Green Veiled Chameleon with URI, Advice needed

[merisah98]

I took my green veiled chameleon to the vet yesterday and she was diagnosed with an upper respiratory infection & was prescribed antibiotics

She’s been acting lethargic, one eye closes time to time, she just started making gasping noises a day before yesterday & she’s pointing her head up…I’ve also noticed she’s brighter in color, is this a sign of stress?

I’m working on getting her bigger enclosure setup and should have her officially switched over this weekend/early next week. Is there anything else I can do or just focus on meds and getting her switched as quickly as possible?

Also, should I still continue to mist after lights are out and prior to coming on + fogging after lights out at night? I’m located in South Florida for reference.

 

[elizaann2]

Hello and welcome! I’m sorry to hear your girl has a URI. I hope she has a quick and smooth recovery.

This is a great place to get help and support for your cham. Will you please copy the template below and fill out the information?

Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
• Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
• Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
• Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with, and what is the schedule?
• Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long do you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
• Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
• History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
• Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
• Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
• Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
• Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
• Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high-traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
• Location - Where are you geographically located?

Current Problem -

 

[merisah98]

Hello and welcome! I’m sorry to hear your girl has a URI. I hope she has a quick and smooth recovery.

This is a great place to get help and support for your cham. Will you please copy the template below and fill out the information?

Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
• Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
• Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
• Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with, and what is the schedule?
• Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long do you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
• Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
• History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
• Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
• Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
• Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
• Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
• Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high-traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
• Location - Where are you geographically located?

Current Problem -

HI!

Species: Green veiled

Gender: Female

Age: About 4 months ( pet store never told us so this is an estimate, but I’m aware she will lay eggs even without a mate, so will need to put a lay bin as soon as I get her situated in the newer enclosure)

Lights: I’m using a 50 W Basking Light & T5 H0 Reptisun, I have the UVB currently propped up on glass jars about 8-9 inches from the nearest branch & her basking light is about 6-7 inches from her branch. I am trying to get her basking to be between 75-80, but it keeps fluctuating back to 80-82, so I turn it down a bit & also add a fan blowing on ice to try to cool it down. I believe the temps are condensed as I have her in a 16x16x 30, not too sure on the dimensions, but it’s the smallest one (biggest mistake )

Lighting schedule: lights on at 8:00 am and lights off at 8:00 pm

Feeding: I put about 8-9 crickets in + 2-3 discoid roaches between 10:00 am - 11:00 am EST, but for some odd reason, she has only ate 2 roaches, but doesn’t find any interest in them anymore, so I think she’s just very picky lol..

Supplements: dusting insects with calcium w/o D3 every feeding & using multivitamin with vitamin A ONLY twice a month.

Gutloading: I blended lettuce, sweet potatoes, & a little less than a handful of blueberries ( that way her fecal isn’t watery) & bee pollen powder

Misting: before lights come on & after lights out. Fogging: for about 15 minutes after lights out, but having trouble keeping humidity in..

Measuring temp/humidity with hydrometer, but I’m starting to think the one I have isn’t accurate…if you can please recommend a good one to use!

I have a dripper also that I set to drip at night and in the morning bc she’s on antibiotics & want to make sure she is staying hydrated.. I don’t see her drink as I try to stay out of her sight that way I don’t stress her out even more, I try to just peek on her once a while to see how she’s doing.

Fecal: darkish brown/moist + white urate, just got it tested & no parasites thank god!

Plants: umbrella tree ( currently not doing so well) & no clue why, but I’m going to leave it out of the new enclosure. I had more plants in there also, but I had to pull them outside bc I was getting a really bad gnat infestation ( stickies are up around my room , enclosure, & plants outside) to speed up the process, but I’m going to definitely get more coverage in the bigger enclosure.

Enclosure is set way too low currently , but I’m getting a stand to prop the new one higher up, just found out that they do not like to be at the same level as us…

It is near a fan and it’s not sitting directly under a air vent, but it’s definitely close by, and she is in a high traffic area also unfortunately…but I am going to correct all this once I get her switched over ( aiming to get her switched by this weekend)

Location: Miami, FL

Problem: she will act lethargic time to time and sit on a branch completely curled + one eye will open & close occasionally. Just started making a noise, 2 days ago, but I can’t tell if she is hissing or gasping ( it sounds more like gasping to me ) and she will point her head up also in the air..

Let me know if I’m missing anything & TY for your help ❤

 

[merisah98]

Hello and welcome! I’m sorry to hear your girl has a URI. I hope she has a quick and smooth recovery.

This is a great place to get help and support for your cham. Will you please copy the template below and fill out the information?

Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
• Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
• Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
• Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with, and what is the schedule?
• Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long do you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
• Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
• History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
• Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
• Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
• Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
• Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
• Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high-traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
• Location - Where are you geographically located?

Current Problem -

Sorry! For not coping the template, missed that part & it’s a screen cage! I have both sides blocked with white post boards to give her more privacy, but I ordered a proper vinyl stick on for the new enclosure ( jungle print)

I also give her meal worms or hornworms ONLY once a week as a treat

 

[merisah98]

Hello and welcome! I’m sorry to hear your girl has a URI. I hope she has a quick and smooth recovery.

This is a great place to get help and support for your cham. Will you please copy the template below and fill out the information?

Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
• Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
• Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
• Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with, and what is the schedule?
• Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long do you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
• Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
• History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
• Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
• Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
• Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
• Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
• Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high-traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
• Location - Where are you geographically located?

Current Problem -

Duration - we have had her for 3 weeks now

Handling - we made a mistake and we were handling her everyday for about 15 minutes.. didn’t realize they don’t like to be handled everyday and to also leave them alone while they acclimate to their new environment. Now we are only handling currently to administer antibiotics every 2 days

 

[elizaann2]

Hello! Thank you for filling that out! I'll send my responses in red. @Beman @kinyonga @MissSkittles Please feel free to add or adjust anything I passed on below.

Species: Green veiled

Gender: Female

Age: About 4 months ( pet store never told us so this is an estimate, but I’m aware she will lay eggs even without a mate, so will need to put a lay bin as soon as I get her situated in the newer enclosure). Great! You will want this to be a permanent part of her enclosure to decrease her stress level. (photo attached)

Lights: I’m using a 50 W Basking Light & T5 H0 Reptisun, I have the UVB currently propped up on glass jars about 8-9 inches from the nearest branch & her basking light is about 6-7 inches from her branch. I am trying to get her basking to be between 75-80, but it keeps fluctuating back to 80-82, so I turn it down a bit & also add a fan blowing on ice to try to cool it down. I believe the temps are condensed as I have her in a 16x16x 30, not too sure on the dimensions, but it’s the smallest one (biggest mistake ). I am not sure on this one, I have never used ice to cool down an enclosure, I will usually just turn off the basking light for a little to allow the temperatures to drop that way. I'll let the more experienced keepers tagged above comment

Lighting schedule: lights on at 8:00 am and lights off at 8:00 pm. Perfect!

Feeding: I put about 8-9 crickets in + 2-3 discoid roaches between 10:00 am - 11:00 am EST, but for some odd reason, she has only ate 2 roaches, but doesn’t find any interest in them anymore, so I think she’s just very picky lol.. She may be going off of food due to her not feeling well. Will she eat other bugs besides those just fine?

Supplements: dusting insects with calcium w/o D3 every feeding & using multivitamin with vitamin A ONLY twice a month. This is excellent, you will also need to add a phosphorus-free calcium supplement that also contains vitamin D3 to dust on feeders 2x a month as well. Vitamin D3 is what allows their bodies (and ours) to utilize calcium correctly in our bones and muscles. Here is a good D3 supplement.

Gutloading: I blended lettuce, sweet potatoes, & a little less than a handful of blueberries ( that way her fecal isn’t watery) & bee pollen powder I attached a photo for you with more information on what vegetables you can use to gut load.

Misting: before lights come on & after lights out. Fogging: for about 15 minutes after lights out, but having trouble keeping humidity in.. Excellent! If you are struggling to keep your humidity in, you can wrap some of her enclosure with something as cheap as a shower-curtain from the dollar store. It doesn't look great but it works, especially if you are working on replacing her enclosure. You can also screw corrugated plastic on the outside walls of your girls enclosure to help hold in the humidity. I recently did this to one of my enclosures and am very happy with the results. I followed the youtube video linked here.

Measuring temp/humidity with hydrometer, but I’m starting to think the one I have isn’t accurate…if you can please recommend a good one to use! I don't have a super fancy one but this one here is the one I use and I've been pretty happy with it. One thing with her humidity and temperatures, you want to make sure that during the day the humidity is low (40-50%) and the temperatures are higher (ambient around 72). At night you want the humidity high (80-100%) and the temperature low (ambient around 60). If you have high humidity and high temperatures, it can cause URIs in chams and can be a breeding ground for bacteria and fungus. You also want to make sure that her enclosure drys out during the day.

I have a dripper also that I set to drip at night and in the morning bc she’s on antibiotics & want to make sure she is staying hydrated.. I don’t see her drink as I try to stay out of her sight that way I don’t stress her out even more, I try to just peek on her once a while to see how she’s doing. Great! I check my chams urates every time she poops and check her urate to make sure it is white. That means she is hydrated

Fecal: darkish brown/moist + white urate, just got it tested & no parasites thank god! Excellent! And that is great news that she is parasite free!

Plants: umbrella tree ( currently not doing so well) & no clue why, but I’m going to leave it out of the new enclosure. I had more plants in there also, but I had to pull them outside bc I was getting a really bad gnat infestation ( stickies are up around my room , enclosure, & plants outside) to speed up the process, but I’m going to definitely get more coverage in the bigger enclosure. My umbrella plants aren't doing great either, I believe in order for them thrive they may need a plant light. I ended up taking my umbrella plants out. Pothos plants are fantastic because they can tolerate low light, lots of water or underwatering. Not going to lie, I have no idea what to do about the gnat issue, they are all over my house too

Enclosure is set way too low currently , but I’m getting a stand to prop the new one higher up, just found out that they do not like to be at the same level as us…. Great you will want to get her up high as soon as you can. Height equals safety. The fewer stressors your little girl has the better, especially as she is working on recovering

It is near a fan and it’s not sitting directly under a air vent, but it’s definitely close by, and she is in a high traffic area also unfortunately…but I am going to correct all this once I get her switched over ( aiming to get her switched by this weekend). Sounds good, move her as quickly as possible, the fan can cause cold drafts and the high-traffic area is a constant stress for your little lady.

Location: Miami, FL

Problem: she will act lethargic time to time and sit on a branch completely curled + one eye will open & close occasionally. Just started making a noise, 2 days ago, but I can’t tell if she is hissing or gasping ( it sounds more like gasping to me ) and she will point her head up also in the air..

 

[MissSkittles]

Hi. Did your vet by chance address the swelling/puff at the inner corner of her eye?

 

[MissSkittles]

@elizaann2 has given you awesome info! I do just want to clarify a couple of things.
It’s ok to have your basking temps range around 80-82. Just make certain that it doesn’t get any higher than that. Here’s a great article that explains the process of reduced feeding and temps to help decrease egg production and laying. Your pretty girl seems just a tad young still, but veiled girls can reach sexual maturity as early as 5-6 months old.
Not sure I understand why you’d use the dripper after lights are off. She will be asleep at that time. If you are able to consistently achieve night time temp drops of below at least 68, then you’ll want to fog and increase humidity all the way. If you can not get your night temps so low, do not fog or boost humidity. High humidity + heat increases risk for respiratory infection. I’m in central FL and can’t achieve temps any lower than 72-73 at night, so I don’t ever fog and just run the mister a couple of 15 second times during the night for a slight humidity boost.
Yes, definitely try to increase hydration while she’s on antibiotics. Many chams are secret drinkers. If the mister has just gone off while I’m in the room, I leave so all my secret drinkers can drink their fill. Are they oral meds? Did they show you how to give properly? You need to aim towards the back of the throat as the airway is in the front of the mouth.
There is something going on with that eye. It could be a keratin plug, small piece of shed or something that got trapped, sinus problem or I don’t even know. Do you have a follow up appointment? If so and the eye still has that swelling, you’ll need to have it addressed. The eye may need to be flushed.
Do feel free to ask whatever questions you may have and share your sweet girl’s progress. I do hope she’s feeling better soon.
PS The schefflera needs a good strong plant light. I like and use these two. The 70w is super strong and will keep even hibiscus alive. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07BRKG7X1/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07TKKG8Q3/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[MissSkittles]

I knew I forgot something! I wanted to talk about your soil gnats. It’s a common problem for many of us. I have 5 bioactive chameleon enclosures plus lots of extra plants so have been engaged in a never ending battle with the darned things. I usually run two Katchy’s https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07B6RZP4H/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 I have one in my cham room and one in my kitchen. Once a year I buy some mantis ooths and let them hatch out in my enclosures. The baby mantids eat the gnats and then the chams get to hunt down the mantids for treats. Now is the perfect time of year to get the ooths. I get mine from eBay. Check the forum sponsors as there is a mantis vendor. Using drosera capensis /sundews are helpful at keeping the numbers down. Also, keep the top of your soil as dry as possible…don’t overwater. You might try some diatomaceous earth if you aren’t bioactive and have some large stones to cover the soil so your cham can’t eat it.

 

[Beman]

Supplements: dusting insects with calcium w/o D3 every feeding & using multivitamin with vitamin A ONLY twice a month. This is excellent, you will also need to add a phosphorus-free calcium supplement that also contains vitamin D3 to dust on feeders 2x a month as well. Vitamin D3 is what allows their bodies (and ours) to utilize calcium correctly in our bones and muscles. Here is a good D3 supplement.

Just going over this bit. Most multivitamins have D3 in them which means you would not add additions D3 to the rotation. @merisah98 Please let us know which multivitamin you are using so we can confirm.

Problem: she will act lethargic time to time and sit on a branch completely curled + one eye will open & close occasionally. Just started making a noise, 2 days ago, but I can’t tell if she is hissing or gasping ( it sounds more like gasping to me ) and she will point her head up also in the air..

Gasping and nose pointing are the outward sings they display with a respiratory infection. Be very cautious not to aspirate her. Their airway is all the way in the front so you have to aim to the back of the mouth for meds.
http://www.muchadoaboutchameleons.com/2014/05/how-to-give-different-medicines.html

 

[merisah98]

@Beman @elizaann2 @MissSkittles Hi everyone! So update on Yoshi! She was turning a bit dark in the morning, but that is because she was getting angry with me because I was moving out as much stuff out of my bedroom as possible to make space for her new enclosure & also it is definitely helped with the temps! I had to tape a piece of cardboard right in front of where she usually is/basks to give her more privacy and she is back to her usual color & is actually being more active now! I peeped her on a lower branch and honestly I haven't seen her in that area for about a week 1/2 now! I am also planning on getting black out curtains to block out the sunlight into my room that way I can keep the temps controlled as much as possible. She is still kinda of raising her head up a bit, but idk I am not entirely sure if she has a respiratory issue OR if she is staring at the gnats flying around in the glass jars I have my UVB light propped up on...

The multivitamin that I am using has D3 & Vitamin A in it, but I am aware to only dose that one twice a month


As far as her eye goes, the vet said that her eye/cornea looks okay, but it is still definitely swollen. I honestly think it has something to do with the enclosure being so small, her being in a high traffic area, plus the improper misting/fogging that I was doing, having her lights sitting directly onto her enclosure, & handling her quite a lot, but I can assure you all that I have made the proper adjustments & will be switching her over to a 24 X 24 X 48 enclosure with lots of coverage & branches Vet prescribed Ciprofloxacin to help out with her respiratory issue, lethargy, & swollen eye, but I will still continue to monitor. I hope that once I switch her over to her mansion lol, that these symptoms will get better over time. Also, unfortunately, they did not do any flushing, is there anything that I could do on my end or should I just continue to give her antibiotics and wait for about 1-2 weeks to see if the swelling goes down?


Fogging/Misting: I am only misting in the AM & PM when lights are out and prior to them coming on for about 1-2 minutes max that way temps do not sky rocket as it is super condensed in this small enclosure. I am also going to stop fogging at night since I am located here in Miami,FL & I did notice that temps are way too high at night, I am just going to stick to misting manually.

Bugs: She eats mostly cricks as Petco was ONLY feeding her crickets & meal worms ( not the best I know )... she has ate a total of 3 cockroaches so far, but I noticed that she prefers crickets a lot more, but I know this isn't sufficient enough for her, so I am going to keep trying the roaches & order silkworms. I also bought a hanging feeder for her bigger enclosure that way it's more fun for her to eat instead of just going in front of a plastic container with a cut hole in it to prevent the insects from getting out.

Let me know if I missed anything please and can you guys also drop some gutloading recipes? I blended lettuce, sweet potatoes, handful of blue berries, and a spoon of bee pollen powder.. is this incorrect?

 

[merisah98]

@Beman @elizaann2 @MissSkittles One more thing! She does have hormworms, but ONLY once a week and she loves them & I also bought some meal worms, but I will only feed those as treats as well!

Thank you all for your advice/help! I am definitely taking notes & I am not going to lie... I was not well prepared for this at all...but it's okay <3 I am doing the best I can to make sure that Yoshi is happy/healthy moving forward!

 

[Beman]

Hun you can follow this for what to blend in your gutload.

 

[Beman]

I use blackout curtains as well. They help control temps quite a bit.

 

[merisah98]

@Beman Ah sorry about that! Will follow this, thank you for everything!

 

[elizaann2]

@Beman @elizaann2 @MissSkittles One more thing! She does have hormworms, but ONLY once a week and she loves them & I also bought some meal worms, but I will only feed those as treats as well!

Thank you all for your advice/help! I am definitely taking notes & I am not going to lie... I was not well prepared for this at all...but it's okay <3 I am doing the best I can to make sure that Yoshi is happy/healthy moving forward!

That is awesome! I had a similar experience with my first cham with the wrong enclosure and set up. I think the important thing is that you are getting her what she needs now. She is very lucky to have you!

I don’t know much about eye problems so I’ll let @Beman speak to that

 

[Beman]

As far as her eye goes, the vet said that her eye/cornea looks okay, but it is still definitely swollen. I honestly think it has something to do with the enclosure being so small, her being in a high traffic area, plus the improper misting/fogging that I was doing, having her lights sitting directly onto her enclosure, & handling her quite a lot, but I can assure you all that I have made the proper adjustments & will be switching her over to a 24 X 24 X 48 enclosure with lots of coverage & branches Vet prescribed Ciprofloxacin to help out with her respiratory issue, lethargy, & swollen eye, but I will still continue to monitor. I hope that once I switch her over to her mansion lol, that these symptoms will get better over time. Also, unfortunately, they did not do any flushing, is there anything that I could do on my end or should I just continue to give her antibiotics and wait for about 1-2 weeks to see if the swelling goes down?

Speaking to this... Most common issues for what your seeing with the swelling in the corner of the eye turret is infection and even over supplementation of D3. We see this a lot with chain store chams that spent time there because they almost always only supplement with Calcium with D3.

See how the antibiotics help. And just make sure your supplementation is 100% correct.

Make sure you have a dripper going on the cage this can be as simple as placing ice cubes on the screen top dripping down on the plants. She needs consistent access to water being on the meds.

 

[merisah98]

@Beman hey Beman, need a bit of your help again.. Yoshi has been super dark since this morning & I just switched her into her new enclosure last night. Here are pictures for reference. Let me know if you need any more pictures. Also, I know I still have open areas, I ran out of zip ties, but going out today to get more to attach more plants to give her coverage. Is everything okay with the distance of my basking light & uvb or are they too far?

 

[merisah98]

@Beman disregard I know what it is … I just propped up the uvb light & need to get her a plant there so she can get out of the uvb ASAP..

 

[Beman]

@Beman disregard I know what it is … I just propped up the uvb light & need to get her a plant there so she can get out of the uvb ASAP..

Which UVB fixture type and bulb strength are you using? What is the total distance from the bottom of the fixture to the closest branch right below it?