Baby Jackson seems to be dying!????????

selfmade64856

New Member
Your Chameleon - Jackson - 3 weeks - born with us
Handling - hardly ever
Feeding - pinhead crickets, there are about 20 in the container at all times. The crickets are fed fresh veggies and fruit and catfood.
Supplements - we use zoo meds Reptivite and dust the crickets every 3rd day
Watering - We have a dripper and also mist at least 3 times a day? The chams drink, not sure about this one though.
Fecal Description - white and black, kind of looks like bird poop. never tested for parasites
History - It was fine a few days ago.

Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions? Screen cage 2X3X2.
Lighting - no synthetic lighting. The cage is directly in front of a window where the sun is able to shine directly into the cage.
Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps? daytime temperature is 85 degrees, night time between 75 and 80.
Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity? 70- 100 percent, dpends on the day.
Plants - bamboo and spanish moss, both live.
Placement - the cage has lots of ventilation as the wind is always blowing through our home. The cage is off the ground by about 3 feet.
Location - Where are you geographically located? We live on Oahu, Hawaii.

The baby is very lethargic. It seems to have difficulty moving. It shakes a little as it tries to move around. It has been sleeping most of the time now for a few days. It has not eaten in a couple of days.

All of the other 7 are fine, they are all energetic and very sprite.

Any suggestions? It is definitely slowly dying. I would say that it will be dead within 24 hours. Please help! :(
 

Cainschams

New Member
Your Chameleon - Jackson - 3 weeks - born with us
Handling - hardly ever
Feeding - pinhead crickets, there are about 20 in the container at all times. The crickets are fed fresh veggies and fruit and catfood.

Keep using fresh fruits and veggies but cut the catfood out altogether. Along with the fruits and veggies add a dry gut load. Sandrachameleon has good blogs on this and other topics.

https://www.chameleonforums.com/blo...y-gutload-recipe-january-2010.html#comment759

Supplements - we use zoo meds Reptivite and dust the crickets every 3rd day

I do not supplement my montane species, what your jacksons is, with multivitamin. They are prone to over supplementation. You want to try for a well balanced gut load for your feeders. I use phosphorus free calcium without D3 very lightly almost every feeding if my animals are being housed primarily outdoors. You do not want to coat the insects. If my animals are being housed indoors I supplement them with calcium with D3 no more than once a month and usually longer than that in combination with the calcium without D3


Watering - We have a dripper and also mist at least 3 times a day? The chams drink, not sure about this one though.
Fecal Description - white and black, kind of looks like bird poop. never tested for parasites

How do you know this is the poop of the one that is ill? Are they housed separately?

History - It was fine a few days ago.

They can go downhill very quickly. Babies especially.

Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions? Screen cage 2X3X2.
Lighting - no synthetic lighting. The cage is directly in front of a window where the sun is able to shine directly into the cage.

UVB rays cannot pass through glass. If you are going to house them indoors you need a reptisun 5.0 UVB tube, not coil.

Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps? daytime temperature is 85 degrees, night time between 75 and 80.

Are these the temps outside also?

Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity? 70- 100 percent, dpends on the day.

What are you measuring this with? Do you run AC? This can reduce the humidity from what it is outside.

Plants - bamboo and spanish moss, both live.
Placement - the cage has lots of ventilation as the wind is always blowing through our home. The cage is off the ground by about 3 feet.
Location - Where are you geographically located? We live on Oahu, Hawaii.

The baby is very lethargic. It seems to have difficulty moving. It shakes a little as it tries to move around. It has been sleeping most of the time now for a few days. It has not eaten in a couple of days.

All of the other 7 are fine, they are all energetic and very sprite.

Any suggestions? It is definitely slowly dying. I would say that it will be dead within 24 hours. Please help! :(

There probably isnt much you can do for the sick one but you need to change your lighting and gut loading quick so the others have a chance. The best thing for you to do is raise them outdoors. If you cannot do that at least get them some natural sun as much as possible for a few weeks and have the UVB tube for when they are inside.

Do you live where you are able to house them outside?
My replies are in red.
 

ataraxia

Avid Member
cain has given you good advice. how are you measuring your temps and could you take a pic of your cage along with therm?
 

selfmade64856

New Member
Keep using fresh fruits and veggies but cut the catfood out altogether. Along with the fruits and veggies add a dry gut load. Sandrachameleon has good blogs on this and other topics.

Ok, their diet has been changed :) What kind of dry gut load do YOU recommend?

I do not supplement my montane species, what your jacksons is, with multivitamin. They are prone to over supplementation. You want to try for a well balanced gut load for your feeders. I use phosphorus free calcium without D3 very lightly almost every feeding if my animals are being housed primarily outdoors. You do not want to coat the insects. If my animals are being housed indoors I supplement them with calcium with D3 no more than once a month and usually longer than that in combination with the calcium without D3

I will no longer dust the insects, thanks for that information. You would think that the people at the pet store would have known this instead of recommending it.

How do you know this is the poop of the one that is ill? Are they housed separately?

I have not seen the sick one eat or poo in a few days and did not know to look after him till he started acting sluggish. They are not housed separately.

They can go downhill very quickly. Babies especially.

I wish I could help him more directly. Sucks :( .

UVB rays cannot pass through glass. If you are going to house them indoors you need a reptisun 5.0 UVB tube, not coil.

All the power is out on the side of town with the pet shop. We drove down there in a rush to try an help the little one but all of the shops were closed :( .

Are these the temps outside also?

Yes, our house stays pretty much the same as outside. Maybe a degree or two of difference. It is not insulated and the windows do not close all the way so if there is a breeze (which is most of the time) then it blows right through.

What are you measuring this with? Do you run AC? This can reduce the humidity from what it is outside.

We do not have an AC, and since there is a constant draft the humidity is the same as outside, always very muggy.

There probably isnt much you can do for the sick one but you need to change your lighting and gut loading quick so the others have a chance. The best thing for you to do is raise them outdoors. If you cannot do that at least get them some natural sun as much as possible for a few weeks and have the UVB tube for when they are inside.

Do you live where you are able to house them outside?

We cannot raise them outdoors unfortunately. But We work from home so can take them outside for an hour or so daily. We are going to purchase a light for them tomorrow. I have taken your advice in and will do as you have suggested. Thank you very much for taking the time to write me.

Mahalo!
 

selfmade64856

New Member
cain has given you good advice. how are you measuring your temps and could you take a pic of your cage along with therm?
We are on Oahu which stays relatively cool all year round with an average temperature of 74 degrees. The Jacksons home habitat is about a mile and a half away from us and found a little further above sea level then we are with
a temperature difference of 10 degrees tops compared to where we live.

Inside our home the temperature fluctuates about 10 degrees throughout the day. Today was 82 degrees outside and tonight it will drop to 73. Right now it is about 74 degrees outside but it is about 78 degrees inside the house because there is a (approximately) 2 hours temperature lag from outside to in. We have two thermometers in the house. I do not have one in the cage but both are in the same area as the cage.

The babies are sleeping right now but I will take pictures of them and the cage and post it on here tomorrow morning. Probably just video it so you get a better idea of what we are working with.

I really appreciate everyone's help and am glad that this forum exists.

See you tomorrow :)!!
 
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jpm995

Member
If the ones not eating perhaph you can force feed him with a eye dropper. Much up a worm or something with a liquid to get him started until you can figure out whats wrong.
 

Cainschams

New Member
Keep using fresh fruits and veggies but cut the catfood out altogether. Along with the fruits and veggies add a dry gut load. Sandrachameleon has good blogs on this and other topics.

Ok, their diet has been changed :) What kind of dry gut load do YOU recommend?

I do not supplement my montane species, what your jacksons is, with multivitamin. They are prone to over supplementation. You want to try for a well balanced gut load for your feeders. I use phosphorus free calcium without D3 very lightly almost every feeding if my animals are being housed primarily outdoors. You do not want to coat the insects. If my animals are being housed indoors I supplement them with calcium with D3 no more than once a month and usually longer than that in combination with the calcium without D3

I will no longer dust the insects, thanks for that information. You would think that the people at the pet store would have known this instead of recommending it.

How do you know this is the poop of the one that is ill? Are they housed separately?

I have not seen the sick one eat or poo in a few days and did not know to look after him till he started acting sluggish. They are not housed separately.

They can go downhill very quickly. Babies especially.

I wish I could help him more directly. Sucks :( .

UVB rays cannot pass through glass. If you are going to house them indoors you need a reptisun 5.0 UVB tube, not coil.

All the power is out on the side of town with the pet shop. We drove down there in a rush to try an help the little one but all of the shops were closed :( .

Are these the temps outside also?

Yes, our house stays pretty much the same as outside. Maybe a degree or two of difference. It is not insulated and the windows do not close all the way so if there is a breeze (which is most of the time) then it blows right through.

What are you measuring this with? Do you run AC? This can reduce the humidity from what it is outside.

We do not have an AC, and since there is a constant draft the humidity is the same as outside, always very muggy.

There probably isnt much you can do for the sick one but you need to change your lighting and gut loading quick so the others have a chance. The best thing for you to do is raise them outdoors. If you cannot do that at least get them some natural sun as much as possible for a few weeks and have the UVB tube for when they are inside.

Do you live where you are able to house them outside?

We cannot raise them outdoors unfortunately. But We work from home so can take them outside for an hour or so daily. We are going to purchase a light for them tomorrow. I have taken your advice in and will do as you have suggested. Thank you very much for taking the time to write me.

Mahalo!

I would recommend looking at the link I provided and try to get as many as those ingredients as possible to blend up into a dry gut load. I would not buy a commercial dry gut load though. Ones like Flukers brand has hardly anything in it. I use Cricket Crack which I get from the member SSimsswiSS. Not sure if he ships to HI or not.

You want to dust the feeders still. You can use the reptivite but use it sparingly. Definitely not multiple times a month. Its really hard to give a schedule when there are so many things at play like gut loading. You DO want to use calcium without D3 at almost every feeding and calcium with D3 around once a month if the animals do not get adequate time outside.

If those are the temps outside then I dont see a huge problem with keeping them like that. Although, if you are at a lower elevation then the chams in the wild may have lower temps. Also, they can always go lower into cover which is cooler. Just watch to make sure they are not over heating.

Get them outside as much as possible. Make sure the enclosure is well planted and you do not want to put them in direct sunlight unless its cool outside. Under a shade tree where the light can filter into the cage is best. Definitely get the light and pick up the two supplements I mentioned.
 

Carlton

Chameleon Enthusiast
Most pet store staff have no clue about the proper supplementation or nutritional needs of chams. They want to sell you products they carry. Most products weren't designed with chams in mind.
 

eisentrauti

Avid Member
Can you tell us something about the condition of the mother ? How long did you keep her ? When the mother is bad condition (eg too long in stores, bad kept in Africa etc) a hole clutch can be crap wheather what you are doing to keep the juveniles alive
 

selfmade64856

New Member
I would recommend looking at the link I provided and try to get as many as those ingredients as possible to blend up into a dry gut load. I would not buy a commercial dry gut load though. Ones like Flukers brand has hardly anything in it. I use Cricket Crack which I get from the member SSimsswiSS. Not sure if he ships to HI or not.

You want to dust the feeders still. You can use the reptivite but use it sparingly. Definitely not multiple times a month. Its really hard to give a schedule when there are so many things at play like gut loading. You DO want to use calcium without D3 at almost every feeding and calcium with D3 around once a month if the animals do not get adequate time outside.

If those are the temps outside then I dont see a huge problem with keeping them like that. Although, if you are at a lower elevation then the chams in the wild may have lower temps. Also, they can always go lower into cover which is cooler. Just watch to make sure they are not over heating.

Get them outside as much as possible. Make sure the enclosure is well planted and you do not want to put them in direct sunlight unless its cool outside. Under a shade tree where the light can filter into the cage is best. Definitely get the light and pick up the two supplements I mentioned.
Ok, we are off to the pet shop again to pick up light, vitamins, dropper to force feed the weak one).

and here is the video of their enclosure:
http://youtu.be/3-o8TZH6gck

Just got back from the pet shop with the vitamins, light and mealworms......but the baby died :(
 
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Boomer7079

New Member
Oahu Pinheads

Selfmade....where they heck are you finding pinheads? I have 5 babies as of last week and havent found any pinhead crickets on this island. I am only feeding small crickets at the moment. Im on Oahu as well. Any info is appreciated thanks!
 

selfmade64856

New Member
Selfmade....where they heck are you finding pinheads? I have 5 babies as of last week and havent found any pinhead crickets on this island. I am only feeding small crickets at the moment. Im on Oahu as well. Any info is appreciated thanks!
Hi Boomer!

Yeah, the island is out most of the time. I have a steady supply of pinhead crickets if and when you need them because I breed them. I sell them for $7 for 100. I live in Waikiki. Just shoot an email to selfmade64856 at yahoo dot com. you have to make sure to put in the @yahoo.com ;)
 
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