Useless Responses - RANT

[Pure]

I find it very interesting that so many members call this thread pointless/useless yet they are posting in it..

Put your nooses down, just an observation.

 

[cushcameleon]

I just wish that as a junior member I got privileges to post albums of my cham and the ability to put pictures in the photo contests, but thats just me

 

[bbqandtinyb]

I find it very interesting that so many members call this thread pointless/useless yet they are posting in it..

Put your nooses down, just an observation.

And a very astute one at that!

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

My "favorite" are the posts like:

"I don't know what the answer is. Maybe a senior member will chime in." ***Then why are you answering the post at all?!

I have entered comments like the above on busy days, when a critical help request has gotten buried by other new threads before someone with experience found it and answered it. Sort of a way of "bumping" their cry for help back to the top of the list. Sort of like triage. I think others have done the same, which is why we see comments like this- especially in a new thread.

"The answer to your question is X. But let someone who's had experience with X chime in to tell you."

This sort of comment is often made when someone familiar with the forum sees a desperate cry for help with a problem, and has "read" about what to do with that problem, but has not actually had the hands-on experience. Often the original poster is in a panic and needs immediate help or, at least, immediate consolation, and there's nothing quite like posting an emergency need and having someone familiar with the forum respond right away. It lets the original poster know that people care and are reading their post. It also helps keep the post high on the list where it is likely to be seen sooner. I have even posted a response like that, and then PMd a senior member and given them the link to the desperate thread and asked them for help. The senior members have responded as soon as they see the PM.

These are just normal things that transpire within any healthy, caring, functional community

But, once the thread itself takes off, it's probably not really clear why an early respondee offered the incomplete advice.

 

[Pure]

Someone did that to one of my threads and I was thankful.

I believe the OP is really talking about the ones that are obviously not for that reason. But yes very good point.

 

[Chuck G]

I like chocolate.

 

[Julirs]

I like chocolate.

ME TOO! (useless response to useless post!)

 

[ChamNovice]

It does get annoying sometimes, but usually it's not to bad, and ya just read through them. It only annoys me when it's the same person on every thread I read. I know you need post counts and rep and such, but what's the big hurry to get them?? You'll get there eventually, I'm going to assume(yeah, shame on me) if you care for your chameleons like I think everyone on here does, you'll probably be sticking around with the forum for a while.... So post counts, rep, and whatever other factors there may be will come right along with it. I'm fairly new here as well(you can tell by my join date), yet I managed to get "member" status at about 20 posts. I like to think it's because I contributed something some people found useful and not by posting random "hhhmmm" posts on every thread I decide to read.

What annoys/bothers me more is when a person says(I apologize in advance if you resemble this remark) "Hi, I just got my first chameleon, it's poo is kind of orangish, and eyes are a little sunken what would cause that" then two threads down on a health topic forum they're telling people "well your cham might have a vitamin A deficiency, possibly parasites, maybe gout, or MBD", then say what meds might need to be given.

IMO, health related topics are more of an advanced topic, if you have to ask people why feces is orangish, because you just got your first chameleon then you probably don't have the experience or knowledge yourself of a particular chameleon health issue, other than just repeating what you read in another thread by someone with experience of that particular ailment.

 

[Syn]

Sandy - I was re-reading this thread this morning and I was almost going to reply with something similar. I agree with what you say. Some people are just trying to give the poster hope, to bump the thread, or try to help with what knowledge they have, but may be in doubt because this is what they read, and haven't actually done.

P.S. I loooove chocolate. Did you know chocolate raises your endorphins and endorphins make you happy? But let's let a scientist chime in with his experiences, or someone who really likes chocolate.

 

[blackbetty]

Its funny because I have been on both ends. When I FIRST joined, I was so excited to find a forum and learn as much as I could about the hobby. IN return, I posted..and posted..and posted..and posted. not only to get myself out there but to try to help others. Newbies as you say.I knew how it felt to come on get pelted with insults so I tried to be the reassuring voice. I got put down A LOT for overposting which I fully admit, I did. I was an addict to this site. Posts have nothing on status. Yes you can jump from junior to regular member which gives you some more options, like voting, but seniority comes after x amount of time on the board. I saw someone with 70 posts be a Senior member because they have been here since 2006. Also reputation points. I try to make people smile and know that there CAN be a good side, you just have to find it within yourself to see it.

Now, I am not on here as much as all my more difficult chams have passed on. I do not get on an answer if I do not know the answer 100%. I took a lot of advice that pulled me in the wrong direction and I got so overwhelmed that I think it stresses my cham out and killed him..so I make sure I do not say anything unless it has worked for me.

Now..I see some people who did exactly as I did with the "I dont know" or the "Yea, I agree" (which can be helpful in numbers I suppose or the other ones that others pointed out..Like the Senior.. Senior member doesnt mean someone has knowledge. I think thats a common misconception.. And yes, it annoys me, but I just overlook it now. I have gone to post here and there and have just exited out because my post would not contribute any worthy facts and frankly, Im sick the select few being big bad jerks around here and raggin on people for their OPINIONS. Remember, we were all new at some point..and with newness comes excitement and people are just excited about this forum so they go on a posting spree to share that excitement. It does die down. Just overlook the pointlessness and know that they have a new and growing love for the hobby and be happy that they even found the forum.

 

[Kent67]

Ok, I was going to answer a couple pms but figured I might as well address the questions here. First, these two recent things:

You'll get there eventually, I'm going to assume(yeah, shame on me) if you care for your chameleons like I think everyone on here does, you'll probably be sticking around with the forum for a while.

Nope, not at all. In the limited time I've been here I've seen a LOT of people come and go quickly. I've seen a number be very active for 6 months give or take, then they're gone. I've seen quite a number of "professional" breeders come and go during that time, too. Quite a number....

But let's let a scientist chime in with his experiences, or someone who really likes chocolate.

HA!


Ok, so, if I didn't make it clear, the issue of permission to post in the Advanced Topics sections was already recognized as a problem, prior to their creation. It was discussed. But, how do we feasibly keep out the newbie topics and responses from the "Advanced Topics" sections without creating a ton of new work for ourselves? We're just hobbyists like everyone else although we all have proven experience with chameleons and are on the site often enough to keep an eye out for problems. That's it. We aren't making money doing this.

We know that WHATEVER system we choose, some people are going to be left out and feel hurt/insulted/whatever. Sorry, but I don't want to have to make the judgement calls on people who just signed up about whether they're smart/experienced enough to post. Would you? Especially since most people only ever post a few times, never post, drop off after 2 months, etc? Should people who just signed up to the site post in the Advanced Topics sections? What if they have 2 days experience with a veiled and are posting useless things like "what a pretty cham?" I'm not at all interested in having to clean up posts like that and then hear the backlash about censorship.

How do we do it, then? These sections of the site were designed specifically for advanced topics. Health care, caging, feeding, etc really aren't "advanced" topics and there are sections for that. Also, the section's heading actually says, "For experienced keepers and genus specific discussion." Limiting posts until certain status had been reached ended up being the most reasonable thing we could come up with.

 

[Kent67]

One last thought before I go. (Believe it or not, in addition to my *cough* job here as a moderator, I am a full-time grad student with two real jobs, social commitments, and 25 reptiles to take care of) If you can't post in the advanced topics forum yet, ask a mod to move your thread there if you think it is worthy. The only problem with this, from a site standpoint, is that it needs to happen quickly so that other members continue to find it easily and also so that the search engines (google, etc) will have permanent links to the thread.

 

[eisentrauti]

I think there's one big problem espacially for beginners. When they start to ask some questions, they get a few different answers. One is from a member with 1000 + X posts (but with probably no experience beside keeping calyptratus and pardalis). The other member has only written a tenth part of number which the first member has written down. But this member doesn't really respond to every single thread on the forum. And this member has definitly some experience.
So what do you think, which advice would be accepted more ?

 

[Pure]

P.S. I loooove chocolate. Did you know chocolate raises your endorphins and endorphins make you happy? But let's let a scientist chime in with his experiences, or someone who really likes chocolate.

LOL! Studies have shown that, for a woman eating chocolate releases the same levels of endorphins as having sex. Shopping will do the this for you as well.

Women

 

[SoCaliSon]

I think there's one big problem espacially for beginners. When they start to ask some questions, they get a few different answers. One is from a member with 1000 + X posts (but with probably no experience beside keeping calyptratus and pardalis)....

So what do you think, which advice would be accepted more ?

Probably the advice that comes across in the most helpful, friendly manner.

One is from a member with 1000 + X posts (but with probably no experience beside keeping calyptratus and pardalis).

Who better to help you with a question about your Panther or Veiled? Who should they ask.. They person who thinks they are too good for a Panther or Veiled?

The other member has only written a tenth part of number which the first member has written down. But this member doesn't really respond to every single thread on the forum. And this member has definitly some experience.

And if I was looking for advice on a Panther or Veiled(Which the high percentage of members are), why would I consider "X"member, who openly refers to Veileds as "Amateur Level Lizards", I would rather listen to somebody who is just as impressed with them as I am, and is willing to offer advice in a humble friendly way.

I know of a member who always gets so upset cause people tend not to accept his advice the way he would like. He seems to think it's because of the country he is from, but in actuality his advice, and experience would be accepted a lot better here, If he were a bit more cordial with his approach. Here you don't need fancy Montane species to boost your standing in the community and create a rep for you in order to enjoy the hobby. People try to make it about status or standing to much... and it seems some places in the world base your status on what you species you keep. We are keeping Chameleons, It's an awesome hobby but where does the title below your name or status really matter? I don't think it matters at all. On this forum all it takes is a love for chameleons, any or all species, and a willingness to share your experiences in this hobby with other like minded people. Here on the forums the Rep level or member standings have NOTHING to do with what species you keep or have kept.

Here is a great Example... When Brock joined this forum the guy was offering great informative posts from day one, in a friendly respectable way. He didn't need a "Senior Member" title, or flash me a pic of some rare cham for me to be able to tell that his posts were worth reading. And he especially did not get me reading his posts by acting cocky to show how experienced he is.

 

[eisentrauti]

Fortunately you aren't vengeful, Joe

 

[Julirs]

OK-I will be serious. Joe-excellent thoughts there! I have been a member of this forum for 2 1/2 years, and to be truthful there are only a handful of people that have been truly annoying with their rampant posting. Most were young (forgive them as they are still learning) and only a few are left-and they usually get politley put "in line". They usually hang out for a few months until their interests change or they get grounded from the computer! I still enjoy this forum as much as I did in the beginning, having gone from a newbie keeper to someone that now keeps and breeds over 6 different species. My enjoyment comes from giving back what so many of the extremely experienced people have given to me. All of the advice and support has been priceless. It is a forum after all. It is what it is.

 

[SoCaliSon]

Fortunately you aren't vengeful, Joe

Have you done something for me to seek vengeance for??? I'm not sure I understand?

Benny, I know your a good guy... I hope you know that we are all just here to enjoy the hobby, and help how we can, where we can when it is needed.

Opinions will differ, but I really think it's important to keep the friendly atmosphere of the site alive, even through disagreements. No hate here.

 

[Syn]

I see a lot of misspellings in this thread.. but let an English teacher chime in with their experience...

Hey, sometimes people are trying to offer advice, it can be read the wrong way or they can just be 100% wrong. At least they are trying - it's not like they're trying to kill someone else's chameleon. If they were... you'd be able to tell. Some people just need a gentle push in the right direction.

 

[blackbetty]

I see a lot of misspellings in this thread.. but let an English teacher chime in with their experience...

Hey, sometimes people are trying to offer advice, it can be read the wrong way or they can just be 100% wrong. <b>At least they are trying - it's not like they're trying to kill someone else's chameleon</b>. If they were... you'd be able to tell. Some people just need a gentle push in the right direction.

Hence the bold *hmm, it didnt bold?).. They may not TRYING but the wrong advice can and will do this.. Ive experienced it first hand. Not saying that the advice is solely what caused Leos untimely death, but it did contribute to me trying to keep up and follow.