Neurolocially Damaged Veil

[KRobix]

Hey all. I just rescued a (believed to be) 2 year old male Veil. He was surrendered and my fiance and I adopted him March 9th. We were informed of the issues and why he was brought in. He was lethargic. Wouldn't eat and was INFESTED with parasites. He was Vet treated and cleared of all issues except one.... the poor fella has a shake when he reaches for anything. They said he had the shake from day one when he was surrendered and after treatment he still has it. I'm not an expert and still fairly new to being a Chameleon Momma but I feel like the parasites may have caused Neurological damage.

I have a few questions.

1. Is is possible for that type of damage to happen due to parasites.

2.what's my best options for cage builds. I have some ideas. But I'm always open to corrections and more ideas. I know he he's basically catch hammocks if he falls. Lots of branches and plants closer together than your would normally.

I guess in a way I'm looking for info to build a handycappable enclosure for Neuro. (My Veil)

Please help. I just want this guy to live the rest of his BEST LIFE!!!!

I put his picture below. Hes such the sweetest little guy. I wish I could hold and love him like a baby!! (I wont...but I will wish I can. Lol)

 

[kinyonga]

The chameleon either has or has had MBD.

If he wasn’t treated for it, then he should be able to recover from it if he’s treated now. That is likely the reason for the shaking.

Do you know anything about how he was kept before you got him? The information that would be most useful is what I’m asking in the rest of this paragraph. What supplements are you using for him now and how often and how heavily for each? I’m particularly looking for phos, calcium, D3 and the form of vitamin A . What UVB light are you using..brand? long linear? 5.0 Reptisun or 6 Arcadia? What do you feed/gut load the insects with?

 

[kinyonga]

To correct/stop the progression of the MBD…
The husbandry has to be correct.
In particular, the supplements, feeding/gutloading of the insects, UVB lighting, etc have to be corrected to bring things back into a balance and then correct husbandry must be maintained to keep it from coming back again.

Remember…I’m not a vet, I just speak from what I’ve learned along the way.

You will need to provide a liquid calcium sandoz to ensure that the chameleon gets enough calcium to make its bones and muscles strong, etc. A veterinarian can tell you how much per dose and how often.

The calcium needs vitamin D3 to help it get into the bones and muscles, etc and make them strong again. This D3 either comes from the chameleon’s exposure to natural sunlight ( not passing through glass or screen) or to a proper UVB light (most recommended…long linear Reptisun 5.0 or Arcadia 6.0 long linear tube light). The fat soluble D3 from a supplement can build up in the system leading to health issues including MBD, so we only give it twice a month, dusted lightly on the insects. Exposure to the UVB light or direct sunlight should not lead to too much D3 being made and stored in the kidneys as long as the chameleon can move in and out of it at will.

Vitamin A, another fat soluble vitamin that can be overdosed if given in the prEformed form, needs to be given in balance with the D3…so needs to be given twice a month, like the D3.

Most insects we use as feeders have a poor ratio of calcium to phos. So we use a phos. free calcium powder at all feedings but 2 a month, when the vitamins containing D3 and preformed vitamin A are given.
It’s thought that many, if not all chameleons can not convert the prOformed vitamin A (from carotenoids) which is why we use the prEformed.

We want to make the insects as healthy as possible so we feed them and gutload them with a wide assortment of greens and veggies and a tiny bit of fruit. There’s a chart that helps you with this….

Once the bones are strong again, the liquid calcium can be discontinued but the rest of the husbandry should remain the same.

 

[KRobix]

The chameleon either has or has had MBD.

If he wasn’t treated for it, then he should be able to recover from it if he’s treated now. That is likely the reason for the shaking.

Do you know anything about how he was kept before you got him? The information that would be most useful is what I’m asking in the rest of this paragraph. What supplements are you using for him now and how often and how heavily for each? I’m particularly looking for phos, calcium, D3 and the form of vitamin A . What UVB light are you using..brand? long linear? 5.0 Reptisun or 6 Arcadia? What do you feed/gut load the insects with?

No I don't know anything about the previous owners. We adopted him from pet smart. Ps had him about a month and PS had been treating and got the parasites cleared up. The crickets are gut loaded with Carrots, Bug Burger, lettuce, butternut squash....I believe thats all.
32" Reptisun 5.0 light. (Also recently learned it might not be exactly what we need) my husband is the light guy. I get so dead gum confused. Lol. Thank you so much for your help and info. This little guy is so awesome. And I can't imagine what he felt like. I'm so glad the family realized...ok we need to do something. He definitely will be living the best life!! I'll show you pictures of his cage too. I found out today I need to give him more vines and limbs to move easier so that's my project tomorrow.

We have Neuro on a heavy dusting of crikets with calcium without D3. But I'm just now learning about MBD and needing the D3. Horned worms. And Black Fly larve and super worms.

 

[Gloriawood]

I just want to say hi and welcome! @kinyonga is the best. You are in fantastic hands. Did the vet mention MBD? If he was not treated by the vet for this, he will need to go back to get liquid calcium. My guy also had MBD when I got him and had a shake when he walked as well. It took a bit, but he did recover well from it.

 

[KRobix]

I just want to say hi and welcome! @kinyonga is the best. You are in fantastic hands. Did the vet mention MBD? If he was not treated by the vet for this, he will need to go back to get liquid calcium. My guy also had MBD when I got him and had a shake when he walked as well. It took a bit, but he did recover

@kinyonga has given me some pretty good info already. No the PS (petsmart) we got him from never said anything about it. they said he had the shake for about a month but that was all they said about the shake. So I'm going now to look into liquid calcium. With D3 correct?? Thank you

 

[Gloriawood]

@kinyonga has given me some pretty good info already. No the PS (petsmart) we got him from never said anything about it. they said he had the shake for about a month but that was all they said about the shake. So I'm going now to look into liquid calcium. With D3 correct?? Thank you

I don’t recall if mine had D3 or not. It was prescribed by the vet

 

[Beman]

No I don't know anything about the previous owners. We adopted him from pet smart. Ps had him about a month and PS had been treating and got the parasites cleared up. The crickets are gut loaded with Carrots, Bug Burger, lettuce, butternut squash....I believe thats all.
32" Reptisun 5.0 light. (Also recently learned it might not be exactly what we need) my husband is the light guy. I get so dead gum confused. Lol. Thank you so much for your help and info. This little guy is so awesome. And I can't imagine what he felt like. I'm so glad the family realized...ok we need to do something. He definitely will be living the best life!! I'll show you pictures of his cage too. I found out today I need to give him more vines and limbs to move easier so that's my project tomorrow.

We have Neuro on a heavy dusting of crikets with calcium without D3. But I'm just now learning about MBD and needing the D3. Horned worms. And Black Fly larve and super worms.

So what is the exact fixture type you got, T5HO or T8? If it is a T5Ho and a 5.0 bulb this would be correct sitting on top of a screen cage you would want branches 8-9 inches directly below this light.

Per the supplements. You do not want them to look like powdered donuts. They should be lightly dusted on insects. Calcium without D3 at all feedings and then a Multivitamin with vitamin A and D3 given instead two times a month say the 1st and the 15th. I prefer repashy Calcium plus LoD version for this.

Now depending on the extent of this shaking it may be normal. They do rock a little when they walk. However you can see that your boy has visible signs of MBD. Which @kinyonga was already covering with you. This will make it harder on them when they have miss shaped bone structure from MBD.

 

[Beman]

The liquid calicum should be without D3. D3 can cause an overdose and toxicity. In high doses it can actually do the opposite of what you want pulling the calcium out of the bones.