Female Sub Adult Veiled Shed Problem

[Andrew1283]

My female veiled did well with her recent shed except for the ridge on her back. I have read that spraying her and providing high humidity with cool temps (68-70) at night with low humidity and warm (78-80) temps during the day should help her shed but this skin on the back is stuck. I tried using warm water on a q-tip and gently stroking the area but it won’t budge. Any help you can provide would be helpful! She is friendly, active, and always interested in eating. If it’s just a cosmetic issue that’s OK but if this requires a vet visit I’ll get that done too. Thanks!

 

[Beman]

They are dry shedders so spraying her is actually making it stick to her like paper mache. Not a good thing. How long has it been there?

But I do not like the look of it. It looks very similar to a minor thermal burn. How close is she to her basking light and what are the temps?

 

[Serbianchameleon]

Agreed with Beman. It looks like a burn to me..

 

[Andrew1283]

I’m pretty sure it’s skin.

 

[Andrew1283]

I did find this photo online though and it appears similar. But on mine you can clearly see healthy yellow scales under the grayish white dead shed. On burns it looks like the scales on the ridge are missing from burns. She has no such damage.

 

[Beman]

In my opinion and experience. That is not what the spine of a shedding cham looks like. That looks exactly like a minor thermal burn.
The images you found... the burned one is a very bad thermal burn that has healed. It looks nothing like a fresh thermal burn or a minor one.
I am specifically looking at the color variation under the section that is peeling... While she may very well have shed stuck there too. It is not normal shedding to have the coloration different underneath like that. Specifically looking at the area more towards her tail.

So again I would double check how close she can actually get to the heat bulb, What wattage your using, and how hot it is at that branch.

 

[Andrew1283]

It’s hard to express with photos as compared to holding her in person. I use two 75 watt incandescent bulbs and she has a basking spot of 80 degrees which is 8-9” below the heat source. She never climbs above that area (which would be the top screen) or nearer to the bulbs. It’s like a clear dry film over very yellow and otherwise healthy looking skin. It is flaking away very slowly. If she was burned It must have been before she started shedding. I hope she loses this layer in her next shed and would hate to think she was burned!

 

[Beman]

It’s hard to express with photos as compared to holding her in person. I use two 75 watt incandescent bulbs and she has a basking spot of 80 degrees which is 8-9” below the heat source. She never climbs above that area (which would be the top screen) or nearer to the bulbs. It’s like a clear dry film over very yellow and otherwise healthy looking skin. It is flaking away very slowly. If she was burned It must have been before she started shedding. I hope she loses this layer in her next shed and would hate to think she was burned!

Ok so essentially your using 150 watts of heat on her since you are running two 75 watt bulbs. That is much too high. I do not know how your taking the temp but if your not using a temp gauge with a wired probe to hook on to the basking branch below the heat then your not getting an accurate temp. Females to control egg production should be kept more to 78 at basking.

For example: I use one 60 watt regular incandescent bulb and have a full 10 inches between bottom of fixture and the branch. I get an 80 degree basking temp with this.

 

[Andrew1283]

I will find the pack of bulbs. I use the Zoo Med wired digital probe.

 

[Andrew1283]

My apologies. They are 53 watt GE soft white energy saver bulbs (as pictured). GE states they put out the same light as a 75 watt.

 

[Beman]

My apologies. They are 53 watt GE soft white energy saver bulbs (as pictured). GE states they put out the same light as a 75 watt.

Ok so now you are down to 106 watts which is still IMO high... I would double check your temps with a what I mentioned. I would also sit and hold your hand below the screen where the light is for 5 minutes. If it is uncomfortable to you then it has the potential to burn her. You have to remember, branch is 8 inches down... However they can easily come up off a branch 3 inches. And along the spine and the top of the casque are the most common places a Veiled will get thermal burns because they rise closest to the lights.

 

[Andrew1283]

Wow that’s a great point I never considered! I should definitely test the lamp on myself first and measure the temp not at the branch but at the height where the light will actually hit her back. Thanks Beman!

 

[Beman]

Wow that’s a great point I never considered! I should definitely test the lamp on myself first and measure the temp not at the branch but at the height where the light will actually hit her back. Thanks Beman!

Do not rely on a temp gun for this... They only measure the surface temp.. Good luck.

You can use neosporin WITHOUT the added pain medicine version on it. Gently apply with a qtip.

 

[Andrew1283]

I ran a single 53 watt bulb and got a 86.5 reading 5” below the light which is where the top ridge of her back would be. This is about 4 hours after the heat lamp has been on so it’s had some time to get up to full temp. I dropped the vine 4” to get it to 78 degrees. I was previously measuring temps with not one but TWO bulbs and with the gauge set right at the level of the vine, which is about 8” below the basking light. BUT I but probably did not allow sufficient time for the fixture to heat up before taking the temp AND I was measuring at vine level rather than where the light actually hits her back. Can’t thank you guys enough for your help. I applied a light amount of non pain med neosporin to her back and hopefully that helps the burned skin flake off to reveal her beautiful healthy yellow scaled skin below. All the best!

 

[Beman]

I ran a single 53 watt bulb and got a 86.5 reading 5” below the light which is where the top ridge of her back would be. This is about 4 hours after the heat lamp has been on so it’s had some time to get up to full temp. I dropped the vine 4” to get it to 78 degrees. I was previously measuring temps with not one but TWO bulbs and with the gauge set right at the level of the vine, which is about 8” below the basking light. BUT I but probably did not allow sufficient time for the fixture to heat up before taking the temp AND I was measuring at vine level rather than where the light actually hits her back. Can’t thank you guys enough for your help. I applied a light amount of non pain med neosporin to her back and hopefully that helps the burned skin flake off to reveal her beautiful healthy yellow scaled skin below. All the best!

It is a common error for a new keeper to run heat bulbs that are way to high in wattage at too close a range. Most keepers are also taking temps incorrectly. So I am very happy that you reduced to one bulb rather than the two. I am betting your temps with 2 were easily over 95 where it was hitting her back.

Now remember the distance you choose for your basking spot for heat is different then the distance below the UVB. Hopefully your using the T5HO fixture with a 5.0 or 6% bulb with this the distance below to the branch would be 8-9 inches for an approximate 3 UVI.

IF you have the basking fixture angled at the same branch for the UVB then you have to lift the heat fixture not drop the branch otherwise your reducing your UVB level as well.

Fortunately it is a minor burn and should heal without issue now that it is corrected and she can not reburn the same area. Do not get the area wet let is slough off on its own. It will be painful if your trying to pick it off which is why you need to gently apply the ointment to it.

 

[redhorse]

your close-up shots were awesome.
JMHO and would need a vet check to clarify.
Found this pic online: For the Thermal burn and could not find one for Fungal issues.
I have seen something similar to yours. The owner said (not sure if it was true) it was a fungal infection under the top layer of scales. His Panther was being treated with some kind of blue liquid. Sorry can't help more but for a wellness check it is worth taking to vet either way.

 

[Andrew1283]

I went out and purchased new 29 watt bulbs because I would really like to use both sockets in my dual bulb Zoo Med fixture. I think two 29 watt bulbs will help disperse the heat better throughout her warm basking area better than one single 60 watt bulb could. I’ll check the temps throughout the day to make sure her basking is 78 degrees at the height of her back.

It is a common error for a new keeper to run heat bulbs that are way to high in wattage at too close a range. Most keepers are also taking temps incorrectly. So I am very happy that you reduced to one bulb rather than the two. I am betting your temps with 2 were easily over 95 where it was hitting her back.


Now remember the distance you choose for your basking spot for heat is different then the distance below the UVB. Hopefully your using the T5HO fixture with a 5.0 or 6% bulb with this the distance below to the branch would be 8-9 inches for an approximate 3 UVI.

IF you have the basking fixture angled at the same branch for the UVB then you have to lift the heat fixture not drop the branch otherwise your reducing your UVB level as well.

Fortunately it is a minor burn and should heal without issue now that it is corrected and she can not reburn the same area. Do not get the area wet let is slough off on its own. It will be painful if your trying to pick it off which is why you need to gently apply the ointment to it.

 

[Andrew1283]

your close-up shots were awesome.
JMHO and would need a vet check to clarify.
Found this pic online: For the Thermal burn and could not find one for Fungal issues.
I have seen something similar to yours. The owner said (not sure if it was true) it was a fungal infection under the top layer of scales. His Panther was being treated with some kind of blue liquid. Sorry can't help more but for a wellness check it is worth taking to vet either way.

Hi Redhorse,
I agree there is a lot of expertise on this site but nothing beats a wellness visit to a vet who specializes in reptile care. It’s being booked tomorrow AM. Thanks!

 

[redhorse]

The group here is so experienced and give great advice and recommendations.....

Glad to hear- unfortunately there are so many issues that can cause problems and some are so similar. I have found many meds recommended by my vet and the majority are related to birds. That being said it is recommended use what a vet tells you since they usually have experience in the microbiology of underlying conditions or have books they can research.


Please let us know what they find.. Even if it is nothing- To many ask questions then never responding again. Even if their pet passes, it is great feedback since these problems occur over and over..
Thanks and good luck!

 

[Beman]

I went out and purchased new 29 watt bulbs because I would really like to use both sockets in my dual bulb Zoo Med fixture. I think two 29 watt bulbs will help disperse the heat better throughout her warm basking area better than one single 60 watt bulb could. I’ll check the temps throughout the day to make sure her basking is 78 degrees at the height of her back.

Yep just double check temps but it is fine to use two lower watt bulbs... It gives them a bit of a larger gradient of heat as well.

How is the burn doing?