camimom
New Member
SO because all bugs have something on them, it doesn't matter if we feed them crickest with the virus or not?
I call BS.
Cricket Virus
- Thread starter jannb
- Start date
SO because all bugs have something on them, it doesn't matter if we feed them crickest with the virus or not?
I call BS.
Juancito
Member
I think you guys are arguing for no reason. I understand all points presented but the fact remains their is a virus. we dont know how lethal but Its still a virus. I saw that mulberry farms has the virus and ive been ordering from them since day one so can somebody post lists of company's that DO NOT have the virus. I'll leave the scientific parts to you seniors. I just want healthy chameleons.
jannb
Chameleon Enthusiast
To the best of my knowledge I don't believe Armstrong or Timberland have had any problems with the virus.
Juancito
Member
Do they have a website?
You ALWAYS feed with virus. You never fed to chameleon anything where was not virus. Not one single piece. Just types and quantity, that is the question. You can call BS but you have no idea what are you feeding. There is no life without virus on earth. Honestly I do not understand why this one bothers you so much when with every insect you will feed more viruses than it has cells in body (Ok, this is valid for vertebrates I just assume for invertebrates it is the same). Generaly we can calculate that in every organism, your body included, are more viruses than it has cells.
Just sometimes some of them are to some species pathogens those can be lethal (in principe very rare mistake because parasite has in principe no intention kill host). This happened with Acheta and parvovirus. I do not suggest feed infected crickets but reason is that you purchase crapy crickets those will die and because are sick they do not offer nutritional value like before. Problem is poor quality of crickets not transfer to chameleons.
Just sometimes some of them are to some species pathogens those can be lethal (in principe very rare mistake because parasite has in principe no intention kill host). This happened with Acheta and parvovirus. I do not suggest feed infected crickets but reason is that you purchase crapy crickets those will die and because are sick they do not offer nutritional value like before. Problem is poor quality of crickets not transfer to chameleons.
VigilantSpearIII
New Member
Geez, its okay...if your convictions on the subject are so strong then just switch to a Jamaica field cricket. I mean, I can see why some people would be scared. I still know some people that think you can "catch the cancer" from hanging around someone with cancer. For a Densovirus to be able to affect vertebrates it would have to undergo a complete restructure...not a likely outcome.
Mike Fisher
Established Member
Same reason I don't feed off the dead or near dead ones, even in a healthy batch. Nor would I intentionally feed off crickets I knew had the virus. I already have fed my chameleons crickets that were infected, but only because they were not showing symptoms yet. My chameleons are still healthy and I didn't lose any sleep over it.
I may take your suggestion and try the crazy reds one day but only if I can be certain that they get eaten right away. I'l try anything twice.
DanSB
Avid Member
I'm pretty sure resistant crickets can carry the virus too, it just doesn't impact healthy individuals. So that might not help either...
CrazyChamLady13
New Member
As long as the virus is present, I wouldn't use crickets. There's plenty of other variety of food out there. Just start a thread of who is safe and who isn't. I haven't fed off crickets for over a year. Reason.... the Chameleons I use to have stopped eating them. My beardie doesn't like them. So I see no reason to buy them.
The lepidopterans Spodoptera littoralis and Galleria mellonella could not be infected with AdDNV (A. domesticus densovirus). The Jamaican cricket, Gryllus assimilis, and the European field cricket, Gryllus bimaculatus, were also found to be resistant to AdDNV.
DanSB
Avid Member
That article clearly says that AdDNV was isolated in non cricket species. Also does resistant mean infected but not impacted? And does can't be infected mean no sign of the virus after exposure?
I am also curious what non-cricket species were carriers. This could mean other feeders are spreading this virus around the world! Not to mention the chance no matter what you feed you stand a good chance of feeding the virus.
I'm waiting for the full paper to be delivered through my library so right now all I have to go on is the abstract. Someone asked for species not affected by the virus so that was all I was offering at this point.
We here in Europe have longer experience with that problem. Although there are still "farms" trying to breed Acheta it seems that problem with them repeats sooner or later. However vast majority have switched to assimilis and we all feed with them.
Gryllus bimaculatus has plenty of offspring therefore some producers use it. However it has many disadvantages. Many animals hapily eating assimilis and Acheta do not accept them. Than like adlult they are horrible loud.
On contrary assimilis grows larger therefore larger chameleon species prefer them. They are far less noisy. They do not spread in some warm houses like Acheta.They eat easier and in large quantity "green" therefore gutload is better compared with Acheta. I tested that liter of assimilis eats at once as minimum 3x as much plants like liter of Acheta.
Just you can not feed 1 inch cricket to 2 inch reptile and wonder why they do not eat them and leave them in terrarium "may be will them eat later". However if you have something what can crickets eat there they do not bite repltiles as minimum after my experience. If they are hungry disaster can happen.
I was feeding just Acheta in past. But when this problem started here I was forced switch or not use crickets at all. At first I used bimaculatus but many animals did not accepted them. Than I discovered that assimilis in appropriate size are happily eaten, the amount of dandelions etc. they can "gutload" is amazing and I just learned to be not lazy and feed crickets that way that they will not co-live in terrarium. But if we observe forums disaster happens but I will say rarely by breeders those are responsible.
Gryllus bimaculatus has plenty of offspring therefore some producers use it. However it has many disadvantages. Many animals hapily eating assimilis and Acheta do not accept them. Than like adlult they are horrible loud.
On contrary assimilis grows larger therefore larger chameleon species prefer them. They are far less noisy. They do not spread in some warm houses like Acheta.They eat easier and in large quantity "green" therefore gutload is better compared with Acheta. I tested that liter of assimilis eats at once as minimum 3x as much plants like liter of Acheta.
Just you can not feed 1 inch cricket to 2 inch reptile and wonder why they do not eat them and leave them in terrarium "may be will them eat later". However if you have something what can crickets eat there they do not bite repltiles as minimum after my experience. If they are hungry disaster can happen.
I was feeding just Acheta in past. But when this problem started here I was forced switch or not use crickets at all. At first I used bimaculatus but many animals did not accepted them. Than I discovered that assimilis in appropriate size are happily eaten, the amount of dandelions etc. they can "gutload" is amazing and I just learned to be not lazy and feed crickets that way that they will not co-live in terrarium. But if we observe forums disaster happens but I will say rarely by breeders those are responsible.
DanSB
Avid Member
Okay sorry I just have a lot of questions!
I for one really appreciate you sharing your expertise here. Thank you for being awesome!
I will wait impatiently until more information arises.
