Female has double knee

rex888

New Member
Hi everyone,

My female seems to have developed a double knee over the last week. I was wandering if anyone would be able to help me out and let me know what it could be or if this is normal?

She is eating well, moving around well, I can't determine whether its a serious problem or not as this is my first time raising chams.

Thank you

IMG_1578.jpg


IMG_1579.jpg
 
It does look like a broken leg and might be caused by MBD as suggested.
Please be specific about the supplements you use and also what you gutload/feed the insects with.
 
Hi thanks for the reply, I am using rep-cal (phosphorus free) and i dust the crickets at every feed.
 
How long have you had her?
What do you gutload/feed the insects with?
Do you have a UVB light on the cage and does the light from it pass through glass or plastic?
 
I've had the lizard for 3 months now, the gutload I am using is pisces. And the light goes directly into the tank, so there is no lid. I also have a male and they are in the same tank.
 
what is pisces? What kind of uvb light. Brand, 5.0 10.0 etc? You need to seperate the male from the female. They should not be housed together. What do you mean tank? Tank as in fish tank???
 
The brand of gutload is called is called Pisces enterprises. I am using a reptile one UV and it is 5.0. No it is not a fish tank, sorry I am not American so we say it differently yes it is an enclosure. The tank is 40x40x40. It has vines and fake plants also has a mister. I am pretty sure I am doing every thing right. I feed them everyday. They seem to poop a lot. And they are very active.
 
oh ok. Your enclsosure is quite large then but I am not sure large enough to house a male and female. The male can cause undo stress on the female if she does not want to mate. Do you have a basking light and do your monitor your temps and humidity with any type of thermometer or gauge?
 
Yeah, it looks like MBD. Could you fill this out for us?

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

Cage Info:
Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
Location - Where are you geographically located?

Current Problem - The current problem you are concerned about.


Pictures are helpful
 
Here's some information I hope will help you with things like supplements, gutloading, etc....
Appropriate cage temperatures aid in digestion and thus play a part indirectly in nutrient absorption.

Exposure to UVB from either direct sunlight or a proper UVB light allows the chameleon to produce D3 so that it can use the calcium in its system to make/keep the bones strong and be used in other systems in the chameleon as well. The UVB should not pass through glass or plastic no matter whether its from the sun or the UVB light. The most often recommended UVB light is the long linear fluorescent Repti-sun 5.0 tube light. Some of the compacts, spirals and tube lights have caused health issues, but so far there have been no bad reports against this one.

A wide variety of insects (crickets, locusts, silkworms, superworms, tomato worms, phoenix worms, butter worms, once in a while waxworms, etc.) that have been well fed and gutloaded should be fed to it.

Since many of the feeder insects we use in captivity have a poor ratio of calcium to phosphorus in them, its important to dust the insects just before you feed them to the chameleon at most feedings with a phos.-free calcium powder to help make up for it. (I use Rep-cal phosphorus-free calcium).

If you also dust twice a month with a phos.-free calcium/D3 powder it will ensure that your chameleon gets some D3 without overdoing it. It leaves the chameleon to produce the rest of what it needs through its exposure to the UVB light. D3 from supplements can build up in the system but D3 produced from exposure to UVB shouldn't as long as the chameleon can move in and out of it. (I use Rep-cal phos.-free calcium/D3).

Dusting twice a month as well with a vitamin powder that contains a beta carotene (prOformed) source of vitamin A will ensure that the chameleon gets some vitamins without the danger of overdosing the vitamin A. PrEformed sources of vitamin A can build up in the system and may prevent the D3 from doing its job and push the chameleon towards MBD. However, there is controversy as to whether all/any chameleons can convert the beta carotene and so some people give some prEformed vitamin A once in a while. (I use herptivite which has beta carotene.)

Gutloading/feeding the insects well helps to provide what the chameleon needs. I gutload crickets, roaches, locusts, superworms, etc. with an assortment of greens (dandelions, kale, collards, endive, escarole, mustard greens, etc.) and veggies (carrots, squash, sweet potato, sweet red pepper, zucchini, etc.)

Calcium, phos., D3 and vitamin A are important players in bone health and other systems in the chameleon (muscles, etc.) and they need to be in balance. When trying to balance them, you need to look at the supplements, what you feed the insects and what you feed the chameleon.
Please note that various supplements have various amounts of D3 and vitamin A and so some can be given more often than others. The idea still is not to overdo the fat soluble vitamins like D3 and prEformed vitamin A.

Here are some good sites for you to read too...
http://chameleonnews.com/07FebWheelock.html
http://web.archive.org/web/200605020...Vitamin.A.html
http://web.archive.org/web/200406080...d.Calcium.html
http://www.uvguide.co.uk/
http://web.archive.org/web/200601140...ww.adcham.com/
If you can't access the sites above that have the word "archive" in you can do it through the WayBackMachine.
 
Yeah, it looks like MBD. Could you fill this out for us?

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - I am pretty sure they are veiled. This is my female and she is 3 months old and I have had her for 3 months.
Handling - I probably handle my lizards twice a week.
Feeding - I am feeding the lizards crickets. I use repi-cal Phosphorus free powder and pisces enterprises for gutload. I sprinkle one spoon full (spoon came with packet - it is small) onto the crickets, also I have a cricket keeper so i pour the gutload in that
Supplements - Repti-cal (phosphorous free) i Dust them everyday when I feed the lizards.
Watering - I mist twice/three times a day. I have just purchased a mister so that will replace me spraying the enclosure. And yes they are always drinking water as soon as I spray.
Fecal Description - No they don't have parasites.
History - No that is all I can think of. Other than I have the male and female in the same tank.

Cage Info:
Cage Type - My cage is class with a mesh top. it is 40x40x60 it is an exo-terra.
Lighting - I use repti glo - 5.0 for UV and repti glo basking heat light. Their light is on from 7am to 6pm when I get home from work.
Temperature - During the day the tank is 32-34 degrees celcious. and at night the tank 21-22 degrees celcious. I use a thermometer to measure their heat, which is connected to their tank
Humidity - I am not sure about this... As I do not have a humidity tester. I have just purchased a thermostat and hopefully that will help.
Plants - I am not using live plants yet. As I thought I would wait until they are older and do some more research as to what plants they can have in their tank.
Placement - The cage is in my bedroom, No where near fans or air vents nor any high traffic areas. They are on my buffet table, and about 150cm off the ground.


Current Problem - Is that my lizard has a problem with her knee. And I want to know what i can do to help her, to get her better. And if she can die from this problem?
I will be taking her to the vet today. But if anyone has any advice it would be great.
 
Thank you very much this is quite helpful. Appreciate it a lot.

Here's some information I hope will help you with things like supplements, gutloading, etc....
Appropriate cage temperatures aid in digestion and thus play a part indirectly in nutrient absorption.

Exposure to UVB from either direct sunlight or a proper UVB light allows the chameleon to produce D3 so that it can use the calcium in its system to make/keep the bones strong and be used in other systems in the chameleon as well. The UVB should not pass through glass or plastic no matter whether its from the sun or the UVB light. The most often recommended UVB light is the long linear fluorescent Repti-sun 5.0 tube light. Some of the compacts, spirals and tube lights have caused health issues, but so far there have been no bad reports against this one.

A wide variety of insects (crickets, locusts, silkworms, superworms, tomato worms, phoenix worms, butter worms, once in a while waxworms, etc.) that have been well fed and gutloaded should be fed to it.

Since many of the feeder insects we use in captivity have a poor ratio of calcium to phosphorus in them, its important to dust the insects just before you feed them to the chameleon at most feedings with a phos.-free calcium powder to help make up for it. (I use Rep-cal phosphorus-free calcium).

If you also dust twice a month with a phos.-free calcium/D3 powder it will ensure that your chameleon gets some D3 without overdoing it. It leaves the chameleon to produce the rest of what it needs through its exposure to the UVB light. D3 from supplements can build up in the system but D3 produced from exposure to UVB shouldn't as long as the chameleon can move in and out of it. (I use Rep-cal phos.-free calcium/D3).

Dusting twice a month as well with a vitamin powder that contains a beta carotene (prOformed) source of vitamin A will ensure that the chameleon gets some vitamins without the danger of overdosing the vitamin A. PrEformed sources of vitamin A can build up in the system and may prevent the D3 from doing its job and push the chameleon towards MBD. However, there is controversy as to whether all/any chameleons can convert the beta carotene and so some people give some prEformed vitamin A once in a while. (I use herptivite which has beta carotene.)

Gutloading/feeding the insects well helps to provide what the chameleon needs. I gutload crickets, roaches, locusts, superworms, etc. with an assortment of greens (dandelions, kale, collards, endive, escarole, mustard greens, etc.) and veggies (carrots, squash, sweet potato, sweet red pepper, zucchini, etc.)

Calcium, phos., D3 and vitamin A are important players in bone health and other systems in the chameleon (muscles, etc.) and they need to be in balance. When trying to balance them, you need to look at the supplements, what you feed the insects and what you feed the chameleon.
Please note that various supplements have various amounts of D3 and vitamin A and so some can be given more often than others. The idea still is not to overdo the fat soluble vitamins like D3 and prEformed vitamin A.

Here are some good sites for you to read too...
http://chameleonnews.com/07FebWheelock.html
http://web.archive.org/web/200605020...Vitamin.A.html
http://web.archive.org/web/200406080...d.Calcium.html
http://www.uvguide.co.uk/
http://web.archive.org/web/200601140...ww.adcham.com/
If you can't access the sites above that have the word "archive" in you can do it through the WayBackMachine.
 
forgot to say...when a chameleon has MBD you have to bring the nutrients back in line to get the bone strength back and then use proper supplement, feeding, UVB, etc. to keep them there.
 
it looks like either a deformity, broken limb (not likely) or some sort of weird dislocation.

see if her/his grip in that limp is weak. and either way i would suggest a vet
 
Thanks so much. She is booked in to go to the vet tomorrow and see what he has to say. I have ordered a whole heap of stuff off LLLreptile new uvb's etc. Would any one be able to recommend what brand of calcium powder to get and what kind of vitamins to buy?
Also my lizard seems to be moving around a lot in her enclosure. She still is very active. Has eaten today and she doesn't seem to have a problem moving around and she is changing colour etc.
Fingers crossed its good news from the vet tomorrow.
 
I use Repcal calcium wd3, Sticky Tongue Farms Miner-all(outdoor formula) without d3, and Repcal herptivite for the multi. This is what the Kammers used to sell with their chameleons if you bought the whole package from them. They are now endorsing Repashy calcium all in one supplement. i know some of our members are using that. You can check it out on their website at Kammerflage Kreations/Chameleons Only.
 
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