I forgot how much crickets stink..

[ferretinmyshoes]

Love the cage. I just poked holes at the top, guess I need to do a little more.

This is my first ever cricket colony I started. And I read that its not ideal to feed the crickets dog food? I planned on feeding them a lot of veggies like carrots, lettuce, some fruits like strawberries, cricket crack and such but was also going to throw in dog food as well.

Thanks! Be careful making it if you're just going to crudely cut the plastic with a steak knife (like I did).

You don't want to use dog food or especially cat food for gutloading because they contain high amounts of animal protein, and since chameleons are not carnivorous their kidneys are not equipped to handle high amounts of animal protein. It can lead to kidney damage and/or failure or gout, which is very painful and sometimes impossible to treat. There are many other very good options for gutloading that provide the correct types of protein and other nutrients needed for excellent growth and health so there is simply no need to risk health problems by using dog or cat food imo. It's generally discouraged across the forums for those reasons.

 

[GoFSU]

Thanks! Be careful making it if you're just going to crudely cut the plastic with a steak knife (like I did).

You don't want to use dog food or especially cat food for gutloading because they contain high amounts of animal protein, and since chameleons are not carnivorous their kidneys are not equipped to handle high amounts of animal protein. It can lead to kidney damage and/or failure or gout, which is very painful and sometimes impossible to treat. There are many other very good options for gutloading that provide the correct types of protein and other nutrients needed for excellent growth and health so there is simply no need to risk health problems by using dog or cat food imo. It's generally discouraged across the forums for those reasons.

Will the little hoppers eat through aluminum screen? I was checking homedepot for screen and they didn't have any metal online other then aluminum. I may need to do a store check since its not online

 

[PrettyInInk87]

Cleanliness and ventilation are key in keeping crickets alive. You need to be on top of the dying crickets, if you leave them longer than one day they start to stink and breed bacteria. The other crickets will start eating the dead ones, they will get sick, die, and then the cycle starts over again. Pick off all of the dead crickets as soon as you find them dead, keep the inside dry, keep them well fed, don't overcrowd (or they start competing for territory and eat each other), high temps, careful with mold, and you should be good. Lol! They are such stinkers and are VERY delicate.

 

[ferretinmyshoes]

Will the little hoppers eat through aluminum screen? I was checking homedepot for screen and they didn't have any metal online other then aluminum. I may need to do a store check since its not online

No aluminum works great, they can't chew through that!

 

[SonTigerPantherCham]

I clean my crix cage every day, their food twice a day (cricket crack, dark greens, fruits, veggies) I didn't know they did smell. I also know with my birds if you leave food longer than 2 or 3 hours it starts producing bacteria and is harmful and stinky to birds. Maybe that's what is contributing?

 

[GoFSU]

Would grapefruit peels work the same as oranges? I am afraid of the grape fruit being to acidic but an orange is acidic too.

And I took out the dog food when I got home and put in Berries, lettuce, carrots, tomatoes, and cricket crack

 

[GoFSU]

Yes I have no life... Actually I do its just that i have to work tomorrow night from 11pm-7am so I wanted to prepare for it by staying up all night and sleeping during the morning God I hate Night shifts....

Ok so I took some pictures of the current status of my Hoppers Bin. I have a nice layer of organic top soil with some egg cartons, fruit and veggie bowl that has lettuce, tomato, blue berries, strawberries, and some carrots (They already devoured a couple of pieces of cricket crack).

I have ok air flow, I have about 50 holes screwed into the bin on the sides and top. I plan on putting screens on it tomorrow. Now Room temp in my apartment is 76 degrees, I have read that a little bit higher around 80 is ideal but I am blasting 2 lamps on it so it has to be a little bit below 80 degrees. I am keeping the soil moist and checking on it every couple of hours to make sure it is. About every 4/5 hours condensation is building up on the sides and top of the container. Is this supposed to happen? I am assuming yes. Also when will I know they have laid eggs so I can move these ugly things to the second bin so they don't start eating the little ones.

 

[ferretinmyshoes]

Condensation is not supposed to happen - that means that your ventilation is poor and you have 100% humidity in there - which they don't like. High humidity can take out crickets pretty easily, and it makes them smell more. Once you get the screen on there it will be much better, but the dirt will probably dry out faster.

 

[Joann]

Im hoping to switch the new cham over to something else as soon as I can.I do have sand and eco earth mixed with some organic peat.I will try that for a substrate and see if that helps as well.I didnt get the cage fixed last night like I wanted but will this morning for sure.Thanks for all the help and the pics of the bin so I can copy it.

If I get roaches it will probably be awhile before I can get the colony going and the cham switched over so in the mean time I hope I can keep these alive.

 

[fluxlizard]

Getting back to your original question and talking bearded dragons now rather than chameleons-

I have a colony of bearded dragons that gos back to 1994. I've produced thousands over the years and in that time, I have experimented a lot with feeding (and pretty much all other aspects of husbandry) and have held back large numbers of dragons various years to learn what I know with some certainty about them.

I only give you that background so you have some idea that what I'm about to say isn't just speculation- I've walked the walk and put in a lot of time trying different things to be able to make the following statement with some confidence. I'm saying this because what I'm about to tell you some hobbyists with a few dragons might find challenging to their beliefs.

For bearded dragons (not chameleons) it isn't so important what you use as your feeder insect. I've raised some to adulthood on mealworms alone (along with plenty of fresh leafy greens and rep-cal bearded dragon food- and for that matter I've raised groups on 100% vegetarian and 100% rep-cal bearded dragon food as well- which really only works if you are keeping them in isolation and 100% vegetarian dragons don't get quite as large, take longer to grow, and produce smaller and fewer (but very nice looking) clutches of eggs- 100% rep-cal pelleted babies and juveniles grow more slowly at first but after a while they speed up and catch up again in size as adults).

Keeping all that in mind, I'd make the following suggestions to you-

1) Offer the bearded dragon plenty of fresh leafy greens daily and keep a small bowl of rep-cal bearded dragon pellets in the enclosure at all times. If this is a baby dragon and he doesn't take to the greens and/or the pellets at first, offer them constantly anyway so they are there in the cage with him every day. It may take time, but after a while of walking on these food items/flicking them with the tongue and nibbling occasionally, every bearded dragon I've ever raised (thousands) develops a taste for these food items and begins to eat more and more of them. Cutting back on insects and switching to mostly pellets for my animals once they are adult size and getting them to eat plenty of fresh greens has *never* been a problem for me because I start offering these items when they are babies and continue offering them daily consistently.

2) Offer the dragon your choice of fresh insects alongside the greens and pellets. Dust the insects with calcium and d3 daily (or just calcium if your dragon is outdoors). While he is young and growing rapidly it is best to offer as much insects as he wants every day- this will help him grow properly and reach his size potential. Because insects are only one part of the diet, and especially if you want to cut back to more veggies and/or pellets for your dragon as an adult then I'd say choice of insect isn't very critical. Mostly they are there because they move which dragons find very appetizing and because they are protein and fat (both very important for proper development of muscle and brains, etc- for more info on importance of fat content in lizard diet before chameleon keepers who tend to believe low fat is always the way to go in insect diet, see comment by nutritionist in bearded dragon handbook by AVS on the importance of enough fat in the diet, also keep in mind that lots of insects are for baby rapidly growing dragons only, ).(More veggies surely more healthy for adult dragons than more insects, some studies of wild bearded dragons show adults eating up to 90% plant matter and only 10% insect matter, and for that matter I kept numbers of dragons long term on 100% vegetarian diet and they did great- just didn't grow quite as large and clutches were smaller in number).

Although I have used mealworms alone to grow a couple groups into breeding adults and they worked just fine, there are better choices nutritionally that are also convenient- superworms for example or if you want to grow your own insects, you can use tropical roaches or soldier fly larvae. But again, because you should be aiming for a long-run diet of mostly greens and/or pellets, insects eventually make up only a small part of the diet overall, and just about anything you choose will be fine.

So if you skip all the above and skim to the point at the bottom- you can use any insect, you don't have to deal with crickets unless you want to. Dragons love crickets though, so you might still pick some up from time to time in smaller quantities.

 

[fluxlizard]

Part of my yard last summer. 64 175 gallon reptariums with 1.2 dragons per cage in the yard, a few aren't visible here. I cover with tarps when it rains. Teenagers up near last reptariums for size comparison.

 

[SweetObsolete]

I personally absolutely loathe touching dead crickets, which makes it pretty difficult for me to clean them out. So, I just buy them in smaller quantities. 50-100 at a time. Feed them daily, and few die off. It means more trips to the pet store, but its worth it. You can only smell them if you open their container and get right in there. I wish I could just feed worms, they're so much nicer. The bf won't allow roaches in the house.

 

[jdog1027]

Part of my yard last summer. 64 175 gallon reptariums with 1.2 dragons per cage in the yard, a few aren't visible here. I cover with tarps when it rains. Teenagers up near last reptariums for size comparison.

Frickin' AWESOME!!!!! Reminds me of a miniature version of Bert Langerwerf's Agama International in Montevallo Alabama. What do you spend per month on maintainance of your operation if you don't mind me asking?

 

[fluxlizard]

Too much!



I wish I had what Bert had- first time in my life I truely felt hard deep-gut wrenching sickening can't sleep at night envy was when someone who had never bred a lizard before in his life (according to himself) bought Agama International from the Langerwerf's after Bert died...

I did drive down and visit the farm and buy a few waterdragons, tegus and shinisaurus from Timo before that happened though...

 

[GoFSU]

Getting back to your original question and talking bearded dragons now rather than chameleons-

I have a colony of bearded dragons that gos back to 1994. I've produced thousands over the years and in that time, I have experimented a lot with feeding (and pretty much all other aspects of husbandry) and have held back large numbers of dragons various years to learn what I know with some certainty about them.

I only give you that background so you have some idea that what I'm about to say isn't just speculation- I've walked the walk and put in a lot of time trying different things to be able to make the following statement with some confidence. I'm saying this because what I'm about to tell you some hobbyists with a few dragons might find challenging to their beliefs.

For bearded dragons (not chameleons) it isn't so important what you use as your feeder insect. I've raised some to adulthood on mealworms alone (along with plenty of fresh leafy greens and rep-cal bearded dragon food- and for that matter I've raised groups on 100% vegetarian and 100% rep-cal bearded dragon food as well- which really only works if you are keeping them in isolation and 100% vegetarian dragons don't get quite as large, take longer to grow, and produce smaller and fewer (but very nice looking) clutches of eggs- 100% rep-cal pelleted babies and juveniles grow more slowly at first but after a while they speed up and catch up again in size as adults).

Keeping all that in mind, I'd make the following suggestions to you-

1) Offer the bearded dragon plenty of fresh leafy greens daily and keep a small bowl of rep-cal bearded dragon pellets in the enclosure at all times. If this is a baby dragon and he doesn't take to the greens and/or the pellets at first, offer them constantly anyway so they are there in the cage with him every day. It may take time, but after a while of walking on these food items/flicking them with the tongue and nibbling occasionally, every bearded dragon I've ever raised (thousands) develops a taste for these food items and begins to eat more and more of them. Cutting back on insects and switching to mostly pellets for my animals once they are adult size and getting them to eat plenty of fresh greens has *never* been a problem for me because I start offering these items when they are babies and continue offering them daily consistently.

2) Offer the dragon your choice of fresh insects alongside the greens and pellets. Dust the insects with calcium and d3 daily (or just calcium if your dragon is outdoors). While he is young and growing rapidly it is best to offer as much insects as he wants every day- this will help him grow properly and reach his size potential. Because insects are only one part of the diet, and especially if you want to cut back to more veggies and/or pellets for your dragon as an adult then I'd say choice of insect isn't very critical. Mostly they are there because they move which dragons find very appetizing and because they are protein and fat (both very important for proper development of muscle and brains, etc- for more info on importance of fat content in lizard diet before chameleon keepers who tend to believe low fat is always the way to go in insect diet, see comment by nutritionist in bearded dragon handbook by AVS on the importance of enough fat in the diet, also keep in mind that lots of insects are for baby rapidly growing dragons only, ).(More veggies surely more healthy for adult dragons than more insects, some studies of wild bearded dragons show adults eating up to 90% plant matter and only 10% insect matter, and for that matter I kept numbers of dragons long term on 100% vegetarian diet and they did great- just didn't grow quite as large and clutches were smaller in number).

Although I have used mealworms alone to grow a couple groups into breeding adults and they worked just fine, there are better choices nutritionally that are also convenient- superworms for example or if you want to grow your own insects, you can use tropical roaches or soldier fly larvae. But again, because you should be aiming for a long-run diet of mostly greens and/or pellets, insects eventually make up only a small part of the diet overall, and just about anything you choose will be fine.

So if you skip all the above and skim to the point at the bottom- you can use any insect, you don't have to deal with crickets unless you want to. Dragons love crickets though, so you might still pick some up from time to time in smaller quantities.

However I did enjoy this read but the original topic was about crickets stinking and how to care for them in the cage

I went to Home Depot, took the lid off from the second bin and but a rectangular/squarish with different degree of corners Its not perfect but will add ventilation. Is it necessary to cut the sides of the bin as well or is just the tops fine?

Ferret I think you sleep less than I do.

 

[goldilocksadw70]

I use Reptiworms for the baby beardies as well as crickets (1500 of them left).

The reptiworms don't smell at all and they love them, our chameleon like them too. The crickets we have, the food is rotated out every other day and that's kept the smell to almost nothing. I don't like dealing with this quantity of them, but I have no choice right now.

 

[Ellie And Me]

Crickets will die off. Ive had lots of luck with a large cricket feeder bin i got from a pet shop. I don't put anything on the ground makes it harder to clean between batches. I got the fulker high calcium cricket diet. and use thier cricket quencher. I have found that they require more water than food. I use one dish for food a two for the water gel. I get about 90 crickets about 10 or 12 will die. but I have noticed with feeding them like I have there is no need to dust the crickets. but she loves laying onder her uvb 5.0 light. i will dust a few twice a month just in good measure

alot of people use scraps like potatoes and stuff like that for main food but they rot real fast and tend to smell quicker. I have put a few carrots in with them but remover them when changing water gel.

You might want to look into starrting up a meal worm farm also. not alot of money into raising your own but you might want to buy your meal worm in stages don't want all of them to be at the same stage all one time for you will have times when your worms are not at feeding size.

 

[javsto]

As Jan said, don't use cat food or dog food as cham kidneys cannot handle too much animal protein in their diet. I bet you don't have enough ventilation if there are only holes in the top. There's no reason for air to flow in one direction unless you have a pressure difference so those holes aren't doing much for you. Crickets die from stagnant air and humidity, and they stink all the more in it! Try doing something like this instead:

Same concept but I cut the sides and top out (just a knife will do it) and hotglued some screen over the holes. Works wonderfully! But use metal screen because they will eat through fiberglass/window screen and escape everywhere.

The link in my signature has excellent nutritional info on commonly available fruits and veggies to use for gutloading. Aim for higher calcium than phosphorus ratios and avoid oxalates and goitrogens.

what size mesh gauge do you use in that bin and as far as the egg cartons go do you use only styrofoam or can i use a recycled paper-ish type that my company uses to ship various parts to its vendors?

 

[drewtt]

I hate taking care of crickets! Admittedly, I don't take very good care of mine.

I have noticed that when I keep the crickets on shavings, the smell is farrrr less noticible. You will inevitably lose a bunch of crickets when you change the bedding, unless you are willing to each one out.

Drew

 

[GoFSU]

How many days before they breed again?