time to breed

[pssh]

Well, not completely. I just don't think you should have to rely on the multi vitamin that much. Preferably your gutloading should be so complete that the multivitamin is only a just in case kind of thing.

As long as you keep researching and maybe wait a few months, I think you will do a fine job. As long as you are dedicated.

Also, you feed well for a few days after she lays, then reduce a bit until she become gravid again at which point you should increase feeding a bit again. Don't deny a gravid female of nutrients. It's only before they are gravid that you should/can reduce feeding.

 

[warpdrive]

From what I've read from a number of people, proper setups reduce if not completely prevent egg binding.

That's why he's here asking questions.
You keep making it seem that anyone that doesn't read everything about the question they're asking are bad people.
It's really kinda sad that people can't ask basic questions without getting jumped on negatively.

And I know you'll already jump down his throat when he asks stuff like "how long is incubation times", "Why is my female not laying yet", etc.
What are the 'better questions' you're hoping he asks?

Egg binding can also come in the form that can not be prevented. It is what killed my female ambilobi Laurie. The egg was located in a spot in her body that was not normal. It was also encased in a membrane that would not alow it to be passed out of her body without surgery. Tell me how to prevent such a thing and I'll be more then happy to learn. But untill then, my answer still stands.

NO, he was not still asking questions when I replyed. In fact he stated that he was well aware of what he was getting into and that regardless that he once had other questions, he now knew everything and just wanted to know if he had the time to do so.
If you reread my original message, I clearly stated that I questioned his beliefs and understanding of what he was getting into. In fact my assumption at the time WAS correct and it was the others who jumped down my back that was proven wrong. Sorry to burst your bubble, but you are clearly wrong on this.

As for the rest of your comments, they have no leg to stand on. Even Jared states that I am normaly quite helpful so I don't understand why I would not be in this case. You my friend are making an assumption based on nothing I said or did in my past. That is what I was accused of, yet now that everyone knows better, you feel that it is ok to do such a thing that I never did.
Yeah, and I'm now the bad guy too, right?

Harry

 

[Texas Panther Man]

Well I have prior breeding exp. I have bred & raised ch calyptratus and pardalis neonates. And I was the first to say to the OP that he should do his OWN research first. Then he should come on here and ask specific questions not "what do I do to breed my cham?". I admit my response was a bit harsh but I felt if he didnt take the time to properly research his questions then why should we give him the cliff notes version. He needs to learn the proper techniques to care and raise chams this takes time and alot of reading. If he cant be bothered to do that on his own he doesnt have the dedication to breed these animals.

The Op doesnt have even his basic grasp of husbandry down yet. Have you seen some of his other posts? I have. Yet, there are people telling him he can breed his chameleon. This kid needs to start researching basic care and then spend the time and Im talking months not weeks taking care of the chams he currently has before he even starts thinking about breeding. I know Jared and Pssh are just trying to be helpful to the kid but in this instance I think he needs to hear the cold hard facts. Which are he needs to learn his basic husbandry issues first. Jmpo (ive got my hard hat on so yall can start bashing me now.) lol j/k

 

[Vegas Chad]

Yeah-Chad always forgets me.

I don’t have the time (back to the Time = Money stuff) to sit and read 8 pages of stuff, I skim… Sorry I missed you Julie and Laurie; I actually did not miss Julie, I left her out on purpose! HAHAHAHA

Regardless; peeps only need to give advice that they have experience on. You can say something like: I read somewhere that this happens when you do this; I don’t know for sure but read the article here… Miss information is better than no information sometimes; I get emails and calls EVERY darn day about “somebody told me that X was good for my chameleon”.

There is a difference between experience and knowing the answer because you read somebody with experience post it.

 

[jdog1027]

Come on guys, I thought I was on the GWAR forum for minute,...

 

[Vegas Chad]

Come on guys, I thought I was on the GWAR forum for minute,...

While I dont know what GWAR is; I think I would agree

 

[Cainschams]

The Op doesnt have even his basic grasp of husbandry down yet. Have you seen some of his other posts? I have. Yet, there are people telling him he can breed his chameleon. This kid needs to start researching basic care and then spend the time and Im talking months not weeks taking care of the chams he currently has before he even starts thinking about breeding. I know Jared and Pssh are just trying to be helpful to the kid but in this instance I think he needs to hear the cold hard facts. Which are he needs to learn his basic husbandry issues first. Jmpo (ive got my hard hat on so yall can start bashing me now.) lol j/k

I agree and also said he should get more experience before trying to breed in my very first post.

I also said "In a way I am just trying to argue my point that these animals do not need to be treated like human babies." I dont think he should go off, get a female and hurry up and breed them. I do think there is a lot of junk posted in this thread and of course I am going to say what I think

No need for a hard hat when you post facts and post from experience

 

[Cainschams]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScA7vDC2u10

GWAR!!!!

 

[mardithepanther]

Well, not completely. I just don't think you should have to rely on the multi vitamin that much. Preferably your gutloading should be so complete that the multivitamin is only a just in case kind of thing.

As long as you keep researching and maybe wait a few months, I think you will do a fine job. As long as you are dedicated.

Also, you feed well for a few days after she lays, then reduce a bit until she become gravid again at which point you should increase feeding a bit again. Don't deny a gravid female of nutrients. It's only before they are gravid that you should/can reduce feeding.

It will be at least a year until I do the actual breeding and I can get more info from the forums. and maybe some more tips and quizzes from you guys?

 

[Texas Panther Man]

I know you were just trying to help the kid Jared. I just get a little fed up when people want others to do their research for them. I was a member of the Cin and I remember how dificult it was obtaining any info on chams even as recently as ten yrs ago. Its so much easier now to get useful caresheets and commercially available feeders. So i get disgusted when i think someones too lazy to search and read on their own. I will and i do help anyone that asks. I will help and I will answer any questions he has. But so far all Ive seen him say is he knows this or that and because of those responses I was immediately turned off by his lack of respect for others experience and knowledge.

 

[pssh]

Hey now, I agree that he needs to do more research. I was giving information that would prove certain assumptions and facts false. I never told him to breed right away or anything. For the most part I wasn't responding for the kid, but myself. If information was passed along in a disagreement, oh well. I just like debating and playing the devils advocate. A lot.

 

[mardithepanther]

i will continue to do my research in this year until breeding. Incubation temp. should be 82 degrees im pretty sure. And it takes around 7 months for the babies to hatch. It takes around 30 days to lay the eggs after breeding. newborns can eat flightless fruit flies and pinheads. babies should be fed 10 crix each or 10 flies each. mist babies at least three times a day. fertile eggs are white and show blood vessels. egg laying bin should be 12x12 with moist playing sand. eggs should be incubated in moist vermiculite or peat.
Just some facts i hope i have right

 

[pssh]

82 is very warm and likely to produce weaker babies. Limiting food like that in newborns is not a good idea. It will slow growth tremendously. The eggs will not show blood vessels until after they have broken diapause and the embryo has begun to develop. Sometimes fertile eggs do not look fertile, and can be yellow.

 

[warpdrive]

Yep, what she said.
I'm not sure where you are getting your info from but it's time to do some real research.

Harry

 

[jdog1027]

There is a point I would like to make regarding research- What do you trust? I do research for anything pertaining to chameleons that I feel I need differing opinions on. But one thing I've found is that you will often find some very conflicting data. For the most part, most of the info you'll find is very basic and general. But there are sometimes very different opinions and differences in detail pertaining to any given topic. I think this forum is an excellent place for some research because there are some very experienced keepers here. But nontheless, I've even found contradicting data here occasionally. I try to do what what has always worked best for me, but I'm always open to new ideas. That's what I use this forum as- A place to exchange ideas and to learn. I think that this kid did the right thing by coming here to ask questions and to learn, even if some of his questions were rather elementary.

I agree with Pssh, 82*F is a little warm. I am assuming this kid has a Veiled, but 73-75*F for the first 5 months with an increase to about 78-80*F the last 3 months of incubation has always worked for me.

 

[pssh]

He wants to breed panthers.

As for trusting information, I think you should be reading so much on the subject that you actually understand it. Not just knowing what you read, but also understanding the reasoning behind all the differing opinions. Once you at least do that, you can pick which route you think will work best for you. There is no one way with chameleons. A lot of different paths work for different people. You have to figure out what will work for you. While a good basic outline is needed, more in depth information needs to be looked into. You could tell me how to build a house your way, I could learn a hundred other different ways, and I have to pick what will work best for me. I may not be able to build your house or it may not work for my circumstances. Does that make sense?

 

[warpdrive]

See, while I agree with both jdog and kara, I still feel that this kid has yet to have done any real research just yet.
I'm quite sure he has asked plenty of questions and has maybe some better incite, yet he is still fishing for the cliff note version of what needs to be done and I'm afraid we are giving into him.

I don't expect him to know everything in the end. Heck, I don't know everything right now and I have 19 eggs. But I at least read countless books, online features, threads on this forum, and was even lucky enogh to get a blow by blow account of every aspect from laying to hatching to growing up of my baby male quad, on a daily basis. I also agree that baby panther don't need to be given care around the clock. Yet I base this on the knowledge I've read and experienced raising a 6 week old male cross panther.

I'm also all for helping someone get a better idea of why there can be some conflicting information, but it is hard to do so when the person in question didn't even do any research in the first place.

Wow, I think I'm done with this thread...it leaves a lot to be desired.

Harry

 

[pssh]

Well, he's doing something. There are a lot of people on here who have stated the information that he has found. While he may not have already researched everything there is to research, he's getting an idea of what he needs to be looking for. It can be difficult to figure out where to start, especially when so many people on this forum (which is supposed to be a great resource, and it is, just not 100%) post not so great/accepted/proven methods/information. That's why I reply with basic answers so he can figure the rest out himself.

Not all of use can learn to ride a bike by ourselves, ya know? We are taught the basics and we figure out how to get better by ourselves with a few tips, hints, and maybe lessons along the way.

 

[mardithepanther]

82 is very warm and likely to produce weaker babies. Limiting food like that in newborns is not a good idea. It will slow growth tremendously. The eggs will not show blood vessels until after they have broken diapause and the embryo has begun to develop. Sometimes fertile eggs do not look fertile, and can be yellow.

ok. Thank you. I do my research online looking at different peoples care sheets and on the forums as well. The information I keep is the info I saw the most. I have written a whole binder full of info :/ oh and you are supposed to feed babies 12-15 like what they can eat in a few minutes? I have heard that some left over free ranging bugs can hurt the babies. And I wont throw any eggs out until they start to mold.

 

[pssh]

Well, it's best to feed as much as they can eat in 5 or so minutes, 2-3 times a day. After the first few feedings you have more of an idea of how much they eat so you won't have too many extras in the enclosure. Fruit flies don't really pose a threat except that they get out of the tub and bug you, but crickets may so remove any extras before night time. They will probably eat any extras throughout the day since they are hungry little babies.