 degrees Celsius, would assume 25-27 in the rest of the mid height terrarium. (This might be too cold, if it is, say so so I can keep my cham in better health )
Humidity - My hydrometer hasn't arrived but as I said I mist three times a day till everything seems wet. Also that dripper going all day, and sometimes over night too. As mentioned I use live plants, lots of moss covering the soil substrate. They are different species in multiple patches. Most of it likes to keep damp (In the wild it grows by the waterside of lakes), while other patches dry up completely.
Plants - Live plants.
Placement - Its in a room where mostly only I am or no one at all, sometimes a dog (the calm type, no waving tail and not very curious for that matter either) that's just sleeps in the bed. She hasn't payed any attention to my cham and I don't let her because her being in the same room is bad as it is. The terrarium have a really bad placement on the floor due to the size of it we haven't been able to move it to higher ground (should have done that in the beginning, now its heavy af and we don't have any furniture that we think can hold it up without breaking)
Location - Northern Europe, Sweden. On a small island in the middle of nowhere

Current Problem - A bump behind his left front leg

I thought of it yesterday but I was too concerned about observing his broken nails. I just thought it was some wrinkles but today I took a closer look while I tried to feed him and it is clearly a bump but I am not sure what kind. I haven't felt if its hard or soft because I don't wanna stress him too much as he still is pretty nervous of me since yesterday when I picked him up for a closer look at his toes and that's probably why he refused to eat today also (I'll try again later tho). But that bump or what I should call it... I'm sure theres someone here that have seen something similar. It's as bit red as mentioned so I wouldn't doubt it hurts too. Is there some way I can treat him or should I go straight for a vet? I asked my breeder too but I want to see what you guys have to say about the matter too.
Keep the thread professional please, I don't want to get attacked bc of my husbandry, I want advise but be kind please.

 

[JaxyGirl]

Hi sorry you are having troubles with your Cham. Its hard to tell from your picture what it might be can you post some more. From what I can see it could possibly be a fungal or bacteria infection. But it does look red and irritated so a vet visit is probably in order so it can be treated.

I understand that you don't want any criticism about your husbandry or your glass terrarium. Unfortunately Panther chameleons are not completely a rainforest species such as dart frogs or other amphibians which you have created the perfect habitat for. Constant extremely High humidity and wet and damp conditions can lead to respiratory, bacterial and fungal infections. A chamelions cage must dry out after each misting.

Panther chameleons are regularly found inside primary eastern rainforest but are generally much more abundant in secondary habitat such as plantations and low degraded scrub at an altitude of 80-950 m.http://www.durrell.org/animals/reptiles/panther-chameleon/

I get that you live in a cold climate but so do I and many other people on this forum. I live in Maine, USA where the the temps can be -28 Celsius and over 6 feet of snow in the winter. There are people on here from Alaska, Canada and other cold climates that keep their Cham in a screen cage. There is a reason for this. We're just here to help you help your Cham to live in the best environment for his species so he can live a long and happy life.

 

[GrimCamel]

Thank you for the suggestion! My breeder seemed to have no idea what it could be and suggested I just standby and watch for growth. I will visit the vet if the situation doesn't change or change for worse. Feel bad for the little guy :/

Yeah I understand, I seem to read the same thing on this site over and over again. Before I bought my terrarium I had a discussion on a swedish forum about the same thing and they recommended this for me and I'm afraid a screen cage would be too cold since it is pretty low already :/ I read alot about ups and downs before and as I mentioned the swedish cham owners had the last word and many good points. We have different rules about pet keeping here and chams have a pretty large minimum space so I guess the humidity isn't as intense in a big terrarium as in a small one that't more common in the US. Reading about the locale my panther is from the base values are obviously not close to Sweden's or my house's. I understand you want to help but I don't think a screen cage will do it
It is weird tho how my cham seem to be a bit dehydrated even tho I mist this much in a glass terrarium :/ Any opinion about that? I would like to keep him as healthy as possible

 

[JaxyGirl]

Do you actually see him drinking when you mist? A lot of people still have a dripper for their chameleon even though they mist the cage. Many chams hate misting and won't drink like that. Misting gets the humidity up but the actual dripping mimics rain whip some chams prefer better. You definitely need to get him hydrated

 

[JaxyGirl]

Jut out of curiosity what is the current temperature in the room you are keeping your Cham in. In the winter my house gets as low as 65 (18.3 Celsius) with pretty much zero humidity at night and I don't keep a heat bulb on my chams at night. My house averages between 65-70 degrees (18.3-21 degrees Celsius) during the day. Chameleons need this dip in temperatures and humidity daily to keep healthy.

 

[GrimCamel]

No he hates it too. I haven't seen him use the dripper in the last few days which worries me. I saw someone else mention on the forum that chams mostly hydrates themselves through their breaths so I've been trying to mist his hiding spot a little extra but I don't know if that will do it. The case isn't extreme, only the small discoloration in his feces is the only thing I can see but then again I am no veteran keeper.

 

[GrimCamel]

My house doesn't get that cold normally. around 20 Celsius. I have no idea about the temps during the winter. Kudos for you that are able to keep your chams warm enough!

 

[JaxyGirl]

No he hates it too. I haven't seen him use the dripper in the last few days which worries me. I saw someone else mention on the forum that chams mostly hydrates themselves through their breaths so I've been trying to mist his hiding spot a little extra but I don't know if that will do it. The case isn't extreme, only the small discoloration in his feces is the only thing I can see but then again I am no veteran keeper.

I'm not sure who told you that about chams hydrating through their breathing but they're not correct. Chams are not amphibious that can not hydrate completely through their skin or breathing. So no matter how much misting you do your Cham can still die from dehydration because he's not drinking. Too much moisture and humidity is going to kill your Cham. It leads to bacteria and fugal build up in the cage. In the end it stresses the Cham out because he isn't in an environment that's correct for his species which can lead to disease. He already has some kind of infection on his skin that is probably going to become more infected due the the moist environment he's living in.

 

[JaxyGirl]

My house doesn't get that cold normally. around 20 Celsius. I have no idea about the temps during the winter. Kudos for you that are able to keep your chams warm enough!

My chams keep warm because they have a basking light that they can move in and out of when they need to. If they are cold they go under the basking light to warm up. If they are hot they go to another place in their cage to cool down. That is all your Cham should have. 20 degrees Celsius is a warm enough room for your Cham. Your whole cage does not need to be hotter then that except for directly under his basking light. You cage needs this change of temperature range in it for your Cham to be healthy which can not be achieved in a glass enclosure. In order to achieve this you need a cage with ventilation so you Cham can have fresh air and its enclosure can dry between mistings.

 

[GrimCamel]

Thank you for the correction! Although you seem to have a bit corrupted vision about how wet my terrarium is. It dries up completely but as I mentioned in the description I have a species of moss patches on the ground thats a bit damp always. The whole terrarium isn't covered on this moss, the other species seems completely dry when I mist. My two basking bulbs dries up the branches and leafs pretty quick because they're strong. I don't even dare place one of them directly on the screen sealing because I'm afraid my cham will get some kind of burn. The whole sealing is in screen so the humidity steam can escape from the habitat.
But I will keep your words in mind and maybe mist less or shorter. Anyhow I will keep an eye out for my little boy so he don.t get worse or stays like this.
Thinking about changing spot for the dripper so he as access to it from his hiding spot and maybe that will help.

And about the temp. I haven't heard anywhere that 20 would be enough??

 

[JaxyGirl]

Also I just looked at the dimensions of your terrarium 90cm x 45cm x 90cm
(36" x 18 " x 36") is too small for an adult male Panther. He should be in a 122 cm tall screen enclosure.

 

[JaxyGirl]

Thank you for the correction! Although you seem to have a bit corrupted vision about how wet my terrarium is. It dries up completely but as I mentioned in the description I have a species of moss patches on the ground thats a bit damp always. The whole terrarium isn't covered on this moss, the other species seems completely dry when I mist. My two basking bulbs dries up the branches and leafs pretty quick because they're strong. I don't even dare place one of them directly on the screen sealing because I'm afraid my cham will get some kind of burn. The whole sealing is in screen so the humidity steam can escape from the habitat.
But I will keep your words in mind and maybe mist less or shorter. Anyhow I will keep an eye out for my little boy so he don.t get worse or stays like this.
Thinking about changing spot for the dripper so he as access to it from his hiding spot and maybe that will help.

And about the temp. I haven't heard anywhere that 20 would be enough??

Metric isn't big in the US. So what ever 70 degrees fahrenheit translates into Celsius..I think around 21.4 degrees Celsius.
Anyhow you're determined to do what you want..it's your choice.. so I wish you the best of luck.

 

[GrimCamel]

You made me nervous about the temps! Man x) I checked around the internet for references about climate in northern Madagascar where my locale is from. "We find several climatic areas on the northern part of Madagascar.
In the north-western coast around Mahajanga there are two clear opposite seasons, a dry and warm period from May to November (20°C average) and a rainy and sometimes much hotter season from December to April, where temperatures reach more than 35°C." Source: http://www.travelmadagascar.org/CITIES/The-North.html

I don't think my terrarium is too cold any more tho. That's a weight lifted from my sholders. I don't think its too warm either. My cham isn't hanging around at the bottom of the terrarium either. I guess we just have different techniques of keeping

And about my size. Since we live in different countries there are different standards. Sweden goes by the L80 rule which allows tree living lizards between 41-50 cm to at least have a 90 cm tall terrarium.

 

[GrimCamel]

Oh and youre right about the size of the terrrarium, its just me going by swedish laws
But the temp you suggested is too low it seems when I read the care sheets on this site. https://www.chameleonforums.com/care/caresheets/panther/

 

[Dro B]

When I used to use aquariums and had issues with temps, ventilation, humidity etc I would use one of those small fans that you could buy to keep laptops from overheating. They're small, safe, cheap and use a tiny amount of power so I had a friend rig them to my humidity gauge or thermoStat depending on what I was using them for. I would definitely recommend a screen cage they are fairly cheap these days and have a lot of benefits over glass.

 

[GrimCamel]

I bet there was problem with an aquarium since there's no screen at all and its built to contain water. However I think there's a big difference between a terrarium and a aquarium

 

[kinyonga]

Could you please post another photo of the bump..i can't see it clearly enough to know what it is.

Regarding your use of an exotic terra cage...i have used them for years for panther chameleons and many other chameleons and other reptiles....and they are fine.

To ensure air flow, the lights can be placed more to one side above the cage to create a chimney affect.

You do have to make sure that no water is left stagnant in the cage and that the cage can dry out between misting.

Be careful with the moss...I'm not sure if it will pass through the chameleon if ingested accidentally or otherwise.

Hope we can figure out what the bump is!

 

[JoeVet]

Is it hard, soft, fluctuant? Inflammation in reptiles usually is firm swelling. Sometimes you will see swelling from air sacs in that area.

 

[GrimCamel]

I do not have any more photos of the bump, I'm sorry but my little guy seem to be a lot more active today and the bump is almost completely gone, the only trace left is some extra skin! I can't figure out what it was, maybe its like JoeVet says and its a swelling air sac, I'm not sure. I'm just happy to see him moving around again, eating and everything

Kinyonga, I have my lamps as far apart as possible so there should be a decent airflow through the middle of the sealing. And about the moss yes, I heard about chameleons that swallow substrate. The pieces on some of the branches may be the riskiest ones. Atm they're stuck to the branches with bits of wire until the roots starts to do the job. I don't let my cam hunt because I'm afraid that feeders like roaches will just bury themselves at the bottom where my cham rarely is. We'll see how I solve this in the future!

But anyway, thanks everyone for leaving suggestions and showing me support!