Veiled Cham101
New Member
And here's two. Better? Can't figure out how to enlarge photos, yet on my computer screen they are three times bigger.
Please See!
- Thread starter Veiled Cham101
- Start date
And here's two. Better? Can't figure out how to enlarge photos, yet on my computer screen they are three times bigger.
D
DavidBuchan
Guest
Those pictures do look clearer. I have to say it looks like he has quite advanced MBD and you really should get him to a vet asap. It is treatable, and he can have a long healthy life, but his legs are not normal like that.
Veiled Cham101
New Member
How should his legs look then?
Veiled Cham101
New Member
How is it cured?
Veiled Cham101
New Member
How could he've gotten this?
lindawaz
New Member
not enough calcium is a key player.
here is a link to a veild Cham in the photo section of the forum
you can see the straight legs each joint and belly off ground.
https://www.chameleonforums.com/veiled-growth-68432/
5th post 1st picture
7th post too
Post 37 on your thread tells about MBD they gave you a bunch of links
here is a link to a veild Cham in the photo section of the forum
you can see the straight legs each joint and belly off ground.
https://www.chameleonforums.com/veiled-growth-68432/
5th post 1st picture
7th post too
Post 37 on your thread tells about MBD they gave you a bunch of links
Last edited:
jessica
Avid Member
I put links in a previous post for you about mbd though it cannot be cured it can be treated
Olimpia
Biologist & Ecologist
Well, it can't be cured but it can be halted. What it is is a lack of calcium in the body (usually due to a diet poor in calcium and a lack of calcium supplementation), which causes the body to pull calcium out of the bones. Calcium is used to do nearly everything in the body, not just to make bones and eggs, but also to drive action potentials in cells that cause muscle contractions (limbs to move) and your heart to beat rhythmically. So when there isn't enough calcium free in the body to run these cellular processes, the body will steal it from the bones.
So what you have here with Metabolic Bone Disease are bones that have been really debilitated and malformed due to lack of calcium. The bones kept growing however they could even though they didn't have enough Calcium to do it normally.
So while it can't be cured and reversed, it can be halted. So what he needs now is lots of good calcium supplementation.
I highly recommend going to a vet who can help you out as far as telling you how much liquid calcium to provide in the diet.
I also highly recommend buying butter worms and/or phoenix worms online, because they are high calcium feeders. And get him on powdered calcium every day when he eats. This should all help get him calcium levels back to a point where his body isn't stealing it from his bones to survive.
So what you have here with Metabolic Bone Disease are bones that have been really debilitated and malformed due to lack of calcium. The bones kept growing however they could even though they didn't have enough Calcium to do it normally.
So while it can't be cured and reversed, it can be halted. So what he needs now is lots of good calcium supplementation.
I highly recommend going to a vet who can help you out as far as telling you how much liquid calcium to provide in the diet.
I also highly recommend buying butter worms and/or phoenix worms online, because they are high calcium feeders. And get him on powdered calcium every day when he eats. This should all help get him calcium levels back to a point where his body isn't stealing it from his bones to survive.
Veiled Cham101
New Member
If I gut-load the animals I feed him, dust them with vitamins, and put him in the sun all day....is that the treatment.
D
DavidBuchan
Guest
Basically, yes, but your guy needs extra help because he has missed so much calcium. A vet really is his best chance.
You said..."If I gut-load the animals I feed him, dust them with vitamins, and put him in the sun all day....is that the treatment. "...not quite. Since he has been lacking calcium and UVB light you need to make sure he gets extra calcium in addition to putting him in the sun. You can buy a liquid calcium sandoz or calcium gluconate at the pharmacy and give it some of that...but you need to be careful that he doesn't aspirate it. Its syrupy and needs to be given a little at a time so the chameleon can deal with swallowing it without getting it in its lungs.
However, the quickest way to correct it and to prevent any more damage from occurring is to take it to a vet and get the vet to give it shots of calcium until its blood calcium levels are high enough that it can be given a shot of calcitonin. The calcitonin draws the calcium back into the bones rapidly.
Here's some information I hope will help you with things like supplements, gutloading, etc....
Appropriate cage temperatures aid in digestion and thus play a part indirectly in nutrient absorption.
Exposure to UVB from either direct sunlight or a proper UVB light allows the chameleon to produce D3 so that it can use the calcium in its system to make/keep the bones strong and be used in other systems in the chameleon as well. The UVB should not pass through glass or plastic no matter whether its from the sun or the UVB light. The most often recommended UVB light is the long linear fluorescent Repti-sun 5.0 tube light. Some of the compacts, spirals and tube lights have caused health issues, but so far there have been no bad reports against this one.
A wide variety of insects (crickets, locusts, silkworms, superworms, tomato worms, phoenix worms, butter worms, once in a while waxworms, etc.) that have been well fed and gutloaded should be fed to it.
Since many of the feeder insects we use in captivity have a poor ratio of calcium to phosphorus in them, its important to dust the insects just before you feed them to the chameleon at most feedings with a phos.-free calcium powder to help make up for it. (I use Rep-cal phosphorus-free calcium).
If you also dust twice a month with a phos.-free calcium/D3 powder it will ensure that your chameleon gets some D3 without overdoing it. It leaves the chameleon to produce the rest of what it needs through its exposure to the UVB light. D3 from supplements can build up in the system but D3 produced from exposure to UVB shouldn't as long as the chameleon can move in and out of it. (I use Rep-cal phos.-free calcium/D3).
Dusting twice a month as well with a vitamin powder that contains a beta carotene (prOformed) source of vitamin A will ensure that the chameleon gets some vitamins without the danger of overdosing the vitamin A. PrEformed sources of vitamin A can build up in the system and may prevent the D3 from doing its job and push the chameleon towards MBD. However, there is controversy as to whether all/any chameleons can convert the beta carotene and so some people give some prEformed vitamin A once in a while. (I use herptivite which has beta carotene.)
Gutloading/feeding the insects well helps to provide what the chameleon needs. I gutload crickets, roaches, locusts, superworms, etc. with an assortment of greens (dandelions, kale, collards, endive, escarole, mustard greens, etc.) and veggies (carrots, squash, sweet potato, sweet red pepper, zucchini, etc.)
Calcium, phos., D3 and vitamin A are important players in bone health and other systems in the chameleon (muscles, etc.) and they need to be in balance. When trying to balance them, you need to look at the supplements, what you feed the insects and what you feed the chameleon.
Please note that various supplements have various amounts of D3 and vitamin A and so some can be given more often than others. The idea still is not to overdo the fat soluble vitamins like D3 and prEformed vitamin A.
Here are some good sites for you to read too...
http://chameleonnews.com/07FebWheelock.html
http://web.archive.org/web/200605020...Vitamin.A.html
http://web.archive.org/web/200406080...d.Calcium.html
http://www.uvguide.co.uk/
http://web.archive.org/web/200601140...ww.adcham.com/
If you can't access the sites above that have the word "archive" in you can do it through the WayBackMachine.
However, the quickest way to correct it and to prevent any more damage from occurring is to take it to a vet and get the vet to give it shots of calcium until its blood calcium levels are high enough that it can be given a shot of calcitonin. The calcitonin draws the calcium back into the bones rapidly.
Here's some information I hope will help you with things like supplements, gutloading, etc....
Appropriate cage temperatures aid in digestion and thus play a part indirectly in nutrient absorption.
Exposure to UVB from either direct sunlight or a proper UVB light allows the chameleon to produce D3 so that it can use the calcium in its system to make/keep the bones strong and be used in other systems in the chameleon as well. The UVB should not pass through glass or plastic no matter whether its from the sun or the UVB light. The most often recommended UVB light is the long linear fluorescent Repti-sun 5.0 tube light. Some of the compacts, spirals and tube lights have caused health issues, but so far there have been no bad reports against this one.
A wide variety of insects (crickets, locusts, silkworms, superworms, tomato worms, phoenix worms, butter worms, once in a while waxworms, etc.) that have been well fed and gutloaded should be fed to it.
Since many of the feeder insects we use in captivity have a poor ratio of calcium to phosphorus in them, its important to dust the insects just before you feed them to the chameleon at most feedings with a phos.-free calcium powder to help make up for it. (I use Rep-cal phosphorus-free calcium).
If you also dust twice a month with a phos.-free calcium/D3 powder it will ensure that your chameleon gets some D3 without overdoing it. It leaves the chameleon to produce the rest of what it needs through its exposure to the UVB light. D3 from supplements can build up in the system but D3 produced from exposure to UVB shouldn't as long as the chameleon can move in and out of it. (I use Rep-cal phos.-free calcium/D3).
Dusting twice a month as well with a vitamin powder that contains a beta carotene (prOformed) source of vitamin A will ensure that the chameleon gets some vitamins without the danger of overdosing the vitamin A. PrEformed sources of vitamin A can build up in the system and may prevent the D3 from doing its job and push the chameleon towards MBD. However, there is controversy as to whether all/any chameleons can convert the beta carotene and so some people give some prEformed vitamin A once in a while. (I use herptivite which has beta carotene.)
Gutloading/feeding the insects well helps to provide what the chameleon needs. I gutload crickets, roaches, locusts, superworms, etc. with an assortment of greens (dandelions, kale, collards, endive, escarole, mustard greens, etc.) and veggies (carrots, squash, sweet potato, sweet red pepper, zucchini, etc.)
Calcium, phos., D3 and vitamin A are important players in bone health and other systems in the chameleon (muscles, etc.) and they need to be in balance. When trying to balance them, you need to look at the supplements, what you feed the insects and what you feed the chameleon.
Please note that various supplements have various amounts of D3 and vitamin A and so some can be given more often than others. The idea still is not to overdo the fat soluble vitamins like D3 and prEformed vitamin A.
Here are some good sites for you to read too...
http://chameleonnews.com/07FebWheelock.html
http://web.archive.org/web/200605020...Vitamin.A.html
http://web.archive.org/web/200406080...d.Calcium.html
http://www.uvguide.co.uk/
http://web.archive.org/web/200601140...ww.adcham.com/
If you can't access the sites above that have the word "archive" in you can do it through the WayBackMachine.
Veiled Cham101
New Member
K, ill get him to vet asap
