Eye problem...

trd1215

New Member
I have a little problem i think. I just noticed today that my panther cham has one of his eyes closed throughout the day. I tried spraying water on it and he would open it, but after a little bit he closed it again... what can i do to help him with this eye problem?
 

Powers

New Member
Members will need the below information to be able to help you out:

Cage Info:
Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
Location - Where are you geographically located?

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.
Current Problem - The current problem that you are concerned about.
 

trd1215

New Member
Screen
No lighting (Kept Outside)
Min 80 at night / Day 85-95
Humidity 60 and higher
Plant is Hibiscus
Wall Balcony Corner
Miami

Panther Chameleon/Male (About 2 months care)
Never handle
Feed him crickets everyday/superworms every other week/Crickets are fed Orange Gutload
ReptiCalcium without D3
Feces brown to dark color, every other day. Never been tested for parasites.
 

jojackson

New Member
Could be any number of things but eliminate a sloughing issue first. You dont really give much detail about the issue, so we can only guess. How long has it been closing it?
can you elaborate, any other details, behaviours associated?
 

trd1215

New Member
Could be any number of things but eliminate a sloughing issue first. You dont really give much detail about the issue, so we can only guess. How long has it been closing it?
can you elaborate, any other details, behaviours associated?
Yeah he just started doing it today early morning when i saw him his eye was closed. I also noticed yesterday he was rubbing his other eye with the pot in his cage, and today he has his other eye completely closed. I threw sum crickets in his cage and he ate them all like always. He also likes to eat dirt now and then. What other info can i tell you?
 

chambabysitter1

New Member
What other info can i tell you?
You seemed to have filled out only small parts of the questionaire. It takes like 5 min at the most to fill out thoroughly.

I went ahead and bolded what you missed.


Cage Info:
Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
Location - Where are you geographically located?

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.
Current Problem - The current problem that you are concerned about.

As you can see, you missed alot of what could be very important details to figuring out your problem. The more information provided, the better that people can assess what is wrong.
 

kinyonga

Chameleon Enthusiast
Do you have a substrate in the cage? Is he still pooping?
How old is it?
Can he get out of the sun and into the shade when he wants to?
 

trd1215

New Member
Do you have a substrate in the cage? Is he still pooping?
How old is it?
Can he get out of the sun and into the shade when he wants to?
Yes there is a potted hibiscus plant with top soil dirt.
I haven't seen his poop in about 3 days.
He is about 9 months old.
Yes he can get out of the sun he has plenty of shade in the cage.
 

Chameleon Company

Avid Member
You are describing classic Vitamin A deficiency ...

.... a problem which has been confirmed by such as Dr. Gary Ferguson, Dr. Scott Stahl, Dr. Ivan Alfonso, and moi. Could be something else, but from what you describe, this is suspect number one. I think the substrate pursuit is an unlikely candidate. My notes on it:

Possible Vitamin A Deficiency in Chameleons, Symptoms and Solutions

By The Chameleon Company, LLC



Vitamin A deficiency is a common malady in LTC chameleons, either with WC or CB origins. This stems from the chameleons inability to synthesize real Vitamin A from common precursors, such as beta-carotene. This can be confusing when evaluating supplementations, as many dry supplements list Vitamin A benefits, but only as the precursor, beta-carotene, and not as “pre-formed”, “pro-formed”, or in essence, real Vitamin A.

While lack of Vitamin A effects many aspects of chameleon health, the usual first observed symptom is the appearance of an unexplained eye irritation, manifested in difficulties in keeping first one eye open, and after a few days, both eyes are affected. The eyes will not appear sunken, or in any other way mis-shaped initially, although secondary problems, such as an infection, can follow. The initial observation is that it is causing irritation to the chameleon, and that it can't keep the eye open as normal. It occurs more often in larger animals, but sometimes occurs in larger juveniles. Successfully hatched chameleons seem to be born with a supply of Vitamin A, an essential ingredient for successful embryonic development, and fresh WC’s seem to be imported with a supply. Mother Nature seems able to provide this vitamin without problem. Without some real vitamin A in their diet, these stores will deplete. It is a difficult vitamin for the hobbyist to gut-load via crickets and insects though, and such attempts are usually ineffective.

Vitamin A is a fat soluble vitamin, as is Vitamin E. It is most commonly sold in gel caps, with each gel cap containing approximately three drops of an oil solvent. It is available on-line from many suppliers, and is sold in most vitamin and health stores. The most common, and consensus most effective, form of vitamin A is a compound known as retinal palmitate. It is a common human food supplement as well. Depending on manufacturer, gel caps may contain 2000-15,000 iu’s (intravenous units) per gel cap. Read the label to insure you are buying a product with retinal palmitate as the Vitamin A. The solvent may be fish oil, which outside of its odor, is OK. While this product can be acquired on-line from several manufacturers, shipping may take a few days. If symptoms of possible vitamin A deficiency have been observed, it is best to purchase locally, at such as a GNC or other nutrition and vitamin store, as you can have it NOW, and then buy on-line to have a supply on hand for future use. Here’s an online source:

http://www.amazon.com/Carlson-Laboratories-Vitamin-Palmitate-softgels/dp/B00014DUVG

Vitamin A is toxic in large quantities. As you are dealing with an oil, a strong word of caution as well. Chameleons have an extreme dislike for almost any measurable quantity of oil introduced into their mouth. While inexact, usually a negative reaction starts to become likely to occur if a quantity of oil ½ drop or greater is introduced into an adult chameleon’s mouth, and is virtually guaranteed with 2 or more drops. This can induce vomiting and inhalation of the oil, possibly death. Fortunately, the amount of oil (and vitamin A) needed to effectively dose a chameleon is usually less than 1/20th of a drop. Again, an inexact science, but depending upon the concentration of the Vitamin A in the oil, your goal is to deliver a dose that contains approximately 100 iu’s per 50g of chameleon. An exceedingly rough estimate would be 1/20th of a drop of the oil in an average adult female panther chameleon. There is a reasonable margin for error. This can be administered by puncturing one or more gel caps, and wetting a Q-tip with the oil, so that it is wet, but not dripping. You can then grab the chameleon behind the head, and when it says “Ahhhh”, touch the Q-tip to its inner gum, etc. It will likely chomp down, then let go of the Q-tip once released itself. Or, if you are able to hand-feed, swab the back of a cricket or such with a smear of the oil, and then coax your chameleon into eating it.

As a rule, we recommend this treatment to all adult chameleons once every two weeks. If an animal is showing symptoms of Vitamin A deficiency, such as eye closing with no other apparent malady, we recommend the dose daily for five days, then once every two weeks. In such cases where Vitamin A deficiency is the problem, the eyes usually improve on the third or fourth day. Good luck.

Jim Flaherty
The Chameleon Company, LLC
 

writh

New Member
i had this issue too

I have recently had same issue with a 6 week old male veiled chameleon i recently purchased. never really did see it open its right eye and then today it wouldn't open its other eye its only been 6 days since i purchased him so I'm going to return him. I feel bad but maybe they can get him the help it needs since there is no reptile vet within 100 miles from here. My best it advice fined
A VET!!! ASAP I have researched online alot and there is no one simple answer for that issue.... good luck :(
 

Chameleon Company

Avid Member
Writh and others

Sorry to hear of your issue with the veiled. To provide some additional about Vitamin A deficiency, and your problem, let me say first that closing of both eyes simultaneously is symptomatic of many chameleon maladies. Also, in a 6week old, vitmain A deficiency would be uncommon, as sussessful hatch requires a good vitamin A supply in the neonate, and it usually does not deplete until after third month, often later, more towards the 5-6 months. Put another way, Vitamin A deficiency is very rare in younger animals, such as your 6 week old. Hope things work out. Experience has its price.
 

trd1215

New Member
He looks very restless and he keeps walking up and down everywhere. Its 10:40pm and he is still walking around, he should be sleeping. He looks very anxious and impatient like something is bothering him :(.
 

sandrachameleon

Chameleon Enthusiast
You may want to seek the advice of a vet who is familiar with Chameleons, both to investigate the possible vitamin deficiency suggested, or determine if there is another cause to the eye issue, and also to put your mind at ease regarding any other symptoms or behavious that seem odd.

You may also want to consider using a better gutload and offering a wider diversity of prey insects.
 

newbornbabies

New Member
abnormal?

Sorry to hear of your issue with the veiled. To provide some additional about Vitamin A deficiency, and your problem, let me say first that closing of both eyes simultaneously is symptomatic of many chameleon maladies. Also, in a 6week old, vitmain A deficiency would be uncommon, as sussessful hatch requires a good vitamin A supply in the neonate, and it usually does not deplete until after third month, often later, more towards the 5-6 months. Put another way, Vitamin A deficiency is very rare in younger animals, such as your 6 week old. Hope things work out. Experience has its price.
Mine's not even 3 weeks old and has one of his eyes closed, and as said, rubs his closed eye to various things.

but unlike TRD1215, he sleeps normally, though not as energetic as his other brethern. I think my 3 week old is sick.
 

Aldebaran

Member
You are describing classic Vitamin A deficiency ...

.... a problem which has been confirmed by such as Dr. Gary Ferguson, Dr. Scott Stahl, Dr. Ivan Alfonso, and moi. Could be something else, but from what you describe, this is suspect number one. I think the substrate pursuit is an unlikely candidate. My notes on it:

Possible Vitamin A Deficiency in Chameleons, Symptoms and Solutions

By The Chameleon Company, LLC



Vitamin A deficiency is a common malady in LTC chameleons, either with WC or CB origins. This stems from the chameleons inability to synthesize real Vitamin A from common precursors, such as beta-carotene. This can be confusing when evaluating supplementations, as many dry supplements list Vitamin A benefits, but only as the precursor, beta-carotene, and not as “pre-formed”, “pro-formed”, or in essence, real Vitamin A.

While lack of Vitamin A effects many aspects of chameleon health, the usual first observed symptom is the appearance of an unexplained eye irritation, manifested in difficulties in keeping first one eye open, and after a few days, both eyes are affected. The eyes will not appear sunken, or in any other way mis-shaped initially, although secondary problems, such as an infection, can follow. The initial observation is that it is causing irritation to the chameleon, and that it can't keep the eye open as normal. It occurs more often in larger animals, but sometimes occurs in larger juveniles. Successfully hatched chameleons seem to be born with a supply of Vitamin A, an essential ingredient for successful embryonic development, and fresh WC’s seem to be imported with a supply. Mother Nature seems able to provide this vitamin without problem. Without some real vitamin A in their diet, these stores will deplete. It is a difficult vitamin for the hobbyist to gut-load via crickets and insects though, and such attempts are usually ineffective.

Vitamin A is a fat soluble vitamin, as is Vitamin E. It is most commonly sold in gel caps, with each gel cap containing approximately three drops of an oil solvent. It is available on-line from many suppliers, and is sold in most vitamin and health stores. The most common, and consensus most effective, form of vitamin A is a compound known as retinal palmitate. It is a common human food supplement as well. Depending on manufacturer, gel caps may contain 2000-15,000 iu’s (intravenous units) per gel cap. Read the label to insure you are buying a product with retinal palmitate as the Vitamin A. The solvent may be fish oil, which outside of its odor, is OK. While this product can be acquired on-line from several manufacturers, shipping may take a few days. If symptoms of possible vitamin A deficiency have been observed, it is best to purchase locally, at such as a GNC or other nutrition and vitamin store, as you can have it NOW, and then buy on-line to have a supply on hand for future use. Here’s an online source:

http://www.amazon.com/Carlson-Laboratories-Vitamin-Palmitate-softgels/dp/B00014DUVG

Vitamin A is toxic in large quantities. As you are dealing with an oil, a strong word of caution as well. Chameleons have an extreme dislike for almost any measurable quantity of oil introduced into their mouth. While inexact, usually a negative reaction starts to become likely to occur if a quantity of oil ½ drop or greater is introduced into an adult chameleon’s mouth, and is virtually guaranteed with 2 or more drops. This can induce vomiting and inhalation of the oil, possibly death. Fortunately, the amount of oil (and vitamin A) needed to effectively dose a chameleon is usually less than 1/20th of a drop. Again, an inexact science, but depending upon the concentration of the Vitamin A in the oil, your goal is to deliver a dose that contains approximately 100 iu’s per 50g of chameleon. An exceedingly rough estimate would be 1/20th of a drop of the oil in an average adult female panther chameleon. There is a reasonable margin for error. This can be administered by puncturing one or more gel caps, and wetting a Q-tip with the oil, so that it is wet, but not dripping. You can then grab the chameleon behind the head, and when it says “Ahhhh”, touch the Q-tip to its inner gum, etc. It will likely chomp down, then let go of the Q-tip once released itself. Or, if you are able to hand-feed, swab the back of a cricket or such with a smear of the oil, and then coax your chameleon into eating it.

As a rule, we recommend this treatment to all adult chameleons once every two weeks. If an animal is showing symptoms of Vitamin A deficiency, such as eye closing with no other apparent malady, we recommend the dose daily for five days, then once every two weeks. In such cases where Vitamin A deficiency is the problem, the eyes usually improve on the third or fourth day. Good luck.

Jim Flaherty
The Chameleon Company, LLC
**IU : International Units**
 
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