New Strange Behavior

[KTRamrod]

I’ve only had my veiled for a few months, and can only guesss that she’s pretty young, but until the last couple of days she’s acted the same every day, and now she’s acting really different. Instead of hanging out near the top of her enclosure or hiding on the side, Sunday she spent HOURS hanging down the middle of the enclosure by her tail from a vine. Just hanging. She started spending time for the first time near the bottom of the enclosure too, so I got a laying box ready & put it in. She’s sat in it & dug around. My husband thought she may have laid eggs while I was at work last night, but I dug through it earlier today & there were no eggs. She’s at the end of her second shed since I’ve had her, and she ate a chunk of her skin off the bottom Sunday... I had a ceramic dish below my drip system to catch the water (which I empty a couple of times a day & clean daily.) This morning it was full from the night of drips, but to my surprise she was laying in it soaking. I have a rock with a fake plant embeded in it in the dish so that if crickets climb in they can save themselves (it hasn’t been necessary yet, but I also didn’t want her to drown if she ever ended up in there somehow). She was just chilling out with her face and front legs on the rock & the rest of her in the water. I called a vet & they suggested that I take her out because she was probably too cold. She was pretty cold, but I put her close to her basking light and she climbed back down near the bottom. I decided to hold her to warm her with my body heat, which she didn’t seem to mind at all. Instead of hissing and snapping at me she was reluctant to go back on her vine. Could she be wanting to soak because she’s ready to lay? Could she suddenly like me? Should I let her soak in some warmer water while I monitor? She is my first chameleon, I kind of rescued her, and I’m just trying to take really good care of her. Has anyone seen behavior like this? I can’t tell if she’s just getting happier and checking things out, or egg binding, or what. None of this is exactly alarming, so I don’t know if I need to take her to a vet. The closest vet that deals with chameleons in nearly an hour away, so I don’t want to stress her out with a car ride unless it seems really necessary. Any ideas would be appreciated.

 

[kinyonga]

Welcome to the forum and the world of chameleons!

Please post several recent photos of her. Please answer the questions in this thread and be specific about supplements, gutloading, etc.

How long did she hang by her tail? Is she sleeping during the day?

 

[KTRamrod]

Thanks!
I actually hadn’t taken pictures of her before today, she’s always been really pissy, so other than doing things to take care of her I’ve Just given her her space. I can take more today if that’s what you mean.
I gut-load crickets with Fluker’s High-Calcium Cricket Diet & Fluker’s Calcium Fortified Cricket Quincher. The crickets free-range in her enclosure, and she eats 10 a day on average. She was excited about super worms when I first got them, but she didn’t enjoy her food biting back. I got giant meal worms after that & keep offering them, but she must be jaded now. She’s not in to it. I’ve offered greens with no response too.
She has a basking light & a UVB light, and I turn those off at night so she can have restful dark.
She hung by her tail for at least 4 hours Sunday. I finally put my hand near her (wondering if she was stuck). She quickly moved away from me and back to her branch. The next time I walked by her she was doing it again, and stayed that way for probably an hour. Then I put the layers by box in the enclosure. She’s been weird since.

 

[kinyonga]

Photos of her today would be fine. It can help me figure out what's going on.
That's a lot to be feeding her. It may mean she has a large batch of eggs to deal with.
No greens, veggies or fruit for the insects?

 

[KTRamrod]

I initially was putting greens, veggies & fruits in for the crickets, but they weren’t doing anything but dying in them, and it’s still (unseasonably) warm enough here that fruit flies are still a problem & we’re becoming a pain in the enclosure. So I just decided to skip the mess. I can change that though.
She isn’t any rounder than when I got her. My profile pic is from today. I’ll upload a couple here now.

 

[Carlton]

Photos of her today would be fine. It can help me figure out what's going on.
That's a lot to be feeding her. It may mean she has a large batch of eggs to deal with.
No greens, veggies or fruit for the insects?

What supplement dusts are you using? Is she getting any multivitamins? What brand of UV light bulb are you using? The cricket gut load isn't the best IMHO. Her hind legs look somewhat bent. Better pictures of her sitting straight on a branch would help, but I am wondering if she has MBD going on.

 

[KTRamrod]

Here are pics from today. I don’t think her legs look weird. She’s just happy in her tree.

 

[Nursemaia]

Her legs definitely look bent. She has MBD

 

[Crashbandit05]

Her front legs are swollen and should not bend like that. She needs to see a vet!

 

[kinyonga]

She definitely has MBD....maybe something else going on too. She does need a vet.
To correct MBD you have to give her liquid calcium sandoz or gluconate until the bones are strong again and also make sure her supplements are spot on, insects well cared for, basking temperatures appropriate, hydration is good.

 

[kinyonga]

Since most insects we use as feeders have a poor ratio of calcium to phosphorous it's recommended that you dust the insects just before feeding them to the chameleon with a phosphorous-free calcium powder to help make up for it.

To ensure that the chameleon gets some D3 without overdosing it, it's recommended that you dust twice a month with a phosphorous-free calcium/D3 powder and leave the chameleon to produce the rest of the D3 from its exposure to the UVB light. D3produced from the UVB light exposure should not build up in the system like D3 from supplements as long as the chameleon can move in and out of the UVB light at will.

It's also recommended that you dust twice a month with a vitamin powder that contains a beta carotene prOformed source of vitamin A (no D3) PrOformed sources won't build up in the system like prEformed sources will...but this leaves it up to you to provide some prEformed when/if it's needed. Also...vitamin A is antagonistic to D3 and so they need to be in balance.

It's important to feed/gutload the insects well. I use dandelion greens, kale, collards, escarole, endive, carrots, squash, zucchini, sweet potato, sweet red pepper, and a bit of fruit such as melon, berries, apples, pears, etc.

Overfeeding female veileds can cause them to produce large clutches of eggs and prolapse and develop MBD....so it's important to feed them enough to allow for growth until they are mature or to sustain themselves as adults but not enough to make them fat.

With treatment she can still have a pretty good life....but it needs to be fixed ASAP.

 

[CJ's Exotics]

Agreeing withe the other posts above, she does have some bending going on, but I would be careful, as she has calcium deficiency and a clutch of eggs to deal wiht, so she might have some trouble, so be careful and take her to an exotic animal vet.

 

[kinyonga]

She's not showing her big girl colors...so I'm wondering if she's just plump.

 

[CJ's Exotics]

She's not showing her big girl colors...so I'm wondering if she's just plump.

When I saw your post, I looked more carefully, and I agree. Try to gently feel her belly to see if it is fat or eggs.

 

[ObnoxiousFruit12]

She would have to be much older to have eggs. Maybe she's just threatened by the camera?

 

[davthevieled]

So as everyone stated, it is quite clear she has some pretty hardcore stuff going on with her legs. Her hind legs look all sorts of swollen and it doesn't look like she is able to use them as well as she would want. It might be just me, but they also look slightly discolored. Regardless, she is more than likely hanging like that because holding on with her own little mittens is just too painful to cary her own weight.

The important thing here that I'm just going to say is... stay positive. Bring her to a vet asap and get ready for a world of hissing, pissy chams that won't appreciate you are giving them the medication they need to live and survive. Listen and keep the feedback everyone has listed here, and start supplementing her food. Good luck.

 

[CJ's Exotics]

She would have to be much older to have eggs. Maybe she's just threatened by the camera?

As far as I know, they can have eggs as early as 5 months if they eat too much.