Tell me the truth!!

[SweetPea]

I have a 100 watt basking light and 100 watt infared light and the uvb light I pruchased for the pet store I have dusted the crickets as I was instructed 3 times a week. The vet called it a metabolic disorder. She is not growing but she does eat and drink well. I was told by a reptile guy I should have her put to sleep but I went and got a second opinion form the vet. I think my husbandry is fine and I sorry, Heika if you think I am at fault, I feel I have done every thingI was told to do. If you check some of these post, lots of people are not will to even pay for a specialty vet visit and I have gone out of my way in every way to do right by her so your opinion does not mean a whole lot to me!!! Amy

 

[Heika]

Hi Amy,

I am not trying to hurt your feelings or to be mean. Taking an animal in as a pet is a responsibility. I don't think you went out of your way to take her to the vet.. you did what you were obligated to do as an owner. I don't care if you like my opinion or not, or if it means anything at all to you. However, investigating the reason behind a 9 month old cham's advanced MBD is not out of line. It does not mean you are a horrid owner. But, getting another cham to replace your dying one when you haven't figured out why she is dying is irresponsible. Are you over supplementing? Did you give that question any thought at all? What brand is your UVB light? What kind of fixture do you have it in? Is it going through screen? What kind of screen?

You are talking about purchasing another chameleon that you plan to keep in the exact same conditions that you kept this one in, and yet you are not looking at your husbandry practices to figure out why this one is dying. You are just willing to throw it off as the breeder's responsibility when you have owned the cham for the majority of its life.

I value my animal's lives. I learn as much as I can and take constructive criticism to keep them alive and well. Good luck to you with your new cham, Amy.

Heika

 

[SweetPea]

Yes I guess I am getting defensive because I followed all of the instructions from a vet as well as a reliable reptile store. I posted that I do use the Miner-all 3 times a week and my cage is a screen cage that I bought for the reptile store. The uv light is on the screen but withh no plastic over it. So if there is any more answers I can give you to help me figure out what went wrong that would be great. my light are 100 watts day and night and my uv's are replaced every 6 month or sooner. Belive me I don't want to have anything happen to any more chameleons I have been crying all day. I will have a hard time taking her in. I didn't mean in my last post like it was beyond my duties as the owner to take her in to the vet. I was only saying that I have done every thing I was suppose to do. I read post where someone will say "you need to get her to the vet and their resonce is I can't afford it right now" now that is irresponsible in my eyes. So I am sorry if I come across as defensive, I don't take being a pet owner lightly. Amy

 

[Heika]

I have seen those posts too, and I am glad you took her in to the vet.

One big question.. what brand of UVB light are you using? They aren't created equal.

Heika

 

[SweetPea]

To be honest I don't remember the name but it was from the good reptile guy not the pet store where I bought her. She is sleeping so tomorrow I will take it out and check it. What brand shoud I buy?

 

[Heika]

ZooMed reptisun 5.0 is considered about the best for a chameleon. There are a lot of brands out there that don't put out nearly the amount of UVB that is required to keep a chameleon healthy, although they would work for other reptiles. That is what Eric was talking about in one of his posts earlier today. There are some name brands out there that have not-so-great UVB lights for sale, and if you got one of those brands, it would not surprise me if the bulb is the source of your cham's illness.

Heika

 

[SweetPea]

I will check tomorrow If that is not what I have I will replace it tomorrow. What do you think about putting her to sleep as the vet recommened. Do you think she is in pain?

 

[Heika]

That is a tough decision, Amy. I have a hard time putting my animals to sleep, so I am probably not a good person to ask. Is she still eating and drinking? Personally, I would try the liquid calcium, change out the light, and put her back in the small cage and see if she can fight through it.

Heika

 

[Tara]

Heika...you asked about light through screen..



And I was wondering about that. I currently have my lights on top of the screen. Other than the screen that is the only thing between the light and the chams.
I have read about the glass and plastic absorbing everything before it gets to the cham, but does the screen do that as well?
My lights are in a 48" ESU Reptile Combo light so they are still at least a few inches from the screen it sets on. After reading Eric's posts and his Veiled caresheet I am checking on that to make sure the screen does not get hot enought to burn. I have seen them on the screen a few times.
In all honesty.. it is all so overwhelming...and then you get the people from the pet store selling you everything they have saying that it is exactly what your cham needs. Up until tonight I had thought my heat light and others were good too. They still may be, but I am checking in the morning once my chams are awake to be sure.
Ok, sorry to ramble. I just wanted to check that even though it is throuhg a screen, they are getting what they need from the light? It is a regular screen, like you buy at the pet store to cover an aquarium. Tara

 

[Jam]

It's hard when your pet is sick and you thought that you were doing everyething right, bc you feel so guilty, but the people here are really trying to help.
I remember when we found out about Hermie I felt HORRIBLE, bc I do feel that even though I didn't know what it had to do with my husbandry. I too thought that I was doing everything right. The only thing that I can figure out that might have been wrong was using an ESU bulb, feeding him about 10 meal worms a day (pitty bc he loved them too). And possibly dusting with calcium everyday, from what people have said here, but that one still doesn't make sense to me because he got the MBD bc he wasnt getting enough calcium. ANYWAYS, it's still something that I am considering.
My decision with hermie is that as long as he is still eating, and asking for food (we had to hand feed him for about two weeks and literally drop the worms into his open and waiting mouth), and that he is not always a stressed out dark color (he still spends a lot of time light green), that he still has a desire to live.
BUT his care has been very extensive, and we are lucky to have some very talented vets in our area -- he has splints on his legs and everything. If you want to hear more about how we ended up taking care of Herm post diagnosis let me know, and I can go into more detail about what our vet said.

 

[SweetPea]

Heika, I checked her uvb light after she woke up and it is a repta-golw 8.0 light if you think the other is better I will go today and get one. I hand fed her 2 dusted medium crickets after she was awake. I can call my vet back and have her send me calicum supplements for the mean time to she how she does I just really don't want to see her suffer.. that is my main concern.


Amy

 

[Heika]

Hi Amy,

The Exo Terra ReptiGlow light tests lower in UVB output than the ZooMed Reptisun 5.0. Depending on the type of screening that is on your cage, it is possible that a large amount of the UVB that the bulb is producing is being filtered out. For example, a reptarium filters out a lot more UVB than a cage made of more open types of screening.

Do you have the bulb in a fixture with a reflector in it? If not, a large portion of the UVB lighting isn't being directed into the cage, which could affect the level of UVB your cham is getting as well. If your fixture doesn't have a reflective backing, you can buy some aluminum tape from a hardware store and coat it. In addition, if it doesn't have a curved bevel directing light down, you can build a simple one out of flashing.

Considering the condition of your cham, you may want to get a ZooMed Reptisun 10.0 for the time being. It puts out about twice as much UVB as the Reptiglow 8.0.

Heika

 

[Heika]

And I was wondering about that. I currently have my lights on top of the screen. Other than the screen that is the only thing between the light and the chams.

Hi Tara,

Sorry, I didn't see your question! Screen filters out a portion of the UVB light that is produced by the tube. How much is filtered out depends a lot on how close the weave is. So, if a person were to use a light that doesn't put out a whole lot of UVB to start with, over a reptarium, and without a reflector in their fixture, the amount of UVB actually reaching the chameleon would be minimal.

Heika

 

[Tara]

oh the confusion..

oh my eyes! and my head! Oh the confusion!!

Ok, First..my screen holes are 3mm x 3mm. I think it's mm..is that the nest step down from cm? If so then they are 3mm x 3mm.
Also, my combo light fixture has the highly reflective white interior.

Ok, I am clear on this one......I currently have a 48" ExoTerra ReptiGlow 2.0 40watt -this one does not put off enough UVB, right? and I need to replace it with a ZooMed Reptisun 5.0, right? or should I go with a 10.0?

What I am confused about are my incandescent bulbs. I currently have the ZooMed Incandescent FullSpectrum Blue Reptile Bulbs-100watt & 25watt. I know these put out the UVA- but are they the ones that DO NOT put out ENOUGH UVA? Am I using the wrong bulbs. Someone mentioned ZooMed Reptisun bulbs...are these (round bulbs)different than what I am using- and what I SHOULd be using?
Which UVA heat bulbs are you recommending for good UVA putout?
Ok, Have I made any sense of just confused the crap out of ya? Thanks! Tara

 

[Heika]

Hi Tara,

The reptiglow 2.0 only claims to put out 2% UVB. That is a really, really small amount, and is probably being filtered out by your screen. It is used for animals that don't require high levels of UVB light to process calcium. The screen you are using isn't going to block all of the UVB, and you also have a reflector so you should be all right when you change your bulb. For regular use, a ZooMed reptisun 5.0 florescent would be fine. You might want to keep in mind that damage from MBD can start pretty quickly. You really want to replace that bulb very, very soon.

As far as the incandescent heat bulbs go.. you can use a plain ol' light bulb for your basking spot. The UVB is critical, but the UVA.. isn't. Just a light that creates a warm spot for your chams to baske in when they want to. I really like those blue ZooMed bulbs, tho. I like the light they produce, it is nice and bright. But, a regular light bulb would do the job too. With the chameleons in an aquarium, your wattages sound a little high. How warm is your tank getting?

Heika

 

[SweetPea]

hi Heika
I do have a reflecter in the uvb light so I am okay there I will ge the 10 on Sunday thanks

Amy

 

[Tara]

Thank you soooooo much for your help!

Ok, to recap...replace my UVB light with the ZooMed reptisun 5.0 florescent ASAP...I am going to go the sale I read about earlier.

As for the ZooMed blue bulbs...I am good. I too, like the bright light...now that I can find them cheaper online..I'll probably stick with those. Although the UVA is not a necessity...Eric mentioned in his veiled caresheet that it affects their mood and behavior. Since veileds already have a temperment, I think I'll stick with some UVA too

Ok, the tank and the heat. The first few days the tank stayed at mostly 80 degrees..and lower on the other side. At night I had a night light come on, but found that this kept the tank at 80 at night, so I stopped the night light.

When I inquired about the heat range for veileds, I was told that mid 90's was where it should be on one side and lower temps in the other areas. So I put the bulb I was using at night over with the day bulb to increase the day temp on that side.
I check the temps and humidity right before the lights clicked off and here are the readings....
The basking side was 80 degrees with 50% humidity (the gauges are around 8 inches below and over from the basking area-and I plan to put gauges right in the basking area very soon) I have seen the temp around 90 on this side as well a couple of times.
The other side (all the way over) was 70 degrees with 40% humidity.

The humidity is what I need to work on as well, with a humidifier. The norm right now goes from 30-50% humidity, but increases dramitically (55-65 sometimes higher) during misting.

The lights have been off for just a little while and I just went in and took a peak. The basking side is 74 degrees with 54% humidity and the other side is 74 degrees with 44% humidity.
I think they will drop after the lights have been off for a while. But I'm sure this depends too on how cool or warm my house is. If this is as low as it gets at night in the tank, maybe I should make their days a little warmer?
Ok, That's all the info, so hopefully you can tell me what I need to adjust.

Also, I put 10 crickets int he feeding dish and then added 10 more when they were gone and now they are ALL gone. I do not want to overfeed, but I don't want them to be hungry either. How much should I offer them daily...or should I only off every other day? Also, once I get the proper UVB, do I still need to sprinkle their food and how often?....oh, my head is going to explode!
Tara

 

[Tara]

oohhh noooooo...which one

I am at the BigApple Herp sale to purchase my ZooMed reptisun 5.0 florescent ...but how much wattage do I need? Do I get the 40 watt? Tara

 

[Heika]

I am at the BigApple Herp sale to purchase my ZooMed reptisun 5.0 florescent ...but how much wattage do I need? Do I get the 40 watt? Tara

Are you looking for a compact or a regular florescent? If you need a regular florescent, just a measurement of the one you need is fine. Basically, does your fixture accept an 18", 24", 36" or 48" bulb? What is the length of your current bulb? Whatever it is, that is the length you need.

Heika

 

[Tara]

Mine is a 48" bulb

Thanks, I knew I needed a 48" bulb...but I had thought that there were different wattages in them like regular round bulbs. You know like 25, 40, 75 and 100 watt., but so far I only see the 48" in a 40 watt.