Is a "hydrid free range" approach possible?

[broderp]

QUOTE from Sticky at the head of this section:

"One common point of agreement is that free range setups are for advanced keepers and should only be attempted by those with sufficient experience, time, and floor space."

Could someone please elaborat why this is for advanced keepers?

My second question is (Actually my first, but I read the sticky first ):

Does a "hydrid" approach work? Can I open the top of my terrarium and have leaves or branches extend beyond the top and give my cham some more room to explore? If I leave his basking light and UVB at the terrarium level, will he seek them for more warmth and heat as needed or will they need to be moved further up as well?

I want to give him some more room to play.

 

[Olimpia]

Free-ranging permanently is tricky because it has a lot of cons, in my opinion, that take some creativity to get around. It's harder to create a suitable chameleon habitat in a free-range than in a closed cage.

Things like making the space safe (what happens if he gets down?), controlling temperatures and humidity, managing water, etc. Something like a fake ficus in a corner isn't going to cut it!

You could do a hybrid set-up but if you add height to the cage he's never going to go down, he's just going to go up to the top. So yes, you'd have to raise the lights up as well. It might be easier to make the extension horizontal, say, add a few plants and branches on whatever table the cage is on and open the door to let him explore now and then. But then put him back or let him wander back when he needs to bask.

Again though, you would have to make sure the area is safe and/or that you watch him while he's wandering.

 

[pigglett79]

As Olympia mentioned there are many things to think about. One is if he is able to get anywhere near the lights he could get burned. Also if the lights are within tongue range he could shoot his tongue at it and get it burned (has happened to other members resulting in loss of tongue). Also they wont stay put. If there is a way to get around he will. They will go down to the floor and then climb up other locations which may not be safe. Also they don’t always know what’s good for them. My boys have their own room and I do let them out some afternoons to their free ranges.

For my jackson I have a vine that i attach to his cage and he walks out in to the trees. However, even if I leave him out for 24 hours, he will stay in the trees and doesn’t go back to the cage where the water and lights are. He would rather stay out when given the option.

I have also caught the panther roaming across the floor, across the cage tops dangerously close to the lights and even across the house when I left their door open. So many opportunities for trouble.

I prefer to keep them in their cages, then let them out in the afternoon or evening to roam in their trees a few days a week, then I put them back in the morning. I also keep them in a room that is made just for them so that they have less opportunity to get in to trouble. And you can put walls around the free range bottom so that they cannot leave the area. They could easily get stepped on or smashed by the door when you open it if they are able to roam free (both of which I have heard stories from others).

It may sound overly cautious, but I have read so many stories of all of these things happening resulting in the death or serious injury of the chameleons. I would hate for it to happen when it is preventable.

 

[broderp]

........You could do a hybrid set-up but if you add height to the cage he's never going to go down, he's just going to go up to the top. So yes, you'd have to raise the lights up as well. It might be easier to make the extension horizontal, say, add a few plants and branches on whatever table the cage is on and open the door to let him explore now and then. But then put him back or let him wander back when he needs to bask.
....

First off thanks for responding! You have my utmost respect as I littereally just found your blog late last night and was up reading for hours! GREAT STUFF about chams! I was concerned the above would be true, but you came up with a very cool solution to give him some more room! I (I was hoping the need for light/warmth would be greater than the need for height/ security) Thank you for the input.

.....One is if he is able to get anywhere near the lights he could get burned. Also if the lights are within tongue range he could shoot his tongue at it and get it burned (has happened to other members resulting in loss of tongue).....

Very good point, didn't think of that. I will stick to what you and Olimpia suggest as a alternate to free roaming for now.

 

[Olimpia]

Thanks for the kind words! Back when I didn't FR anyone full time I would still put one on a plant on my desk or on some 7' branches I have standing in a corner from a reptile show, and they would still get to explore a bit, exercise, and feed their curiosity while I was on the computer and then they'd go back to their cage. But I didn't have to worry about anyone getting into much trouble or not getting their needs met, because this was only 2-3 hours out of the day, if that.

So I think a little temp FR somewhere in a safe corner is going to be enough for him to get a little excitement into his life but not have to worry about all of the negatives of FRing!

 

[DeremensisBlue]

I was free ranging long before I knew only experts should do it! I would prefer to say that free ranging has its own challenges and you should be prepared for a quick learning curve. Honestly, there are so many different situations with free ranging that being an expert in closed caged chameleons only partially transfers over to free range. It helps to know the needs of the chameleon, but the rules do change. Where a chameleon in a cage will bully, intimidate and stress a cage mate to death, those two chameleons may hang out perfectly fine in a free range.

On this forum we like to say you need to be an expert to do free ranges or keep parsonii, or....(insert expert activity) and it is true that the more you know about chameleons in general the more successful you will be when trying something new. But all of us "experts" need to beware that we are not learning and passing on rules we think are chameleon related when, in fact, they are tied to something else. Take the mantra of no co-habitation. We know not to do it. Well, we learned not to do it in a caged environment and we continue saying that without taking to consideration that in a different keeping protocol the "rules" we "know" may not apply. The reason I bring this up is because it is the non experts that tend to discover things we experts don't look for because we know better. I am not saying to not listen to the people who have gone before you! I am saying do your research and, if it makes sense in your brain, go for it!

There is so much available as far as information on free ranging that you can be well aware of the challenges and requirements up front and make an educated decision as to whether it is for you. So you don't have to be an expert to try it. Just be voracious in research before hand. This forum is awesome for that kind of thing.

Bill

 

[DeremensisBlue]

By the way, all encouragement aside, a free range is an enormous job. Only do it if you truly have a passion for it because it will be a huge investment as far as daily time to tweak it and get it right. I personally would discourage anyone from doing it only to ensure that only the most tenacious keeper would try it! You have to baby-proof the house. Not just the first 24" of the floor, but the entire reachable house....don't take this on lightly...no other pets allowed...always watch where you walk...making sure he is well hydrated when he doesn't feel the need to go to the one spot you have set out for misting...

The other posters have given you excellent advice for your particular situation. Please do not let my pep talk encourage you to bite off something greater than you want to chew!

Bill

 

[Carlton]

I was free ranging long before I knew only experts should do it! I would prefer to say that free ranging has its own challenges and you should be prepared for a quick learning curve.

I would agree...it isn't as simple as being an "expert" really. It will work for those of you who are good at thinking about all the aspects of YOUR available space and predicting what you can do to handle the risks that may come up. You could be a CHAM expert but have no real clue about free ranging in a particular house or room.

1) You need enough cham expertise to think like a cham, to predict how it will behave while free ranging and where it can get to.
2) You need to be able to anticipate the risks they face.
3) You need to be willing to be creative and to cham-proof your room or house.
4) You need to respond fast if something doesn't work out.

 

[symphonica]

I have four panther chams in my free-range. Fortunately, I have a whole, furnished basement for them. Otherwise, I wouldn't be able to pull this off. I completely cleared out a 10' x 10' section of the basement. I then built a 2' acrylic "edging" around the area so that the chams wouldn't be able to climb out. Lights are hung on the ceilings. Their cords are pinned tightly up against the walls so they can't climb them (well, they can but prefer not to put the effort into it). I then have 8 artificial ficus in the area, with 6 misting nozzles, 2 minutes every hour, 3 humidifiers below the ficus. Maintaining humidity is the biggest challenge, and then ensuring that all four are eating enough is also a challenge. How do you know which one is eating the most, unless you hand feed all of them? Now, they all know when it's feeding time, and they each have a feeding cup on a ficus where they know to eat out of.

I'm able to do this because I have the room for it, but it will ruin your house (walls, ceiling, floors) from the increased moisture and constant mistings, and if I didn't have the room to be able to set up something this established, I'd constantly be worrying about them and the whole experience would end up being more stressful than pleasant.