Eye Issue/Temp Problem

[ajacobson]

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
Male, Ambanja Panther Chameleon, age about 8-9 months, in my care most of that time.

Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
Not often usually, lately a little more to give showers and take to the vet.

Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
3wk crickets daily, but he has not been taking them. Gut-load using Cricket Crack and sometimes home-made blends according to this site.

Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
Flukers Calcium w/ D3- 2x/mo
Rep-Cal Calcium w/o D3- daily
Rep-Cal Herptivite- 2x/mo

Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
Mistking every 2 hrs for a minute then longer first thing in the AM and last in the PM. I usually see him drinking.

Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
Last one I saw was dark brown with white urates. Haven't seen one lately, waiting on a sample to test.

History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.
Had an eye issue a little bit ago, treated with Terramycin was getting better, now both eyes are closed.

Cage Info:
Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
Large Exto-terra Cage

Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
5.0 UVB linear and a 75watt reptile heat lamp

Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
Having a hard time keeping my temps up. it's high 77-80 in basking, and about 72 at the bottom. I have a digital thermometer and a sticker one at the bottom. Overnight temps are dropping low, don't know how to control that.

Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
Umbrella Plant and a Ficus

Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
Top of cage is about 6ft off the ground, not a high traffic area, no direct vent. There is a fan but it's never on.

Location - Where are you geographically located?
Las Vegas, NV

Current Problem - The current problem you are concerned about.

Both eyes staying closed, and not eating. He is still very active. I have gone to the vet and she gave me Tobramycin eye drops to give him 3x/day. Previously treated him with Terramycin when he had only one eye with the issue. He's also very small (runt?) 13grams. Vet said she isn't worried about MBD or anything else because he has very straight limbs and is very active. Waiting to get a fecal to test for parasites, but he won't eat. I'm also having trouble keeping the temps up (in Vegas, who knew). Any one have suggestions on what the eye problem could be and how I can keep temps up?

 

[carol5208]

Try a 100 watt bulb and see if you cannot raise your basking temp that way. As far as night time, the temp drop is ok and a temp in the low 60's or even high 50's is not going to kill him. Also, have you tried any other feeders besides crickets? He might just be tired of them. Mine quit eating them at about 8 months also and is now 15 months and still won't touch them. Also you can add an additional basking light that is less in wattage but it should help raise the temp.

 

[jannb]

How do you measure your temps? With a 75 watt bulb he should be hot. How far is the bulb from his basking branch? 13 grams is really small for an 8 to 9 month old. If the eyes are closed then he can't see to eat. Have you tried the warm steamy showers? I would get in touch with Chad at Tiki Tiki and see who his vet is and get that guy to a good reptile vet now.

 

[ajacobson]

How do you measure your temps? With a 75 watt bulb he should be hot. How far is the bulb from his basking branch? 13 grams is really small for an 8 to 9 month old. If the eyes are closed then he can't see to eat. Have you tried the warm steamy showers? I would get in touch with Chad at Tiki Tiki and see who his vet is and get that guy to a good reptile vet now.

The bulb is attached to the side of the cage pointing down, I'm afraid if I put it too close he'll burn because he climbs on the top all the time (upside down). The branch is about 4 in from the top of the cage. I measured with a digital thermometer in different areas and even on the top of the cage right under the light it's not that hot. I've tried steam showers and they worked with the first issue, but they are not working now. I've also tried feeding waxworms, which are his favorite but he won't eat those either. He does open his eyes here and there but it's not a constant. I used a vet recommended to me from this forum, but I felt like they didn't really know what's going on, so I'll message Chad too.

I know he's tiny too, he's always had a good appetite but he hasn't grown much since I got him. The vet didn't seem worried about that either...again, unsure of them on that too.

 

[ataraxia]

pics please.

 

[ajacobson]

He's still doing badly. I've been trying EVERYTHING. He hasn't eaten in about 2 weeks and he's starting to look skinny and his eyes are sunken in. I gave him a long shower today and he drank quite a bit and opened his eyes for a few. He is not drinking, eating, or keeping his eyes open in his cage now.

We tried eye drops and eye washing, and I'm pretty sure it's not an eye issue. The vet gave a dosage of Vitamin A, still nothing. Should I try to force feed? Should I do live bugs or a "bug juice"?

Any ideas? He's really worrying me!

 

[kinyonga]

IMHO you need to get this problem solved quickly or you're going to lose the chameleon. IMHO you need to get the temperature up to the low to mid 80's in the basking area. If this doesn't solve the problem then you need to find out what's really going on.

The cage isn't near a window, is it??
Can you post a picture please?

 

[ajacobson]

IMHO you need to get this problem solved quickly or you're going to lose the chameleon. IMHO you need to get the temperature up to the low to mid 80's in the basking area. If this doesn't solve the problem then you need to find out what's really going on.

The cage isn't near a window, is it??
Can you post a picture please?

I know I need to resolve it quickly, that's why I'm trying EVERYTHING and on here and have gone to the vet twice. Nothing is working. His temp in the basking area is 81 degrees and about 74 in the bottom of the cage. I have 2 thermometers to get the readings. Should the temp be higher than this?

He is not near a window, or vent or fan. Nothing in his area or cage has changed so he shouldn't be stressed. Also no one is home all day and at night we aren't often in that room.

Here are two pics. One of what he is looking like and his cage. PLEASE HELP, I'm really trying everything.

 

[jannb]

He looks really bad. Get him hydrated now and then to the vet ASAP. Did you call Chad to get his chameleon vet?

 

[ajacobson]

He looks really bad. Get him hydrated now and then to the vet ASAP. Did you call Chad to get his chameleon vet?

I know, he drank a ton last night when I gave him a shower. I'll give him another. I got the vet from Chad, but he said she wasn't an expert. I'll give them a call anyway and try to get in.

 

[Carlton]

I know I need to resolve it quickly, that's why I'm trying EVERYTHING and on here and have gone to the vet twice. Nothing is working. His temp in the basking area is 81 degrees and about 74 in the bottom of the cage. I have 2 thermometers to get the readings. Should the temp be higher than this?

He is not near a window, or vent or fan. Nothing in his area or cage has changed so he shouldn't be stressed. Also no one is home all day and at night we aren't often in that room.

Here are two pics. One of what he is looking like and his cage. PLEASE HELP, I'm really trying everything.

I am less worried about your temps than your cage humidity. What are the humidity levels before, after, and during your misting sessions? This cham is dehydrated and dehydrated chams can't/won't eat. The fact that every time you mist he drinks means he's desperate for water. There is very little in your cage to hold humidity for very long, so while water is available during a mist cycle I'll bet the cage dries out too fast and stays dry too long for him not to lose ground before his next drink. Chams can lose a lot of body moisture through respiration if the air is very dry. Hang plastic on the back and/or sides of the cage, stuff it full of live plants, aim a humidifier at the cage and cycle it on and off to maintain at least 60% humidity.

 

[jannb]

I know, he drank a ton last night when I gave him a shower. I'll give him another. I got the vet from Chad, but he said she wasn't an expert. I'll give them a call anyway and try to get in.

After a shower be sure to warm him up. His temps are low. With him being sick I'd bring him up to 85. Also don't mist him or wet him late in the afternoon or in the eveing. His cage should be dried out at night for sleeping. I would not mist so often through the day either. Three times should be enough.

 

[ajacobson]

I am less worried about your temps than your cage humidity. What are the humidity levels before, after, and during your misting sessions? This cham is dehydrated and dehydrated chams can't/won't eat. The fact that every time you mist he drinks means he's desperate for water. There is very little in your cage to hold humidity for very long, so while water is available during a mist cycle I'll bet the cage dries out too fast and stays dry too long for him not to lose ground before his next drink. Chams can lose a lot of body moisture through respiration if the air is very dry. Hang plastic on the back and/or sides of the cage, stuff it full of live plants, aim a humidifier at the cage and cycle it on and off to maintain at least 60% humidity.

He doesn't drink when I mist (well, when the MistKing goes off), he runs away from it. He only drinks when I give him a shower. I'll try putting the plastic up around the cage and get more plants. But will having the plastic affect air flow and cause problems too?? Just wondering.

I'll put the plastic up and run the Mistking more often/for longer. Can I use any type of humidifier, or does it need to be for animals?

 

[ajacobson]

After a shower be sure to warm him up. His temps are low. With him being sick I'd bring him up to 85. Also don't mist him or wet him late in the afternoon or in the eveing. His cage should be dried out at night for sleeping. I would not mist so often through the day either. Three times should be enough.

Three times for how long? I've been doing it more often but for only 1 minute. I bought a second bulb so i'll go check the temps to see if it brought it up.

 

[jannb]

Three times for how long? I've been doing it more often but for only 1 minute. I bought a second bulb so i'll go check the temps to see if it brought it up.

A Misk King is so fine I'd still do the 2 minutes. I hand mist and never mist Elly for two minutes.

 

[Carlton]

He doesn't drink when I mist (well, when the MistKing goes off), he runs away from it. He only drinks when I give him a shower. I'll try putting the plastic up around the cage and get more plants. But will having the plastic affect air flow and cause problems too?? Just wondering.

I'll put the plastic up and run the Mistking more often/for longer. Can I use any type of humidifier, or does it need to be for animals?

Air flow is only a problem if the cage is completely closed to any exchange (such as a solid sided terrarium with no temp gradient or ventilation). Right now you need to hydrate him until he's stable. If you don't have an accurate humidity gauge you need it. Not the cheapo stick on types...they are not accurate or reliable.

 

[kinyonga]

This chameleon is obviously ill. Rehydrating it is a good thing to do....but if you rehydrate it and you don't treat whatever is wrong with it/causing it to be so ill the chameleon is still going to die. IMHO rehydrating it is not any more important than finding out and treating whatever is making it have the sunken eyes in the first place.

 

[ajacobson]

This chameleon is obviously ill. Rehydrating it is a good thing to do....but if you rehydrate it and you don't treat whatever is wrong with it/causing it to be so ill the chameleon is still going to die. IMHO rehydrating it is not any more important than finding out and treating whatever is making it have the sunken eyes in the first place.

Yes, finding out is important. I've been to the vet TWICE and have an appointment for another visit to another vet, with still no clue. Do you have any suggestions that will help me find out what's wrong? This is the second time you've told me I should figure out what's wrong, but that's why I'm here and that's why I'm going to the vet. Unfortunately the little guy can't tell me himself what is up.


He did look much better after today's shower, he drank a lot, and I left him in the shower with all the humidity for quite a while. Eyes were open and much less sunken in, but still not eating yet.

I know that doesn't mean he's in the clear, just saying it helped at least a bit.

 

[ajacobson]

Here is a photo toward the end of his shower.

 

[kinyonga]

Are the temperatures in the low to mid 80's in the cage?