this is so lame

[dc2ap2]

this is a link to a vid on you tube that makes it seem un real to have and love what we all do its a shame some pepole just dont know what they are talking about as far as care but it cool as far as shiping and inporting is kinda cool to know watch it and let me know what you guys thinks http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHWPBkptEf8

 

[AndrewH]

Yea i agree he is telling people it is almost nearly impossible to keep them. Whenever people talk about how hard it is to keep a chameleon i like to think that they are comparing the amount of husbandry required for a chameleon compared to a common dog or cat. I mean once you are accustomed to the various feeders, lights, setups, clutches etc... i guess it would be looked at as alot of responsibility when most people still consider them as "just a lizard"

One of my co workers asked me to sell him or find someone to sell him a chameleon after he found out about my hobby and was looking through all of the pictures of panthers i was pulling up on the net. Considering he lives in a 1 bed bath apt with 4 other guys who still like to get wild and rowdy i advised him against it. He was offended and just looked at me saying, why not? you have 4 of them, how hard could it be?

I didnt mean to offend him but I just didnt think that would be a suitable place for a chameleon to be considering how private and shy they are.

I guess it would be better that more people believe it is hard to keep chameleons and that they are for serious hobbyists like he mentioned rather than having people think they are easy to keep, and having everyone pick one up and then learning about mbd, coccidia, being egg bound etc when it is already far too late.

Thanks alot for sharing that vid, it was really interesting to watch.

 

[ciafardo 4]

i saw that a couple of months ago that guy is a richard krainium but we are all very special people because we do what cant be done please its crap like that confuses people and misleads them it looks like it was taped in the 70s

 

[Chris Anderson]

No, that is Mike Fry, not "richard krainium". The video is outdated but it was most likely done between 6-13 years ago, not the 70s. The CiN stopped printing its newsletters around 2001/2002 if memory serves me (I'd have to look at my old newsletters for the exact date) and some of the legislation in Madagascar he talked about was in 1995. While some of the info might be a little outdated, I agree completely with 98% of what he said to be honest. It might not be the picture people want to hear but it is not untrue.

Chris

 

[dc2ap2]

mos def when i got my first veild i was wet behind the ears and thought i could not do it iv had snakes my whole life and herd nothing but bad storys about keeping the (coolest things iv ever seen in my life) and now its just part of daily life and i would never give it up. iv been skateing and snowboarding my whole life now that im a lil older i needed the thing to put me in that place and i found it its is something that only love for the true cham can bring it is a lot of work but for what we all get back its worth every sec spent (and all the cashlolololol)but we are not dif we just the something some pepole just dont give the time to see how cool it realy is

 

[Chris Anderson]

Wow, that may have been one of the most complicated things I've ever tried to read but if I understand what you said, you seem to be confused about the point of the video. No one really cares if chameleons are cool, that isn't the issue. The issue in the video was that they are not easy animals to keep in captivity, are not suitable for the majority of individuals who might want to keep them, have care requirements that are complex and that the means by which they are exported and shipped might not be in the best interest of all the individual chameleons involved in the process, not just the ones that make it to keepers in the US or Europe. The majority of what he said is completely true, regardless of whether or not chameleons are cool or if they are a grounding influence from your snowboarding/skateboarding hobby (although I really don't get what that has to do with anything).

Chris

 

[ciafardo 4]

i was joking i did not mean to offend anyone

 

[ciafardo 4]

wow chris lighten up he obviously is a kid and yes hes rite chameleon collecting is an appalling practice im in full agreement

 

[Brad]

I don't see anything wrong with the video. In fact, I should probably add a link in the conservation section.

 

[luckykarma]

I thought he was very level headed and sensitive to the animals we love. At the risk of offending a co-worker I think Andrew was right to inform the person that stress can literally kill these animals. We all know this as second nature within the hobby. Others I don't think believe it.

 

[Kent67]

Just gotta stop by to say I ditto what Chris said. Mike Fry may be old school but he's someone who's been there and done that, much more than many others. It may not be pretty, but it is reality.

 

[dc2ap2]

look chirs im not a kid im 26 and run my on comp in hamilton nj i just think guys like us get it to this couse it makes us happy real happy and yes they are the coolest thing iv ever seen and are so diff from anything in this world thats what drawls us to them
so if you think im so silly tell me why you got in to this and stay doing it and why you love this so much!!!!

 

[Chris Anderson]

You miss the point. To hell with what makes us happy if we prematurely kill all the animals we work with to make us that way. The point of the video was that not everyone can provide for chameleons in a way that makes it worth their losses. They are an animal that needs a lot of considerations before someone decides to take them on and that the processes by which they used to arrive to us were not always justifiable to the ends (making us happy). I'm not saying no one should work with them but I think too many people do who shouldn't in the first place.

Why do I do it? I work with chameleons because they fascinate me just like everyone else here. I've devoted a large part of my life over the last 12 years to improving the understanding of chameleons in captivity and in the wild at the same time. I've been very successful with some species and less then successful with quite a few as well. I now study them for a living as a biologist. I'll be the first one to say that there are far too many people with them who should not be working with chameleons but that there are people who do very well with them. Like the connotation of the video or not, he was dead on during most of it.

Chris

 

[ciafardo 4]

ok im depressed now

 

[westcoastchameleons]

Great posting Chris.

Jake

 

[dc2ap2]

i also feel this isent for everone im new to this only a year or so so i cant say what will come of the long term of all my cham but this has pushed me to learn so much about something iv never had a chance to. i wish this is something i have been doing as long as you have chris and i dont want you to think i was trying to come at you like that this is just something that im so in to i ges i do see how anyone who had one would not feel the same way

 

[beeze]

I liked the video and also agree with Chris Anderson's post above.

 

[itsaPink]

geezus, no one is completely disagreeing with chris. but there are people out there who try to take extremely good care of their chams. they research them and do everything they possibly can to keep their chams happy and healthy. so you are saying "to hell with what makes us happy" any pet in our household was never intended for people to keep as pets, humans took them from nature and breed them for captivity, as long as we try our best, its probably better than what everyone else out there is doing. chris, youve spent the last 12 years learning more about chams so you are able to teach us what we need to know to keep them healthy! you are helping everyone one of us take care of what fascinates us also! you are also learning more about these amazing creatures, im sure anyone of us would love to have your job! as taken from a previous post: "chameleon collecting is an appalling practice im in full agreement".... do you have chams?? i hope not if this is your view on this discussion!

 

[Brad]

geezus, no one is completely disagreeing with chris. but there are people out there who try to take extremely good care of their chams. they research them and do everything they possibly can to keep their chams happy and healthy. so you are saying "to hell with what makes us happy" any pet in our household was never intended for people to keep as pets, humans took them from nature and breed them for captivity, as long as we try our best, its probably better than what everyone else out there is doing. chris, youve spent the last 12 years learning more about chams so you are able to teach us what we need to know to keep them healthy! you are helping everyone one of us take care of what fascinates us also! you are also learning more about these amazing creatures, im sure anyone of us would love to have your job!

I'm not sure I fully understand your counterpoint. You may want to reread his post. He was not talking in absolutes.

as taken from a previous post: "chameleon collecting is an appalling practice im in full agreement".... do you have chams?? i hope not if this is your view on this discussion!

I assumed the original post was referring to the collection of chameleons in the wild. The video discusses the smuggling of wild chameleons and the often high mortality rates that ensue. The collection of chameleons in the wild might not always be appalling, but in some cases it most definitely is.

 

[Chris Anderson]

itsaPink, I think you need to reread my posts as you obviously misunderstood what I was saying, not to mention quoting me out of context.

Chris