NEW C. gracilis x calyptratus hybrid

[Frankcham]

Hi,

I was wondering if anyone has ever heard of a Graceful Chameleon and
a Veiled Chameleon having a babies. I've asked around and everyone tells
me the same thing "No, I have never heard of that mix." So I was wondering
if anyone else has?

I am asking this because my Graceful(Male) and Veiled(Female)
Chameleons had babies together and the have finally hatched =)
So I am super excited for that. So far 3 have hatched. The first one
passed away, but the last two are still alive an look good. I also have
a few more eggs left and one is hatching as i write this. =)

I will post pictures shorty.

Please let me know what you think.

Thank you

 

[Tim Vader]

I think it's awesome! I want one

 

[lumbasammler]

That´s interesting i think.
But what is it good for?
The hatchlings will most probably be sterile.

 

[lindawaz]

mules are sterile but they serve a purpose

 

[Dperez87]

Has anyone ever seen or heard of this mix before?

 

[jdog1027]

Monumental!! I still think that this is interesting despite the fact that some or most question the reasons behind doing this in the first place. When chameleons have ranges that overlap in the wild, I am certain that this has to occur from time to time. It is, or at least at one time was speculated that Triceros pffeferi was a hybrid between Triceros quadricornis and Triceros montium. I don't know if this has ever been proven or dispelled, but to me this is evidence to what some might consider an example of evolution in progress. *NOTE* I'm not starting a debate on evolution/creation. I think that it is really impressive that you hatched these.

 

[Chris Anderson]

Hi Frank,

Mike and Kent both told me of your cross and showed me the pics of the first baby. I've never heard of a cross like this. Had it been a female C. gracilis with a male C. calyptratus, I would suspect that the babies were in fact a result of retained sperm from contact with another C. gracilis prior to acquisition, but a male C. gracilis and female C. calyptratus is definitely interesting. Has you female C. calyptratus ever had contact with a male C. calyptratus since reaching sexual maturity (i.e., not when it was a baby)?

Just to clarify a misconception that seems to be prevalent so far in this thread, not all hybrids are infertile. There are numerous examples of two distinct species producing fully viable hybrid offspring and I would not be surprised if two species as closely related as C. gracilis and C. calyptratus are able to produce live hatchlings that they could also be fertile. I of course would never recommend that such crosses be intentionally produced or that these crosses be intentionally bred once produced, but it is interesting that babies from this pairing have managed to hatch.

Chris

 

[Texas Panther Man]

Never heard of anyone doing that before. Plz keep us updated with pics and info on this......

 

[Chris Anderson]

When chameleons have ranges that overlap in the wild, I am certain that this has to occur from time to time.

Yes, it is known to happen from time-to-time. Chamaeleo calyptratus and C. arabicus are an example of two species that are known to hybridize. They are closer related but T. jacksonii jacksonii and T. j. xantholophus are also known to hybridize in the wild.

It is, or at least at one time was speculated that Triceros pffeferi was a hybrid between Triceros quadricornis and Triceros montium. I don't know if this has ever been proven or dispelled, but to me this is evidence to what some might consider an example of evolution in progress.

This was a theory to explain why only a single specimen of T. pfefferi was known for the 90 years after it was initially discovered. It has since been shown to not be the case, however.

Chris

 

[lumbasammler]

Don´t get me wrong, i think this is very interesting and cool in some way.
I just doubt that it´s worth putting a female under the stress of egg producing and laying
for this.

 

[Frankcham]

Hi, Chris Anderson

Thank you for replying on here, but no my female C. calyptratus
has never came in contact with a male C. calyptratus. My Graceful (male)
Chameleon was the only one in contact with her.



Also thank you to everyone replying on this Thread. I will keep it updated
with pictures and information on how the hatchlings are doing. Just to
clarify this mix was not done intentionally.

 

[Texas Panther Man]

If they are just going to be sold as "pets" and all the parties involved know the lineage of the offspring I see no harm. The problem is when or if someone decides to sell or trade them later on down the line. Personally, as a breeder part of this fascinates me but I do clearly see the negative impact hybrids could be in the marketplace, esp if they prove to be fertile......

 

[Kent67]

Hi Frank,

Glad to see you here. I think I may change the title of this thread to reflect the hybridization, if you don't object. I think this really is something extraodinary and I'm glad you decided to post here about it. I sure hope they end up growing to at least be large enough to document their adult/sub-adult appearance. Awesome work just hatching them!

To everyone else, I met Frank at a show over the summer where he showed me the pics of the copulation and said he had these eggs that still appeared to be good. If I remember correctly, the parents were his first two chameleons? I told him to please, please, please contact me if they hatched as I was very curious. As he said, this breeding was not done on purpose as he didn't think it was even a possibility and so had them free-ranging. "Nature will find a way."

 

[Texas Panther Man]

Ah, I was wondering how they managed to "get together".

 

[Kent67]

Yep! Watch out all you free-rangers!

 

[PaulTB]

This is extremely interesting considering im new to the whole chameleon thing as well. I would love to see more pics of the babies =) especially when they get bigger and good luck with them =D

 

[chendy]

exciting to see this new cham! (new to me atleast) post more pics i want to see mooooore hahaha

 

[chendy]

kent you didnt by chance steal that quote from ian malcom (jurassic park)
"Life will find a way"

 

[marco]

This is amazing! I really hope these babies stay alive and grow up to be adults. Keep us updated

 

[djfishygillz]

very interesting

that is weird and cool... hopefully they all stay healthy!