time to breed

[pssh]

I'm not sure about you, but when I say I keep the adult crickets anyways, I meant I have them most of the time. Even if I only bought a few for breeding purposes, I keep mine alive for way longer than a week. Especially if I buy 3/4 or pre-wing crickets. A few are always adults when I get mine. I don't personally experience a one week life span for my crickets, but if you do then I can see the problem. I have some adult crickets that I bought as 3/4 two months ago that are still alive. I just haven't bothered to clean out that bin.

I try to plan as far ahead as I possibly can when I start projects, regardless of if that means thinking a year or two into the future.

 

[Cainschams]

Wow, way to twist my words Jared. Nice job.
The thing is, I baseed my ansers on his replys. I'll stand by them because I was not only correct when is came to Stephan, but I'm normaly correct when I read into things based from a kids point of view.

I realy don't have time to debate this, its why my last reply was so long yet still lacks detail into a lot of my thoughts. Like yeah, he will be gone for most of the day when they need some care. Of course again, I guess I really have no idea because I've never delt with raising panthers, yet I have done my share of breeding other things that require live food and well, I'm not too sure I would want to give that little bit of care that you did for yours. Why have them then if all you need to do is one feeding? Heck, when I got my first panther at 6 weeks old I was doing 2 feedings. I guess I was working too hard. I guess like you I could have just fed him crickets every day like you. Yet I didn't. I guess I worked too hard yet again. I guess in order to save money, I didn't buy a misting system so I spent far too much time misting 3 to 5 times a day when I could have misted once like you during that quick 1 hour of care. I guess I worked too hard yet again.

I must be a poopie face I guess. Not because I needed to work so hard, but because what's the point in having them again if you don't have the time to enjoy them?

Oh, and Kara, I got some really cool shrooms if you wana come over for tea.

Harry

Please, show me where I twisted your words because I just cannot find any example You are the one who is twisting words.

Example:

"Now of course I can not only feed just crickets to my future babies, I can even feed just crickets to my adults too. I could also gutload with just some dog food or something from flukers but I chose to be different I guess.".

I never said that is how I raise my animals.

"Had problems with silkies bro?"
"Sorry to say Kara but I'm a dumb as a rock so I wasn't let in to the smart kids club."

Never said those things either. Talk about twisting words. Do you really need me to waste my time posting more assumptions and word twisting to prove my point?

"I'm not too sure I would want to give that little bit of care that you did for yours."

Obviously the time I put into my animals is quite enough. I think I have proved that over the years I have been keeping them.

"I mean everyone, yes everyone has made assumptions in this thread."

Please, find an example of me assuming anything I stated my opinions. Whether the kid has time or not I never assumed anything. I just stated my point.

"Of course Jared already knows this, that's why he's leading him on by saying it's so easy."

I am not leading anyone on. I am voicing my opinion and backing it up with my experiences. Something you have yet to do.

You are being completely irrational. To answer your question, I dont know the exact number but it surely isnt 1 million of them. If you do it right I would say 5000 of different sizes would be enough for 20 babies. Keeping some of them going further into the life cycle to breed etc.

 

[warpdrive]

Kara,

Egg laying females are L6 or 6 week olds and typically live for just another week or 2 at the max. Sure there are always exceptions but this will be far less then the norm.
Of course, such adults will have to be replaced and thus you'll also have to raise others so that they can be your future breeders. Let's also remember that when raising feeders that things can and do go wrong, normally at the worse moment, so extras will be needed as well. So now we are talking about not only the normal breeding program, but an extra emergency program as well.

Let us also understand that not everyone can breed crickets regardless that I can and I'm dumber then dirt. I have seen countless postings from quite smart people who find them difficult and they have tried everything to get at least a few pinheads to hatch without success.

While I agree that maybe 1000 is a good start, by the time one or two months roll around, this kid will have thousands and thousands of crickets of all sizes in order to keep feeding his babies. And if like me they choose to feed other foods so they can be stronger and more adaptable to a new home then they will indeed feed other foods as well.

Remember it's not so much in how easy it will be for you to do such a project, it is just how easy it will be for this 13 year old that clearly hasn't started or gained such an insight as to how successful they can be.
It's like fruitflys for you and I...one of ous might find them super easy, the other might find them hard. That is not to say that fruitflys are hard or easy, just that for some of us it might not be the same as someone else. I wish more people like Jared understood this so he won't be so offencive about such things.

Harry

 

[pssh]

"Sorry to say Kara but I'm a dumb as a rock so I wasn't let in to the smart kids club."

Never said those things either. Talk about twisting words. Do you really need me to waste my time posting more assumptions and word twisting to prove my point?

That's what I was thinking, but I just let it slide.

Oh yeah, some prefer not to use worms with babies because they may mistake the other tails as worms and nip them! I'd like to avoid that as much as possible, so my babies will stick to non-worm food until they are separated completely!

 

[Cainschams]

Also, how do you know my 1 hour of work isnt a few times a day? Assume, assume! Yes, I water my chams sometimes only one time a day. Its this thing called simulating seasons which is actually needed to be done for some species to breed and also longevity IMO. Keeping your lights on 12 hours a day, watering the same amount every day, feeding the exact amount of bugs every day etc. is not simulating seasons.

As much as some of you think you should be with your chams 24/7 it is not what they want. Spending less time with them and getting things done quickly lessens stress on the animals.

Olimpia, who says I didnt get all the juice out of my experiences? I am proud of what I have accomplished. Again, its your own perception of the hobby which obviously some do not get my angle. I do get why you would want to spend as much time with them as possible but if you want to lessen stress it is not possible.

Steffan, I am by far not offended I also dont think the way others do things is wrong either.

PSI, THANK YOU!!!

 

[warpdrive]

Please, show me where I twisted your words because I just cannot find any example You are the one who is twisting words.

Example:

"Now of course I can not only feed just crickets to my future babies, I can even feed just crickets to my adults too. I could also gutload with just some dog food or something from flukers but I chose to be different I guess.".

I never said that is how I raise my animals.

My reply "and I never said you did. Thus when you implied that is what I said, you not only made a poor assumption of what I was getting at, but you then in essence twisted my words. "


"Had problems with silkies bro?"
"Sorry to say Kara but I'm a dumb as a rock so I wasn't let in to the smart kids club."

Never said those things either. Talk about twisting words. Do you really need me to waste my time posting more assumptions and word twisting to prove my point?
My reply "keep going...I just love how you keep trying to put words into my mouth. Who is now making much more assumptions?"


"I'm not too sure I would want to give that little bit of care that you did for yours."

Obviously the time I put into my animals is quite enough. I think I have proved that over the years I have been keeping them.

My reply "once again you have absolutely no idea what I'm getting at and are trying to twist my words...even Olympia understood it real well that while you may only want or need 1 hour, I myself would like to dedicate far more time so that I can enjoy them. In other words, chill out. You're getting upset at nothing bro. I'm just different then you, so what is the big deal?"


"I mean everyone, yes everyone has made assumptions in this thread."

Please, find an example of me assuming anything I stated my opinions. Whether the kid has time or not I never assumed anything. I just stated my point.

"Of course Jared already knows this, that's why he's leading him on by saying it's so easy."

I am not leading anyone on. I am voicing my opinion and backing it up with my experiences. Something you have yet to do.

You are being completely irrational. To answer your question, I dont know the exact number but it surely isnt 1 million of them. If you do it right I would say 5000 of different sizes would be enough for 20 babies. Keeping some of them going further into the life cycle to breed etc.

Thank you for elaborating on what you feel that would be needed. Thankfully, I'll take your answer into consideration when I attempt to do such for my own.
As for the assumptions, just stop, you are not proving your case too well.

Harry

 

[Cainschams]

OP, if you have any questions feel free to PM me. I wont ridicule you or your questions.


"keep going...I just love how you keep trying to put words into my mouth. Who is now making much more assumptions?"

Dude, all of the things I quoted are clearly posted in your posts. Maybe you should go back through and read what you wrote.

As for the thread, I have made my point, proved and backed up what I have said. People with brain can see that. I am done arguing with incompetence.

 

[warpdrive]

Sorry Jared, but I did the same. I posted my thoughts based on the OP replys and sadly you jumped down my back to prove me wrong. Yet so far you haven't done too well in proving me wrong. I know what I said, and I know full well what I posted and I'm also happy that we can disagree on the subject. That doesn't mean I'm incompetent, it just means that you can't take a different point of view. Otherwise, once again, prove me wrong. Something that you haven't been able to do yet with out making assumptions on what my point was.

Harry

 

[pssh]

I keep my crickets in a cold room. They last a lot longer than two weeks for me, again, especially with the 3/4 ones. Sure the kid might not be able to breed crickets, but you don't know he can't. I don't know he can, but if he can he can use that information to figure out what will work for him.

Also, I'm willing to answer any of your questions to the best of my abilities OP. If I can't answer it, I'll point you to someone who probably can. Sometimes it helps talking to a younger person because they understand your view (sometimes) more than older folk. You can email me too at [email protected] if you'd like.

 

[Ace]

"i meant what i said and i said what i meant, and an elephant is honest 100%"

-Horton

 

[mardithepanther]

From what I understand, you are supposed to increase feeding and supplementing. A schedule like: Monday and Thursday- Herptivite Multivitamin. Tuesday and Friday- Rep Cal Calcium with D3. Wednesday and Saturday- MinerAll O. Sunday- Rep Cal Calcium.

If she is egg bound I would take her to the vet. They give egg bound chams enduced labor injections.

 

[mardithepanther]

But I plan on preventing an egg bound female by reducing stress during the egg laying process and providing the correct 12x12 tub of moist playing sand, vermiculite, peat moss, etc.

 

[Vegas Chad]

I agree he should have more experience with general care before breeding. In a way I am just trying to argue my point that these animals do not need to treated like human babies. You parrots can keep repeating what you read without a lick of experience.

And before its assumed I am acting high and mighty. I would not call myself an expert with any species but I do have some experience and this is where I speak from.

I still have to read the rest of this thread but a few pages in and this is the best point I have read thus far… Too many people “big deal it” and say words that they have only read in books or read it online. What works for me won’t work for others, what works for them may not work for me. Nobody has all the correct answers to chameleon keeping, well… Maybe God?

 

[warpdrive]

But I plan on preventing an egg bound female by reducing stress during the egg laying process and providing the correct 12x12 tub of moist playing sand, vermiculite, peat moss, etc.

You can only minimize the chance that way, you can't prevent the unfortunate.
My female died from an egg lodged between her spine and what I think is her heart...a place not normal for the egg and will not come out with induced labor.
So how could the vet save her if I listened to my instincts and taken her to the vet?

Oh, and regardless that I called it and knew you didn't do the research, doesn't mean I won't help you get ready. Don't let others assume that us old farts aren't helpful we just might have more wisdom then the foolish kids who think they know better.

Harry

 

[Vegas Chad]

Tips for breeding if you want to do it…
Space, have lots of it… If you are in it for the money, stop right now… Don’t breed your own crickets unless you have the space and a bunch of free time, you can get small crickets for cheap enough where it would not be worth your time to breed them; in business time = money. Be clean, clean clean and more clean… Keep good records, meds, breeding, lines, check ups ECT… Lots and lots more…

As I said above too many people make WAY too big of a deal about chameleon keeping; if you have the correct set up, and give them what they need to survive and thrive they are very easy to take care of.

If you have 1 or 2 chameleons then you really have no idea or are qualified to answer questions on breeding you can give your opinion on it, but that’s all. It’s funny that (as far as I know) only Jared and 13yo Stephan are the only people in this thread who have some full turn around breeding experience.

 

[warpdrive]

Chad you forgot juli, laurie, and quite a few others.
Yet let's remember, not many of us said it was too hard, just that he was uninformed on the projects he was planning. Now that hge has been more informed he can now make a better choice on the questions he asked without even our help.

Harry

 

[pssh]

Do Pygmies count? itty bitty teeny weeny babies!

Any who, OP, not exactly the best answer. I think it would be best for you to research much more about this. If you have done some research you should have come across eggbinding. This would lead you to how to prevent it and what needs to be done should it happen. The injections have a specific name.

I personally think that your gutloading should be responsible for the majority of the vitamins and minerals, so a multi vitamin does not need to be used that frequently. Depending on the brand of calcium, supplying that much d3 could be detrimental to the female. It can throw off the whole balance of vitamins and cause problems.

What will you do with the 2-3 subsequent clutches that follow? Are you prepared to have to take care of, possibly, 100+ baby chameleons? The clutches may not hatch in the order they were laid, or in the time sequence they were laid. You could have two clutches hatch as the same time. Are you prepared for that?

 

[Psi]

You can only minimize the chance that way, you can't prevent the unfortunate.

From what I've read from a number of people, proper setups reduce if not completely prevent egg binding.

Oh, and regardless that I called it and knew you didn't do the research

That's why he's here asking questions.
You keep making it seem that anyone that doesn't read everything about the question they're asking are bad people.
It's really kinda sad that people can't ask basic questions without getting jumped on negatively.

Yet let's remember, not many of us said it was too hard, just that he was uninformed on the projects he was planning. Now that he has been more informed he can now make a better choice on the questions he asked without even our help.

And I know you'll already jump down his throat when he asks stuff like "how long is incubation times", "Why is my female not laying yet", etc.
What are the 'better questions' you're hoping he asks?

 

[Julirs]

Chad you forgot juli

Yeah-Chad always forgets me.

 

[mardithepanther]

So I should just cut the multi vitamin completely? I got some more info. Once she has been mated her temperature should be increased and her diet should be increased. After she has laid her eggs. continue to keep her well fed and mist 3 times a day for a few days until she is ready to lay her next clutch. then reduce feeding. after she lays her most likely final clutch return to normal feeding