Ambilobe , male 2 years old, cannot use front legs at all. very strong back legs but usually grabs front legs and falls forward. Cant climb. I have only had him a couple weeks . He does NOT eat crickets and so far I have hand fed him only meal worms and wax worms. He strikes and misses but still chews like he caught something. A friend who breeds bearded dragons helped me force feed him some water and reptaid. he has not eaten in 3 days or drank or pooped (except the 2 syringes of water forced) Since he cannot climb. I have tried different reptariums and tanks and put him in a smaller one with glass sides and screen top so he would be closer to the uvb (5.0 reptisun) and i could watch to see if he would drink from the glass sides. I also have a small vine for water collection . I tried to shake the worms in calcium a couple times but he didnt go for them. The top of his head is swollen, like two puffy bumps. I just dont know what to do for him. I dont know any of his history. It looks as tho one of his front feet was broken or deformed , the other works but has almost no grip and with his back feet grabbing the front he just makes it worse. When i open the door to feed or water him he tries to come to me and tries to climb. i have only seen him strike at a worm that wasnt directly in front of him, one time (after a does of reptaid) any ideas beside MBD. the closest vet is 100 miles away and the last time i took my Jackson there 2 different vets told me 2 different things...UGH i am soo frustrated.......
MBD , Puffy head, cannot strike food
- Thread starter Figeretta
- Start date
Kate
Avid Member
Hi there. Sorry to hear you are having problems with your panther. From what you describe it could be mbd. Grabbing his legs, poor grip and being unable to eat does point to that .However you have only had him two weeks so whatever is going on was probably caused before you got him. Mbd is often caused by in imbalance of supplementation or no supplementation. It cannot be cured but it can be stopped by improving your feeding and supplementing. You have done the right thing by putting him in a smaller viv, hopefully he won't have far to fall if he does fall. I would suggest putting a towel at the bottom just in case. Keep giving him water by dripping some over his nose for a good period of time this often stimulates them to drink. Can I suggest you copy , paste and fill in form , link below and when we have more information someone with more experience may be able to help you.
https://www.chameleonforums.com/how-ask-help-66/
https://www.chameleonforums.com/how-ask-help-66/
will post pics tonight
Thanks for all of your imput so far! I will post pictures of him tonight. He drank alot of water today, but i still dont believe he has eaten. I will check to see if he has pooped........poor guy.I just hate when people get an animal and don't care for it properly! Reptiles are sooooo abused by people who dont even realize until it is too late!
Thanks for all of your imput so far! I will post pictures of him tonight. He drank alot of water today, but i still dont believe he has eaten. I will check to see if he has pooped........poor guy.I just hate when people get an animal and don't care for it properly! Reptiles are sooooo abused by people who dont even realize until it is too late!
drcrossfire
Avid Member
puffy head= hydration
not necessarily a bad thing. It isn't a sign of MBD as far as i know
not necessarily a bad thing. It isn't a sign of MBD as far as i know
camimom
New Member
The puffy heads a sign of being well fed.
In fact I'd say he's a bit too well fed.
As for the tongue issues, that can be A Sign of dehydration (which makes the tongue not sticky) or a sign of unbalanced vitamins.
I would suggest buying repashy all in one calcium plus.
When my male veiled had some trouble with aim, I switched the repashy and within two months everything was resolved.
Can we see pics of the Reston his body please?
His limbs especially.
In fact I'd say he's a bit too well fed.
As for the tongue issues, that can be A Sign of dehydration (which makes the tongue not sticky) or a sign of unbalanced vitamins.
I would suggest buying repashy all in one calcium plus.
When my male veiled had some trouble with aim, I switched the repashy and within two months everything was resolved.
Can we see pics of the Reston his body please?
His limbs especially.
Olimpia
Biologist & Ecologist
The thing with minerals like calcium, is that it isn't just there to make teeth and bones like everyone thinks. Calcium is actually indispensable when it comes to ALL muscle contractions, because of how it is involved in nerve impulses. So it doesn't surprise me at all that he is having a hard time shooting his tongue or eating, because when a chameleon has MBD and his blood calcium levels are too low, there isn't enough calcium to make muscle movements possible, so that's why his tongue and limbs are moving a bit erratically.
Is there not a single vet nearby that could help you? Usually a shot of liquid calcium is one of the best things you can do to get their blood calcium levels back to where they should be. Some blood work will help you see where you are, where you need to be, and how not to over-do it. There is a liquid calcium commercially available for reptiles from Repashy as well which is called RescueCal. You can mix it yourself (there are dosage instructions on the back, I believe, but you should be able to call a vet and have them double check it for you) and a little may do wonders to get him back on track.
Just remember, you can over do the supplementation, so don't go crazy with calcium powders and such! So if you can get your hands on insects that are naturally calcium rich, that will do wonders as well. Something like butterworms, pheonix worms, hornworms, silkworms, etc. - all very easy to eat and to stick in his mouth if you have to.
And before I have to get back to studying, definitely keep him in a low, safe cage. With low levels of calcium, usually the bone density is really low so fractures are really easy. Essentially he has the bones of a 80-90 year old petite woman. So make sure he can't fall easily, and if he can, definitely cushion the floor as much as you can.
Is there not a single vet nearby that could help you? Usually a shot of liquid calcium is one of the best things you can do to get their blood calcium levels back to where they should be. Some blood work will help you see where you are, where you need to be, and how not to over-do it. There is a liquid calcium commercially available for reptiles from Repashy as well which is called RescueCal. You can mix it yourself (there are dosage instructions on the back, I believe, but you should be able to call a vet and have them double check it for you) and a little may do wonders to get him back on track.
Just remember, you can over do the supplementation, so don't go crazy with calcium powders and such! So if you can get your hands on insects that are naturally calcium rich, that will do wonders as well. Something like butterworms, pheonix worms, hornworms, silkworms, etc. - all very easy to eat and to stick in his mouth if you have to.
And before I have to get back to studying, definitely keep him in a low, safe cage. With low levels of calcium, usually the bone density is really low so fractures are really easy. Essentially he has the bones of a 80-90 year old petite woman. So make sure he can't fall easily, and if he can, definitely cushion the floor as much as you can.
Thanks so much for all your imputs!! I will try some rescuecal and try to get some butter worms or something more than meals or wax. Chameleons are a fairly new challenge for me, but they have been exciting and we have enjoyed them so much. Watching (unexpected) babies "hatch" (my Jacksons female had babies 3 days after I got her)was great, and my kids love to watch them eat . I will post more pictures of his front legs but Im almost 100% sure there is nothing to do about them because of his age. I have a very small branch in the bottom of his housing to use with a vine for water but if he gets up on it he is basically stuck because of grabbing his front legs ( it is 3" max, off the bottom) and he just kinda tips forward to get down.I will post pics of his housing today also.........Thank you again! Laura
camimom
New Member
You can make a hospital cage for him.
Get a screen cage (so you stil have the proper ventilation) and lay it on its side.
put a soft towel on what is now the bottom of the cage, and put some decent sticks and plants in there (the dollar store is great for fake vines and such)
dont put them up too high, so i fhe falls, he wont have far to go, and you can put his basking bulb and his uvb bulb on the 'top' of the cage.
i really hope that makes sense.
Get a screen cage (so you stil have the proper ventilation) and lay it on its side.
put a soft towel on what is now the bottom of the cage, and put some decent sticks and plants in there (the dollar store is great for fake vines and such)
dont put them up too high, so i fhe falls, he wont have far to go, and you can put his basking bulb and his uvb bulb on the 'top' of the cage.
i really hope that makes sense.
It will still help out if you could copy and paste the questionnaire below ans fill in the answers as best you can with as much detail as possible. https://www.chameleonforums.com/how-ask-help-66/
I know you haven't had him long but, it will give a picture of his care now and may help give suggestions. It is possible for him to make improvements and even possible for him to use his legs again once he gets his calcium in balance again. It want cure any structural damage already done but can stop it and give him his strength back and his muscles to work much better. Hope he's feeling better soon and please, fill in your answers. This helps give a picture so the keepers with losts of experience may be able to help you more.
camimom
New Member
His legs look pretty good, even though hes grabbing himself.
i dont see any bowed limbs or 'extra' joints, so thats a good thing.
though him grabbing himself is a sign of MBD.
it looks like you may have caught it early on, so i would suggest get as much natural sun as possible, and get his supplements back on track.
calcium, calcium, calcium. and do what olimpia said.
i dont see any bowed limbs or 'extra' joints, so thats a good thing.
though him grabbing himself is a sign of MBD.
it looks like you may have caught it early on, so i would suggest get as much natural sun as possible, and get his supplements back on track.
calcium, calcium, calcium. and do what olimpia said.
Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - Male Ambilobe , 2 years old, had him about 1 month now/
Handling - He gets handled everyday to try to feed and take back feet off front legs .
Feeding - He does not eat crickets, I have offered him meal worms and wax worms he has never eaten more than 3/4 every couple of days.
Supplements - I have dusted the worms with reptical but he hasnt gotten any.
Watering -I have tried spraying the plants, the side of a glass terrariumeven spraying his mouth, I have only seen him drink 4 times.
Fecal Description - he hasnt pooped in 5-6 days , never been tested for parasites as far as I know.
History - no idea of history
Cage Info:
Cage Type - I have tried several types , right now he is in a small mesh reptarium on its side.
Lighting - reptisun 5.0 then upped it to a 10.0 equalivant for a couple days. Uvb comes on at 7 am and goes off at 7 pm
Temperature - all the reps are room temp ( it's still in the 80s out here during the day) The house door is open for air and he gets maybe 1/2 an hour of outside direct sun , but just this week because it was too hot when i first got him.
Plants - I had a live pothos in his reptarium but since he cant climb I put in a branch on its side and plastic vines for water collection
Placement - The cage is in the kitchen/dining room windows on the east side of the house. the top of the cage is about 3.5/ 4 ft off the floor.(on its side its about 12 inches high.
Location -Mojave desert , southern Cal
Your Chameleon - Male Ambilobe , 2 years old, had him about 1 month now/
Handling - He gets handled everyday to try to feed and take back feet off front legs .
Feeding - He does not eat crickets, I have offered him meal worms and wax worms he has never eaten more than 3/4 every couple of days.
Supplements - I have dusted the worms with reptical but he hasnt gotten any.
Watering -I have tried spraying the plants, the side of a glass terrariumeven spraying his mouth, I have only seen him drink 4 times.
Fecal Description - he hasnt pooped in 5-6 days , never been tested for parasites as far as I know.
History - no idea of history
Cage Info:
Cage Type - I have tried several types , right now he is in a small mesh reptarium on its side.
Lighting - reptisun 5.0 then upped it to a 10.0 equalivant for a couple days. Uvb comes on at 7 am and goes off at 7 pm
Temperature - all the reps are room temp ( it's still in the 80s out here during the day) The house door is open for air and he gets maybe 1/2 an hour of outside direct sun , but just this week because it was too hot when i first got him.
Plants - I had a live pothos in his reptarium but since he cant climb I put in a branch on its side and plastic vines for water collection
Placement - The cage is in the kitchen/dining room windows on the east side of the house. the top of the cage is about 3.5/ 4 ft off the floor.(on its side its about 12 inches high.
Location -Mojave desert , southern Cal
camimom
New Member
i would read sandrachameleon's blogs on gutloading, and i would get some calcium and start giving him that.
does he eat? cant remember if you said this or not.
if he does eat, put the calcium on the bug and let him eat, if he wont eat, you may have to put the bug in his mouth.
does he eat? cant remember if you said this or not.
if he does eat, put the calcium on the bug and let him eat, if he wont eat, you may have to put the bug in his mouth.
Thank you for filling in the info. I would go back to the 5.0 and make sure he's around 8" from the bulb. You haven't mentioned a basking bulb. All you need is a regular household incandescent bulb. Usually 40-60 watt. Make sure you are checking the temp frequently until you know it is reaching the right temp and not too hot. He needs to have a basking temp around 86F give or take a few degrees and then a drop in temp as he moves away from his basking area. Also you need around a 10 degree drop in room temp at night. Do you have glass or just screen door when your doors open? UVB can not pass through and kind of filter like glass, plexi. But warmth and UVA will so they do still enjoy it.Check this out. Lots of important stuff.
https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/sandrachameleon/useful-info/
https://www.chameleonforums.com/general-care-true-chameleons-5943/
Olimpia
Biologist & Ecologist
Natural sunshine is the best thing he can be getting right now, so great that you're able to take him outside. The vitamin D that you produce in the skin when exposed to UVB is directly involved in absorbing calcium properly, so by providing supplements and getting natural sunshine is the best way to get both levela where they need to be and working correctly to get his bone density up.
If he is not eating you may have to "force" feed him a little. My preferred method is to put one finger and a thumb on each cheek from behind, which usually makes them open their mouths, and then you slip a cricket into his mouth and let him chew. If he has serious MBD his digestive tract may not be functioning at its best (goes back to calcium and muscle movements) and things like hard, chitonous worms may be harder to move along the digestive tract. So try to get him on crickets and other things like butterworms, hornworms, silkworms, etc. Itf it comes to it you can always make a bug smoothie, with calcium, maybe some veggie baby food, and try seeing if he'll lick it from the tip of a syringe. If not, you can drop a couple drops at a time in his mouth an let him swallow beforeadding more.
I appologize for any typos, I'm on a nook and there'snothing I hate more than typing on a touch pad.
If he is not eating you may have to "force" feed him a little. My preferred method is to put one finger and a thumb on each cheek from behind, which usually makes them open their mouths, and then you slip a cricket into his mouth and let him chew. If he has serious MBD his digestive tract may not be functioning at its best (goes back to calcium and muscle movements) and things like hard, chitonous worms may be harder to move along the digestive tract. So try to get him on crickets and other things like butterworms, hornworms, silkworms, etc. Itf it comes to it you can always make a bug smoothie, with calcium, maybe some veggie baby food, and try seeing if he'll lick it from the tip of a syringe. If not, you can drop a couple drops at a time in his mouth an let him swallow beforeadding more.
I appologize for any typos, I'm on a nook and there'snothing I hate more than typing on a touch pad.
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