reyesjoshuacruz
Established Member
hey knighty, can you post some linke to good forums that arent american?
Substrate
- Thread starter knighty
- Start date
david sullivan
New Member
well guys I will do what is best for this place, i am sorry for saying what I did and i will remove myself from this site.
Thanks for the help with my cam, I have to say that everything i have learned here was helpful but I have a bit more to do with my time then talk about reptiles all day, my girlfriend thinks I am crazy enough for being on this as Much as I am.
Thanks for the help with my cam, I have to say that everything i have learned here was helpful but I have a bit more to do with my time then talk about reptiles all day, my girlfriend thinks I am crazy enough for being on this as Much as I am.
alright, there is really no need for this. Let's be men and leave this alone. The forum is here for us to exchange thoughts and ideas, not to bash other people's opinions and say you're wrong and im right. If we arent open minded, then we arent contributing to nor gaining from the community.
knighty
New Member
i am here as i was hopping people may have been wrong about usa forums, obviously not.
it was hard to take that appology sincerley, with all your newfound wit and sarcasm, and to be honest dont care if you are sorry or not...
my point about being a robot is that you were making out that i should just take what they say and do it, when to be honest i am not totaly sure it is right. you said your self your cham ingested some bark and is he still here? because i was told 1 bit and hes a gonna.... seems not.
i am not claiming to be a genius however i do have a fair amount of knowledge and i am admitidly an out spoken person and i am not scared or affraid to express my views or points, especialy when some one fires me up as you did. i have full control over my anger, i chose to let it go, as i found your comments arrogant and offensive. i do apologise to any children, but to be honest if they are old enough to be on a forum and own a cham im sure it is nothing they have not herd before, and pluss to know the word is offensive they have to know what it means.
i think people are to quick to take what they are told without questioning the reasons as to why. if you do not question what you are told how are you to know its right. nothing should be taken as fact/gosspel without proof.
it was hard to take that appology sincerley, with all your newfound wit and sarcasm, and to be honest dont care if you are sorry or not...
my point about being a robot is that you were making out that i should just take what they say and do it, when to be honest i am not totaly sure it is right. you said your self your cham ingested some bark and is he still here? because i was told 1 bit and hes a gonna.... seems not.
i am not claiming to be a genius however i do have a fair amount of knowledge and i am admitidly an out spoken person and i am not scared or affraid to express my views or points, especialy when some one fires me up as you did. i have full control over my anger, i chose to let it go, as i found your comments arrogant and offensive. i do apologise to any children, but to be honest if they are old enough to be on a forum and own a cham im sure it is nothing they have not herd before, and pluss to know the word is offensive they have to know what it means.
i think people are to quick to take what they are told without questioning the reasons as to why. if you do not question what you are told how are you to know its right. nothing should be taken as fact/gosspel without proof.
knighty
New Member
sorry meatslim i must of been typing as you posted.....
i am done with it know, if he feels the need to carry on thats up to him, but i will not be openly replying.....
sorry meat
i will post links to UK forums when i feel they are not going to make our forums turn out as this one has... 1 thread and its a row already!
i am done with it know, if he feels the need to carry on thats up to him, but i will not be openly replying.....
sorry meat
i will post links to UK forums when i feel they are not going to make our forums turn out as this one has... 1 thread and its a row already!
knighty
New Member
have no problem with debates, we can all learn from a good discution.
unfortunatly we may all have to except we are doing something wrong from time to time, but how will we know if we are doing something wrong without threads like theese. i am not saying that any one is doing wrong, i just feel there is a good case for both sides.
lets face it a big advantage of using towels is it does not cost about 28 dollars every 2 months to keep clean, but i dont think anyone can say that it looks as natural as bark....
unfortunatly we may all have to except we are doing something wrong from time to time, but how will we know if we are doing something wrong without threads like theese. i am not saying that any one is doing wrong, i just feel there is a good case for both sides.
lets face it a big advantage of using towels is it does not cost about 28 dollars every 2 months to keep clean, but i dont think anyone can say that it looks as natural as bark....
knighty:
I am sorry you don't like American forums. I have to say that I am very offended by some of your rude comments. I had to delete one of your posts due to poor language. Some of our most long term members are from the UK and we greatly value their participation and incite.
I believe you should review Dave Weldon's post. He explains the reason why most people generally recommend against substrate. These are real concerns. However, there are times when substrate is used and there are members who use it in all their enclosures. The general consensus you see in this forum especially benefits people new to chameleons who want to avoid as many problems as possible.
I am sorry you don't like American forums. I have to say that I am very offended by some of your rude comments. I had to delete one of your posts due to poor language. Some of our most long term members are from the UK and we greatly value their participation and incite.
I believe you should review Dave Weldon's post. He explains the reason why most people generally recommend against substrate. These are real concerns. However, there are times when substrate is used and there are members who use it in all their enclosures. The general consensus you see in this forum especially benefits people new to chameleons who want to avoid as many problems as possible.
nightcrawler
Avid Member
if one wants to keep ones cham in as natural like enviroment as possible,
wouldent one use no cage? a cage to me is more unnatural then substrate.
also i dont think i seen any americans saying anything rude on here,
correct me if im wrong but they were from UK, and canada.
us americans always get the rude role.
wouldent one use no cage? a cage to me is more unnatural then substrate.
also i dont think i seen any americans saying anything rude on here,
correct me if im wrong but they were from UK, and canada.
us americans always get the rude role.
CammieNLeno
New Member
I don't see this going anywhere positive at all.
It seems to me you actually have a bigger problem with Americans than the said husbandry techniques. I was a bit taken back with how open and upfront with your choice of words you were to some of the senior members of this wonderful community. These guys are on here by their own will to help new owners out, and have saved countless number of chameleons by correcting poor husbandry techniques.
I feel very sorry for you Mr. Knight, it seems you are a very upset individual.
knighty
New Member
i think people are seeing this the wrong way, i started a discution and it was fine untill a member had a pop at me, as soon as i take a dig back it is me in the wrong which i see as unfair. why should i have to take digs?
people are talking as if everyone is doing me a favour, when infact there have only beena few (who i would like to thank) that have actaully put in to the disscution, everyone else has been more interested in the dissagreement that started with me and mr sullivan than the substrate issue and to be honest it is no one elses bussiness...
i have no problem with the american people, i have visited the states 2 times now, and of all the contrys i have been to i have found the americans the most polite and helpfull. In my life i have no reason to be upset other than people judging me when they know nothing about me, and to be honest people are not looking like they are willing to give me a chance!
what has happened in this thread is what people have warned me about, i was hoping they may be wrong but there is a very hostile atmospher which is a shame as i think disscutions on how chams are kept in different parts of the world can be very helpfull and intersting to us all...
people are talking as if everyone is doing me a favour, when infact there have only beena few (who i would like to thank) that have actaully put in to the disscution, everyone else has been more interested in the dissagreement that started with me and mr sullivan than the substrate issue and to be honest it is no one elses bussiness...
i have no problem with the american people, i have visited the states 2 times now, and of all the contrys i have been to i have found the americans the most polite and helpfull. In my life i have no reason to be upset other than people judging me when they know nothing about me, and to be honest people are not looking like they are willing to give me a chance!
what has happened in this thread is what people have warned me about, i was hoping they may be wrong but there is a very hostile atmospher which is a shame as i think disscutions on how chams are kept in different parts of the world can be very helpfull and intersting to us all...
nightcrawler
Avid Member
ive only seen hostility, like in this thread, maybe three or four times on this site.
reyesjoshuacruz
Established Member
People on this forum are as you say. That’s the bottom line, vie experienced it many times. But when it comes down to it most are just playing the necessary evil roll.
For example. Anyone that’s asks here if they should use a waterfall they are told no.
Everyone single one is told NO! Big NO. and they are right in doing so. it is fine to use a waterfall in your enclosure and most know it, but there are things that go along with it, like cleaning, bact, ect.....
so they are playing the necessary evil role
is it ok to use a water fall? yes.
is it ok to go around recommending one? no, because the wrong people will use it.
is it ok to use substrate? YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
is it ok to go around and say its ok? no!!!!!!!!!! because not everyone can maintain it properly!
Necessary evil. its annoying, but if i wasnt told no right away when i asked about substrate or waterfalls i would have killed my chams prob. Now that im up to speed, i use both with no problems. But I still won’t recommend using them
For example. Anyone that’s asks here if they should use a waterfall they are told no.
Everyone single one is told NO! Big NO. and they are right in doing so. it is fine to use a waterfall in your enclosure and most know it, but there are things that go along with it, like cleaning, bact, ect.....
so they are playing the necessary evil role
is it ok to use a water fall? yes.
is it ok to go around recommending one? no, because the wrong people will use it.
is it ok to use substrate? YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
is it ok to go around and say its ok? no!!!!!!!!!! because not everyone can maintain it properly!
Necessary evil. its annoying, but if i wasnt told no right away when i asked about substrate or waterfalls i would have killed my chams prob. Now that im up to speed, i use both with no problems. But I still won’t recommend using them
knighty
New Member
that is not bad considering the amount of posts that have been totaled up, i am just dissapointed that it has happened on the first one i started...
i have not come to this forum to try and cause trouble or fall out with anyone, i just want to have good descutions about subjects that i think are still unproven and maybe together we can come up with some good ideas to bring husbandary up to date...
just dont want to be judged when people do not know me, surely every one can appriciate that...
reyesjoshuacruz, i appriciate your post and im glad its not just me. i do understand the need be carfull what you recomend to people, but is it not better to provide the arguments for using and not using and then helpping people in what they decide to do?
i have not come to this forum to try and cause trouble or fall out with anyone, i just want to have good descutions about subjects that i think are still unproven and maybe together we can come up with some good ideas to bring husbandary up to date...
just dont want to be judged when people do not know me, surely every one can appriciate that...
reyesjoshuacruz, i appriciate your post and im glad its not just me. i do understand the need be carfull what you recomend to people, but is it not better to provide the arguments for using and not using and then helpping people in what they decide to do?
reyes, i see your point. I think after these years, I've forgotten that what it was like first starting out with herps. Its definitely true that in the beginning you dont realize certain issues and it is safer to just follow the norm. Over time in this particular hobby (which I am still relatively new) or any other (speaking about those of which I am experienced), you tend to realize the 'why' behind the norm, which allows you to experiment with the 'why' in mind.
reyesjoshuacruz
Established Member
Its amazing how some members are soo irational and ignorant sometimes.
look up the thread " chameleon on a leash "
then look at this thread
https://www.chameleonforums.com/please-identify-10984/
another example of what i think our problem is with the members of this forum.
I asked a question and i got torn up!!!! on the chameleon on a leash thread.
but then i see the F. Labordi thread and am soooo puzzled. They went off on me without even actually reading my post it seems, because it was sooooo insane and twisted to try it, but someone lets us know that they have two reason special chameleons that more than any species need to be released back into the wild and not one person flames him? thats a little perverse to me but oh well, GO CHAMELEON FORUM MEMBERS!!!!!!!!!!!!
wow i almost never came back to this forum that day after chameleon on a leash. i realized that excellent cham keepers dont equall excellent teaching skills, or social skills. and you have to be pretty sad to go off on someone over a bad move, but give quite the opposite reaction to someone who uses a waterfall that had a pic of a cham on it. tisk tisk tisk
I couldnt beleive how ignorant some of the replies i got on that thread were. People taking personal attacks on me thinking i had some imature selfish reason to put a leash on a cham???? but there are alot of amazing members on here. so i now take the good with the bad, and keep track of whos to be avoided at all cost.
look up the thread " chameleon on a leash "
then look at this thread
https://www.chameleonforums.com/please-identify-10984/
another example of what i think our problem is with the members of this forum.
I asked a question and i got torn up!!!! on the chameleon on a leash thread.
but then i see the F. Labordi thread and am soooo puzzled. They went off on me without even actually reading my post it seems, because it was sooooo insane and twisted to try it, but someone lets us know that they have two reason special chameleons that more than any species need to be released back into the wild and not one person flames him? thats a little perverse to me but oh well, GO CHAMELEON FORUM MEMBERS!!!!!!!!!!!!
wow i almost never came back to this forum that day after chameleon on a leash. i realized that excellent cham keepers dont equall excellent teaching skills, or social skills. and you have to be pretty sad to go off on someone over a bad move, but give quite the opposite reaction to someone who uses a waterfall that had a pic of a cham on it. tisk tisk tisk
I couldnt beleive how ignorant some of the replies i got on that thread were. People taking personal attacks on me thinking i had some imature selfish reason to put a leash on a cham???? but there are alot of amazing members on here. so i now take the good with the bad, and keep track of whos to be avoided at all cost.
Julirs
New Member
I think it should be clearly understood that this is a forum of people that are passionate about chameleons. Sometimes things come across as attacks that really are not meant to be. It certainly would be better if someone had said, "I think the leash would really stress out your chameleon." I got very upset at someone who was letting their cham walk on their cats back and I probably wasn't nice at all.
What could anyone do about the Please identify? The person in a foreign country did not even know that he had gotten a banned cham on the black market.
What could anyone do about the Please identify? The person in a foreign country did not even know that he had gotten a banned cham on the black market.
