Canny Chams
New Member
I usually use crickets, but what do you think is a better staple feeder, crickets or hissing roaches
Crickets or Roaches
- Thread starter Canny Chams
- Start date
Canny Chams
New Member
oh no im sticking with crickets, i was just curious. i meant just the two of them as they are similar
sandrachameleon
Chameleon Enthusiast
Hissers are much easier to keep /breed for yourself, IMHO, than crickets. And quieter. And less stinky. But they get very large and they can climb some surfaces whereas crickets cannot. Hissers are easier to gutload than crickets, and indeed I find they will eat things happily that other roaches dont want to eat.
ABDragons
New Member
some info
Species Moisture %Protein %Fat %Ash %
Dubia Roach 61 % 36 % 7 % 2 %
Trukistan Roach 64 % 37 % 5.5 % 2 %
Crickets 74% 18% 6% 1%
Mealworm 59 % 10 % 13 % 1 %
Silkworm 76 % 64 % 10 % 7.5 %
Phoenixworm N/A 17 % 9.5% N/A
Superworm 59 % 20 % 16 % 1 %
Waxworm 61 % 16 % 11 % 1 %
Species Moisture %Protein %Fat %Ash %
Dubia Roach 61 % 36 % 7 % 2 %
Trukistan Roach 64 % 37 % 5.5 % 2 %
Crickets 74% 18% 6% 1%
Mealworm 59 % 10 % 13 % 1 %
Silkworm 76 % 64 % 10 % 7.5 %
Phoenixworm N/A 17 % 9.5% N/A
Superworm 59 % 20 % 16 % 1 %
Waxworm 61 % 16 % 11 % 1 %
Canny Chams
New Member
ok cool, i never really feed roaches since no one sells them in my area
Something worth reading if your considering using roaches as a staple. Be careful what you feed them. roach-revolution-revelation-theory-about-reptile-gout
Canny Chams
New Member
very interesting article, either way i like to stick with yonge crickets, as they have a good balance of protein and fat from calories about 65:35
fluxlizard
Avid Member
I'm not an expert, but I think he may be drawing some speculative conclusions based on a misunderstanding about roaches and uric acid. See this article:
http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/10/cockroach-recycling/
Also-
Pretty incredible if you stop to think about it in relevance to gutloading...
At any rate- I don't think roaches in and of themselves cause gout- I've been feeding my lizards roaches heavily from day 1 through adulthood the past decade and have had a total of one case of gout- it was a chameleon and the chameleon arrived as an adult to me with gout as a pre-existing condition. I fed a few thousand roaches to lizards today, in fact.
Where did you get these? I think some of the protein is figured dry and some moist in these figures, is that correct? If so, it is like comparing apples to oranges...
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WOLVERINES135
New Member
I cant use roaches... I'm afraid some will escape and start infesting my house and I'm petrified of the things. My hotel on vacation became infested with them when we got there and I cant imagine them in my real house...
fluxlizard
Avid Member
another source- sorry this is going slightly off topic- but crickets store uric acid in their fat bodies as well- it is not only roaches that do this. Also they have bacteria living in them which, similar to those found in roaches, break down uric acid-
Microbiota Associated with the Gastrointestinal Tract of the Common House Cricket, Acheta domestica
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC243672/
You can click and read the whole article if interested.
Near bottom of page 249:
The paragraph above it talks about the bacteria that deal with the uric acid in crickets.
Googled acheta uric acid on the hunch that crickets weren't so different from the roaches when it came to uric acid and found that paper.
53% uric acid in fat bodies of crickets is pretty significant. It wouldn't surpise me if most insects are similar...
Microbiota Associated with the Gastrointestinal Tract of the Common House Cricket, Acheta domestica
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC243672/
You can click and read the whole article if interested.
Near bottom of page 249:
The paragraph above it talks about the bacteria that deal with the uric acid in crickets.
Googled acheta uric acid on the hunch that crickets weren't so different from the roaches when it came to uric acid and found that paper.
53% uric acid in fat bodies of crickets is pretty significant. It wouldn't surpise me if most insects are similar...
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fluxlizard
Avid Member
Just be choosy about which species you select.
Some- like turkistan (red racers or lateralis) are risky for infestation and are best avoided.
Others- like dubia (orange-spotted roach) or hissers are not risky unless you live in the very deep south (florida, south-texas, etc) and even there they prefer escape from the home rather than infestation.
emilybier
New Member
Are hissers better than dubia? Most people I know breed dubia. My initial thought was that hissers were more expensive too. Roaches seem to be the preferred staple for a lot of different herps as they are more nutritious, easier to breed, cleaner and quieter than crickets. I could never bring myself to have them around though D: They always freak me out at shows and the palmetto bugs here scare the crud out of me.
iwantone
New Member
Really informative read thank you.
icegecko
Established Member
Hissers are more expensive to start up. They also take longer to breed. Honestly, it's all about personal preference between dubia and hissers. Hissers look "cooler", but make noise, are more expensive initially and require a bit more space (in my personal opinion). The real reason I went with hissers (G. portentosa) instead of dubia is becausse hissers are slower breeders, which is important if you have one one or two chameleons-especially adults. Faster breeding roach species give you more roaches per colony, and in turn that requires you to buy/make more gutload. Hissers cost more per roach, but you'll have fewer roaches to feed in the colony than if you have dubias. I have one chameleon-I do not need thousands of roaches, especially when hissers make up only ~15% of his diet. I also have Banana roaches and porcelain roaches- for one chameleon, these work really well too, although they are not as meaty as a dubia or hisser.
A note about being scared of roaches: I HATE pest species roaches. They freak me out. I am not a roach person. Hissers, banana roaches and porcelain roaches do not remind me of the stereotypical pest "roach". They look different, are brightly colored and cannot infest your house unless you live in the deep tropics. They cannot survive on filth like the pest species can.
Crickets, in my opinion, are the worst feeder insect you can buy. They die in days, they reek, they infest your house and can kill your pets. Don't forget that breeding them is nowhere as easy as roaches. People say you have to be crazy to have roaches. I say you have to be insane to have crickets.
A note about being scared of roaches: I HATE pest species roaches. They freak me out. I am not a roach person. Hissers, banana roaches and porcelain roaches do not remind me of the stereotypical pest "roach". They look different, are brightly colored and cannot infest your house unless you live in the deep tropics. They cannot survive on filth like the pest species can.
Crickets, in my opinion, are the worst feeder insect you can buy. They die in days, they reek, they infest your house and can kill your pets. Don't forget that breeding them is nowhere as easy as roaches. People say you have to be crazy to have roaches. I say you have to be insane to have crickets.
