My First Hatchling Ever! T. q. gracilior

jajeanpierre

Chameleon Enthusiast
Yesterday one baby had pipped, and this morning s/he is hatched. Very excited and very, very scared--there can't be anything worse than a novice with a rare hatchling--a montane species to complicate it even more--so any tips will be greatly appreciated. Laurie is giving me tons of advice and a few other quad breeders are helping/have helped a lot.

This clutch is from a gracilior female who was gravid when imported in February. She's since laid a clutch of infertile eggs and has now been bred to my gracilior male.

No other eggs seem to have pipped or sweated this morning. I didn't notice this baby's egg ever sweating. Two or three of the eggs this morning seem to have patches of grey splotches--the same color the hatching egg turned after it had pipped, a sort of grey color. I hope that is just normal thinning of the egg or whatever else goes on before hatch. I can't see any others pipping, but some eggs are pretty deep in the vermiculite so I might not see the first signs of pipping. Eggs are five days past the 5-month mark, so well within the normal range.

I left baby in the incubator with the other eggs. S/he's not moving around, just sitting in a corner but looks to be a good weight and alert. Picture attached. If s/he had hatched in the wild, I think s/he would still be stuck underground because there wouldn't be her clutch mates helping dig out. Don't know if it is true, but I've heard that the movement of other clutch mates stimulates unhatched eggs to start to hatch. Can't hurt and at least I know the environment in the incubator is good. I'm terrified to put her in a cage.

I think I have lots of fruit flies and some bean beetles. Laurie recommended I order pinhead crickets Monday. I'll order the next size up, too. How many do I order? If all the eggs hatch, I'll have 12 baby graciliors.

I'll put them in a Dragonstrand extra wide breeder-series cage. It's only 30"tall,but the same footprint as the largest breeder cage. I'll change out the doors to Dragonstrand's new clear film doors so I can keep the humidity really high. The floor will be bare and the cage filled with fresh oak twigs/branches. I'm debating live plants. I do have plastic plant vines and things. Thoughts on the plants? The cage will be on a bottom shelf near the floor (so the coolest part of the room) and the Arcadia lights will be about 18" above the top of the cage. There shouldn't be a heat build up from the lights. I also have pieces of plastic with holes punched in it that Light Your Reptiles sent me to test out. It will reduce the UVB by 50% if it proves too high. My light meter shows almost no UVB except at the very top of the cage. I also have Reptisun compact UVB lights.

The cage will be hooked up to my automatic mister which currently is run six times a day:
8:00 a.m. 2 minutes
10:00 a.m. 5 mintues
1:00 p.m. 3 minutes
3:00 p.m. 3 minutes
5:00 p.m. 2 minutes
7:00 p.m. 30 seconds

I can have up to 8 automatic settings on the mister. What schedule would be better? There might not be any live plants in the cage to hold moisture. I'll arrange the perching so no baby can be near the (single) nozzle.

I think I have everything covered--humidity, lighting, food and caging. I'm not sure on whether to put in live plants (have not been able to find what I want yet) or plastic. What am I missing or could do better?

Thanks for all your help.
 

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I believe after the first hatch you lose the title novice. That's exciting. Good luck and post lots of pictures. -Joe
 
Without seeing pics, it's hard to say, but the graying (kind of wet or thinning looking too?) areas that you are describing sound like something that is frequently seen in eggs about to hatch. You shouldn't worry though because there's really nothing you can do. Just let things take their course. Hopefully, the remaining 11 eggs will hatch without any problems.

I always use live plants and strongly prefer them, but others I know use plastic plants, mainly with babies, without any problems. Advocates of either live or artificial plants might argue which is better, but each person's experiences are different so I find it hard to ever suggest to someone that they shouldn't use what they've used with success.

You may end up tinkering with things like misting frequency and duration, but the key is to be very observant of the animals' behaviors, health etc.. One thing I know about you Janet is that you are just that, very observant, so I think you'll handle things just fine. Don't worry. ;)
 
Congrats! It's like Christmas morning every time you look in the incubator when they are hatching!

Are you housing them individually? If you are not, I strongly recommend that you do. They will not do well in groups, or even pairs.

Have you checked that there is not too much water when you do all those mistings? I know you are very dry where you are.

Good luck!
 
Without seeing pics, it's hard to say, but the graying (kind of wet or thinning looking too?) areas that you are describing sound like something that is frequently seen in eggs about to hatch. You shouldn't worry though because there's really nothing you can do. Just let things take their course. Hopefully, the remaining 11 eggs will hatch without any problems.

I always use live plants and strongly prefer them, but others I know use plastic plants, mainly with babies, without any problems. Advocates of either live or artificial plants might argue which is better, but each person's experiences are different so I find it hard to ever suggest to someone that they shouldn't use what they've used with success.

You may end up tinkering with things like misting frequency and duration, but the key is to be very observant of the animals' behaviors, health etc.. One thing I know about you Janet is that you are just that, very observant, so I think you'll handle things just fine. Don't worry. ;)

Thanks for the vote of confidence, Perry. Yes, the grey is wet looking. Whew! It didn't look as if it was wrong, just very different. I'm busy getting the cage ready so I haven't looked again since early this morning. When the cage is set up, I'll look again.
 
Congrats Janet! How's that for anticipation and climax? Couldn't imagine hatching parsonii. :eek:
 
The cage is set up. What do you think?

There are no live plants, but I'm kind of leaning to the plastic right now. I'm sure I'll change my mind, certainly as they get older and bigger. At the most, there will be 12 baby quads together. I have other cages if one or more aren't doing well in a group situation and can order the little nursery cages from Dragonstrand if need be.

I didn't want a lot of cover as I was afraid I wouldn't find them all to keep track of how they are doing. Is this enough cover?

Yes, Tylene, I am housing them in a group--for the moment.

The cage is a Dragonstrand (21.5" x 16" x 30" high). I changed the doors to some sort of a clear film that Dragonstrand is introducing. I have another identical cage with clear film doors if I need it. I also have two glass terrariums. I raised a pair of babies from the February shipment together until they bred. I had a threesome together when they first came and one didn't gain any weight at all for the first week. Once I separated her, she gained like a little piggy. She started at 12g and now is over 80g.

Four of the remaining eggs are looking a little soggy.
 

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And a picture of baby!

Does its brain case look normal to you experienced people?
 

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And a picture of baby!

Does its brain case look normal to you experienced people?

He looks great. If you had a dome-head you'd know it. The cage looks like its just enough cover. Wouldn't want any less but I would take into consideration Tylene's suggestion. Don't forget to try to enjoy the experience a little also.;)
 
Janet I think you have your setup done as well as any of us would. They have cover and won't get blasted off a branch from lack of cover, when the misers come on.
The only other think I can offer is I keep a piece of ripe bananna in the bottom so the ffs and crickets will not bother the babies.

One other thing -- more pictures.
 
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