Constipation

[Bluesimon]

Hi everyone, you must be getting fed up with threads like this one, but I do need help. I have a panther chameleon who is about two and a half years old, I bought him from a pet shop ( silly me) when I bought him the shop keeper told me that he was rescued from his last owner as he neglected the chameleon. He cost me £260.00 and he was a very good weight when I bought him, this was my very first chameleon and I read up a few things when I bought him (silly me) I bought a wooden vivaruim which is 3ft high and 2.5 width and depth, now I know he should really be in a 4th high vivaruim but never mind. The temp was 85f on basking which I have now changed to 95f the bottom of the vivaruim is 77f I've installed a dripped which drips every second, the light is a 5.0 UVB which is on for twelve hours a day, I set the habistat at 68f At night but in the morning it's still 70f which is ok. Now the problem I've had with my chameleon is he is always constipated, I was feeding him large locus which I have now reduced to medium as I have read large locus can impact them, I also feed him morio worms, and sometimes mealworms but once a week as they can make him constipated. I also feed him silkworms once a week, I also feed him calci worms once a week, but his main diet is locus. I don't feed him crickets as he doesn't eat them. I've had my chameleon for seven weeks now and when I first got him he didn't poo for three weeks, but I put it down to stress ie new viv, he didn't eat for the first week, so I thought nothing of it. Then he didn't poo for two weeks after that and he went down hill in mood he stayed in the same part of the viv all day I went to get him out and he puffed up. So then two days after that I thought he was starting to shed as chameleons go of food.so I waited for another three days and thought he's just not wright so I put him into my sink filled the sink about four inches deep with warm water so his bum was submerged then I sprayed him with warm water and when I refilled the sprayer again he started pooing but first of all I thought his insides were coming out but it wasn't that, it was a very large plug mucus on the outside and like jelly on the inside with a white film around it, after he passed that very very soft poo come out which was quite a lot. After we clean him up we put him back in the viv and he was so happy walking around, I fed him the next day he only eat two medium locus. I am worried about him as he is pooing every three weeks sorry for being a bit gross about his poo but I'm trying to explain it to you guys. Have you any thoughts what's wrong with him or am I doing something wrong. He is being fed 3x a week twice a week his food is dusted with calcium and once a week with multivitamins. We were feeding him every day but it hasn't changed his bowel habits so have gone back to 3x a week I mist him with warm water twice a day.Humidity is 60 to 80.

 

[Melina]

The mucus coming out sounds like digestive issues - stop feeding him silk worms as these can be problematic and cause constipation in chams. Stick with the locusts if he won't eat crickets (making sure they are well gut load).

His humidity level is ok but how are you giving him water? Does he drink from the dripper? This may not be helping the constipation situation if he isn't getting enough water.

The white coming out with his poo is urate and as long as it stays white, it is a sign of hydration (yellow urate = dehydration).

Since he is over 2 years i wouldn't be expecting him to eat a lot - 2 medium locusts a day isn't something to be overly concerned about as long as he maintains good weight.

Hope that helps

 

[Yemen08]

The mucus coming out sounds like digestive issues - stop feeding him silk worms as these can be problematic and cause constipation in chams. Stick with the locusts if he won't eat crickets (making sure they are well gut load).

His humidity level is ok but how are you giving him water? Does he drink from the dripper? This may not be helping the constipation situation if he isn't getting enough water.

The white coming out with his poo is urate and as long as it stays white, it is a sign of hydration (yellow urate = dehydration).

Since he is over 2 years i wouldn't be expecting him to eat a lot - 2 medium locusts a day isn't something to be overly concerned about as long as he maintains good weight.

Hope that helps

I thought silk worms were supposed to be one of the best regular feeders, due to their high calcium and low fat content ?

 

[Melina]

They are nutritious but should only be offered in small amounts to vary their diet but they can cause constipation. Many chams will eat them readily as they often do with worms and then refuse to eat anything else afterwards. I think it's one of those controversial topics......

 

[Bluesimon]

Hi, he is drinking from the dripper, it's quite funny, he put the pipe in his mouth and when his finished drinking he spits the pipe out. I shall just try locus, will I stick to medium size or keep him on large. I make sure the locus are well loaded, as I put orange, spring greens, carrot in their containers, how often do you think I should feed him three times a week or every day many thanks for your comments.

 

[Texas Panther Man]

The mucus coming out sounds like digestive issues - stop feeding him silk worms as these can be problematic and cause constipation in chams. Stick with the locusts if he won't eat crickets (making sure they are well gut load).

His humidity level is ok but how are you giving him water? Does he drink from the dripper? This may not be helping the constipation situation if he isn't getting enough water.

The white coming out with his poo is urate and as long as it stays white, it is a sign of hydration (yellow urate = dehydration).

Since he is over 2 years i wouldn't be expecting him to eat a lot - 2 medium locusts a day isn't something to be overly concerned about as long as he maintains good weight.

Hope that helps

First of all how many yrs exp do you have? Because silks are a very good feeder option. Very nutritious and full of moisture. Have you ever noticed that when a cham eats one water basically shoots out!

The jelly like substance coming out with this owners chams poo. Could very well be a sperm plug! Didnt think about that now did you.

To the Op dont worry if he doesnt poop as often as a young cham will. Ive got an older Mitsio that only poops about 1x a week. Feed silks and hornworms and get his bowels moving again. Then quit feeding supers or mealworms for awhile. Substitute the horns and silks for those. Keep feeding the locusts thats a good staple. Make sure hes drinking daily. Mist mist mist. 3x a day minimum.

Give him a warm not hot shower weekly for about 20-30mins that should help him stay hydrated and often theyll poo in the shower.

If you dont know how just put a plant in the shower and aim the shower head at the wall and let the spray bounce back onto the plant.

Hope that helps your old man.....

 

[Elizadolots]

Yeah, my first thought was a sperm plug.

Bluesimon, it sounds like your chameleon is feeling much better. You might want to increase the length of time you routinely mist him. Sometimes they seem to need to be rained on for a while before they decide pooping is a good idea.

Don't worry about grossing anyone here out with discussion of poop. Sometimes you'll actually be asked to post pictures of the poop because that can provide valuable information.

 

[Texas Panther Man]

Yeah, my first thought was a sperm plug.

Bluesimon, it sounds like your chameleon is feeling much better. You might want to increase the length of time you routinely mist him. Sometimes they seem to need to be rained on for a while before they decide pooping is a good idea.

Don't worry about grossing anyone here out with discussion of poop. Sometimes you'll actually be asked to post pictures of the poop because that can provide valuable information.

Good minds/keepers think alike! lol

Sorry to the OP Ive been seeing some really suspect advice being given lately and I let my venom out on that newb.

Good luck with your old man. Sometimes the old guys are the best actually. They often will tolerate handling and stuff better than the young ones.

 

[Bluesimon]

My chameleon is feeling a lot better after his large poo lol, he's walking round a lot more and getting back to his normal self. Is it normal for him to have very runny poo as it wasn't solid at all. I know us humans have over flow when we are constipated is it the same for chameleons, shall I just feed him medium locus for the time being or bring him up to large or adult, as he was eating them before I bought him.

 

[carol5208]

yeah never heard that theory on silks causing constipation. I think a runny poo on occasion is ok depending on what they eat but if it constant everytime he goes then I would get a fecal done just to be on the safe side.

 

[Melina]

The jelly like substance coming out with this owners chams poo. Could very well be a sperm plug! Didnt think about that now did you.

.

There's no need to be nasty - i mentioned the silkworm info was controversial but it was just something I had read. I thought we were all on here to support and help each other and i apologise if you felt the information I gave was incorrect but there is something to be said for constructive criticism and not just being rude.....

 

[Elizadolots]

Well, first, the suggestion that silkworms cause constipation is one I'd never seen until your post.

Second, you did not initially suggest this was a "theory" or "something you remember reading". You stated it as fact.

It wasn't until you were called on it that you backpedaled to "controversial".

Some of the posters here are extraordinarily knowledgeable, however, the new poster--concerned about his chameleon and looking for help--really has no way of knowing who's a reliable source of information and who isn't.

While I've seen people say it's the responsibility of the person asking the question to get multiple responses and apply his/her own sense to decide, I think that we all have a responsibility to avoid stating something as "fact" unless we have some firm support for the fact we are quoting (for instance, years of experience or a link to an article or a link to a discussion here on the same issue).

As you can see by Bluismon's response to your post, he took your words as the truth. That's a big responsibility and it would behoove us all to acknowledge that and try to only post what we firmly believe to be the truth.

Note that if you think you remember reading something about...well, say that. Make sure the person asking the question understands that you are not providing what you know to be the truth but something that has a distinct possibility of being untrue.

 

[Texas Panther Man]

There's no need to be nasty - i mentioned the silkworm info was controversial but it was just something I had read. I thought we were all on here to support and help each other and i apologise if you felt the information I gave was incorrect but there is something to be said for constructive criticism and not just being rude.....

First of all thanks Eliza! Your response was thourough and to the point and I couldnt agree more with your post. Well Said.

Now on to Melina: I wasnt being nasty. I was calling you out. Your advice was suspect at best. And thats being verrrry nice. That gentleman had a cham with a fairly serious issue. And I dont care if I hurt your feelings if I saved that mans chameleon. Thats why we are on here. To HELP ppl that dont have our YEARS of exp. Ive spent countless hrs reading researching and working with pardalis, lateralis, calyptratus, and jacksonni. I have hands on exp and I feel secure in my advice and opinions. I dont comment on things I have no exp with for starters. Yes thats directed at you! Making posts and giving advice when you dont have a clue what your talking about is dangerous and callous. Quit trying to be a big shot and start reading about husbndry and feeding and gutloading, etc.... Then after you actually have a database of useful information can you start helping others.
OK, stepping off the soapbox ppl.

 

[Kent67]

To HELP ppl that dont have our YEARS of exp. Ive spent countless hrs reading researching and working with pardalis, lateralis, calyptratus, and jacksonni. I have hands on exp and I feel secure in my advice and opinions. I dont comment on things I have no exp with for starters.

I felt like you went too far, as well. From the Essential Care of Chameleons by Philippe de Vosjoli pg. 24 regarding silkworms, "We have found them problematical causing constipation and and possible impaction in some specimens. Many chameleons after feeding on them ravenously, later show signs of digestive distress and will refuse to feed on them again." I think Melina DID do her research and was passing along information from one of the best sources out there.

 

[Texas Panther Man]

Well we'll have to agree to disagree on this one Kent. I saw several other posts in other threads that person made that were questionable.

I'll stick by my advice. Silks and Horns are a usefull additional hydration resource for our animals. I also noticed where in that info on that study it stated that the animals had fed "ravenously" on silks. In my understanding of ravenously thats another way of saying they were gourging themselves. Any feeder can cause impaction if an animal is overfed and not properly hydrated.

 

[Elizadolots]

I'm not entirely sure how

Many chameleons after feeding on them ravenously, later show signs of digestive distress and will refuse to feed on them again.

Get's translated to:

stop feeding him silk worms as these can be problematic and cause constipation in chams

Gastric distress could just as easily be a case of the runs and by the quote, if they experience gastric distress they refuse the silkworms in the future (thus preventing the problem from recurring).

Note that the OP stated

I also feed him silkworms once a week

He indicates that he provide a variety of foods.

Silkworms, as part of a varied diet, are highly regarded here, are they not? If anything in the list provided is considered problematic, I would think it would be the mealworms, but even those are being offered only occasionally.

 

[Kent67]

My post was not to argue the correctness of anyone's point, but, rather, to point out that hostility towards someone who is also trying to help, HAS done research, and has their own experience was unnecessary. It was said that Melina's advice was suspect at best but that advice came directly from someone who's been keeping chameleons consistently for 30 years. Heck, maybe she even experienced problems with feeding silkworms. I am unaware of any of Melina's previous posts but I'm sure you know "releasing your venom on the newb" is not typically allowed on CF. Everyone should know that in addition to reporting spam, profanity, etc., Brad and the moderators are interested in keeping tabs on misinformation as well. If it's bad, please report it.

Play nice, everyone.

 

[Bluesimon]

hi guys i thought i would post a picture of my chameleons poo, he didnt go at all this week so i showered him again. he always has this white plug first as soon as he passes that he will poo fine so i thought i would post a picture of it to see if anyone could tell me what it is. many thanks

 

[Psychodrake]

Hey Bluesimon, nice to see you're around still. You'll need to repost the photo as it seems to be missing. Silkworms are a great feeder so don't stop them. Your chameleon is full sized so I think he can handle large locusts fine, even winged locusts, just no more than 2 a day, 3 at max.

The white plug, if it is what I think it is without a picture, is just the urate or basically solid poop. If it's white, it's healthy, if it's yellow or orange, it is not. You say white, I presume he's healthy, but we can't see the poo.

Also, on the poo being runny, Silkworms can cause this to happen as they're full of moisture as has been mentioned. If it persists on days where you don't feed Silkworms, I'd suggest a fecal examination at a vet.

That's the best advice I can give.

EDIT: He sorted it.

 

[Bluesimon]

Hi, can everyone see the picture now