Quarantine those show animals!!

[luckykarma]

Make sure you quarantine those show animals. We got one from a reputable breeder and when I did a fecal it was loaded with coccidia. Another friend who bought at the show brought a sample and we found coccidia as well.

So make sure you keep the new animals quarantined until you know they're clean. Get a fecal instead of being sorry you infected your whole colony.

 

[Jeweledchameleons]

I second this.
You could lose everything you've got very quickly!
even having people handle your animals will transfer
some VERY NASTY bugs, established breeders are not immune!
and DON'T forget to wash your hands!!!!

Word to the wise, BLEACH is your best friend!

 

[luckykarma]

For what I understand bleach will not kill coccidia. There's been many posts on this. The latest thinking is that Hydrogen Peroxide at 20% by volume or greater is supposed to be effective for cleaning. A lot easier than ammonia which has been what's been recommended in the past. Some are having luck with steam cleaners.

I really want to stress that even though its a drag to have the expense of a fecal done its worth it for the long term health of your new animals as well as your others. Dealing with parasites or worms with one quarantined animal is a lot easier than have a widespread outbreak. I know unfortunately. It took six months and many vet bills to get rid of every trace of coccidia when I got an animal that was infected. Even though I had a fecal done right away somehow I didn't take every last fanatical precaution and it spread to other chams.

Wear gloves at all times handling suspect new animals. Even when you move the cage or do something inside the cage wear gloves. Throw them away each time in a bag you can seal and take to the trash can.

The vet who gave the lecture on parasites recommend DAILY cleaning of the cages if there is coccidia. That's how serious the chance of reinfection or chance of spreading is.

The good news is there's a growing acceptance of panazuril which is suppose to be extraordinarily easy on the animals and its two treatment one week and two the following and its gone. Panazuril is coccidicidal whereas Albon will only knock it down and is very harmful to the liver if the animal isn't very well hydrated during its use.

I spoke to Dr. Stein here in Los Angeles and he seems open to getting it and prescribing it. In case locals need to get their animals treated.

 

[Dave Weldon]

Howdy All,

We're hoping to hear of good results with ponazuril and chameleons. It was timely to have Dr. Funk, from Arizona, lecturing about parasite (coccidia among others) treatments at the Anaheim Reptile show this weekend . I would have tried it sooner if more vets had made it available . At $300-$500 for the standard horse-sized dose, most vets don't carry it or just plain don't bother with it. But more and more reptile vets are recognizing it as an effective coccidicidal (kills) rather than just coccidiostatic (suppress) treatment so I think it will become more mainstream. I have a friend who was prescribed it for her bearded dragon. I think the diluted amount to treat a dragon was only something like $20-$40. Another coccidicidal drug that is available overseas is Baycox (Toltrazuril). It might be available in Canada but I recall something about it not being "blessed" for the usual application - pig farms. Those of you in Europe etc. may be able to easily get either of these drugs. Just be sure that you have the proper dosing. It isn't as easy to avoid overdosing as with something like Appertex (Clazuril) but it may clear coccidia even faster.

 

[dodolah]

I am a thinking to get clazuril or panazuril real soon.
I have a feeling that my veiled might get reinfected after the albon therapy long time ago .
Is Panazuril or the other -il med mentioned a prescription only?

I cannot administer him via force feeding. He is way to sensitive over that mehod.
I will have to use hornworms as the medium.

 

[Jam]

Ponazuril (bayer trade name Marquis) was originally developed for an equine parasitic disease (caused by a protozoan, Sarcocystis neurona) that affects the central nervous system (the disease is referred to as equine protozoal myeloencephalitis or EPM). Baytril is the "canadian" version although it is illegal to transport it to the US. Some people (mainly horse owners) have done so, but have been advised to do so at their own risk, and not do so in a car they would like to keep. As far as horses go there is really no advantage to using Baytril, but some people prefer to because it was what they used prior to the advent of Marquis.

In the horse world the cheapest that you can get it for is about $175 a tube (lasting a horse one week ... I don't know the breakdown but obviously it would last a cham much longer) and the price has gone up recently. I don't know if it has been looked at for safety in chameleons, but in horses is associated with very few side-effects and considered to be the safest drug for EPM. It is a cidal (so it flat out kills the parasites) although in horses requires a minimum of a 28 day treatment because it targets a specific stage in the life cycle of the protozoan which not all of them will be at at the same time.

For whatever it's worht ... obviously horses' are quite different than chams.

jamie

 

[Jam]

yes ponazuril and baytril both require Rxs. (unless you can find them on the black market ... yes one does exist).

Ponazuril has been shown to be effective when given with food in horses (some other anti-protozoal drugs require an empty stomach)

Jamie

 

[luckykarma]

Several vets to my understanding are using it including Dr. Funk who gave the lecture. I spoke to him today.

Remember almost all our drugs come from the livestock area. Panacur anyone? There just isn't enough demand/profit for people to develop drugs specifically for Chams.

 

[Dave Weldon]

Ponazuril (bayer trade name Marquis)... ...Baytril is the "canadian" version although it is illegal to transport it to the US...

Howdy Jamie,

When you mentioned Baytril did you mean Baycox (Toltrazuril)?

 

[Jam]

yes!! Thank you for catching that ... I did mean baycox... apparently my brain went to sleep before my fingers were ready to stop typing.

jamie

 

[Chameleons Canada]

So Ponazuril and Baycox (Toltrazuril) are the same thing?

 

[luckykarma]

Brand name in Canada I believe is Marquis. Toltrazuril sulfone according to a web search.

 

[Chameleons Canada]

Well, funny, because what I found is Marquis = Ponazuril. And another different drug is Baycox, which is Toltrazuril. Also Dave Weldon refers to them as two different drugs i other posts.

This is what my vet sent me:

"toltrazuril" sold under the name Baycox - it is metabolized to ponazuril

I have also read on the net that Toltrazuril its even better that Ponazuril, but a bit less frgiving if dose is not athe right one (that's why I want to make a looot of research before treating my Faly)

Thanks for your help, much appreciated.

 

[luckykarma]

I recall Dave discussing that. Yes, I believe you do have to be cautious on getting the proper dosage with that drug

 

[Chameleons Canada]

In the other hand, do you think coccidia could be harmless? or just part of their normal intestinal fauna? my guy is doing well, eating drinking and gaining weight. I am trying to decide if I don't get Ponazuril if I just let him alone.

 

[luckykarma]

If you've done your research the answer is no.

Coccidia reproduces by exploding out of the intestinal wall. Eventually the intestines will become so scarred from all this the animal will die because the function of the intestine - nutrients, etc absorption will be destroyed.

 

[dodolah]

In severe infestation, the intestine wall might rupture... so, yeah, try to treat it. Coccidia essentially is a ticking time bomb. It waits until your chameleon's immune system can no longer handle it.. and boom!