CLIMATE OF THE NATURAL HABITAT OF THE MIGHTY YEMEN CHAMELEON

[NashansCamos]

I posted that. It does eat it though.

not as a staple diet lol

 

[NashansCamos]

not as a staple diet lol

or a treat even. To offer your cham pothos....not good. They just occasionaly take bites out of it. rarely

 

[Deejay]

I think there is more to it than this. In a glass terrarium with a Jackson 100% humidity every night without dry out afternoons will cause problems with bacteria and mold. Discretion is needed here.

 

[Mrjamwin]

This is interesting because a few weeks ago I was doing some research into the climate of Yemen, what the temperature and humidity was like and I found that what we see on care sheets in regards to temperatures and humidity levels was different then what their actual environment is. So thank you PetNcs for posting this.

 

[Reptofreak]

no let me be more explicit.

the IR source , basking spot lamp is the one to be limited to 2 hours daily while the UV source should be on (almost) all day.

the reason is:

they BASK short
but
they are exposed to UV of low levels whole day.

You state this as if it will extend the life of a Cham out past ten years, I’m dubious. If this is true and you want us all to believe it’s beneficial, where’s your proof? Or are we just supposed to believe you because you state like it’s a fact?

 

[Nancygal]

so went out got linear uvb set up, perked up immediately. She's been in a mood for a couple of days. since it is getting close to august part of me is wondering if she is gonna lay soon. But, she does go thru her moods. She has been adapting to me more and getting on her big branch to be moved when tending to her habitat. Today she got on my hand and didn't want to get off, lol.

 

[nightanole]

You state this as if it will extend the life of a Cham out past ten years, I’m dubious. If this is true and you want us all to believe it’s beneficial, where’s your proof? Or are we just supposed to believe you because you state like it’s a fact?

What proof do you need? Pete is the "Yemen Man". He is the unofficial introducer of the veiled into the pet trade in the 1990's. Before Pete's efforts, zoos were paying $1500 for breeding pairs.

I 100% agree with Petes recommendations "for raising veileds in the EU" to extend their lives to an average 10 years, vs the us pet trade age of 6-7 years.


However (there is always a big "but") raising a veiled in Florida is going to be different than raising a veiled in Germany. To create the artificial environment that Pete recommends, is impossible in certain regions. Even if you reached the temps, the air conditioning(or heating) in the enclosed environment will be detrimental.

I know this because i have done it. Go ahead and try to mimic Pete in ohio winter, everyone will end up with URI. Try to do the same in the summer when the overnight air temps are higher than Pete's basking temp recommendations. lets see how well that cham does in 24/7 air conditioning to keep the temps below 70...



Im in the boat "prep for your area" and hope for the best.

 

[PetNcs]

You state this as if it will extend the life of a Cham out past ten years, I’m dubious. If this is true and you want us all to believe it’s beneficial, where’s your proof? Or are we just supposed to believe you because you state like it’s a fact?

look, I do not want to cause any arguing, no aggression, like everyone, I have the right to have my own opinion.

so, consider all my commentssterting IMHO

so, IMHO,
There is enougj evidence that aging in heterotherm animals, including chameleons, is a function of temperature.
By definition, an animal, whoch is for millions of years set to behave in a model (an dthisnis not MHO, but thisnis my own observataion repeated about 500times during the studies of Yemen chameleons in the wild in Yemen itself) they sepnd nownin july, whichbis second warmest konth in the year, basking maximum 40minutes a day at temperatures never exceeding 80’F on the spot and the rest if the day they spend in shade at maximum 80F ambient temperatire. At night, they sit in dense fog at 60s.

if they are offered to bask much higher (some cares sheets recommendation go over 90 to100 and allow them not to stay at night at 60s but at 70s, it means they are forced to live on aberage 10degrees above their absokute natiral maximum, it inevitably will speed up their metabolism and they will die younger.
itnis basic biology of ectotherms, no deep science. Fact, and MHO

i jabe punlished papers reporting on longevith of chameleons, i do kot care what you in person believe, I see my role in oraenting dacts and opinions for you kind comsideration.

judge yiurself

why colder kept yemen chameleons exceed 12 years age easily
Why american Yemen chameleons are said by this site that “With proper husbandry veiled chameleons can live 5-7 years on average.”

when one of the sunstantial differencesnin the xare recommendation is the temperature

1.
in my case backed up
Rigorous climatic data and field studies
2.
In the case of this site based on NOTHING

You state this as if it will extend the life of a Cham out past ten years, I’m dubious. If this is true and you want us all to believe it’s beneficial, where’s your proof? Or are we just supposed to believe you because you state like it’s a fact?

 

[PetNcs]

I find both of these situations disconcerting, especially if modifying care as you specify could double the lifespan of these animals in captivity.

There's a lot to assimilate here and on the https://www.archaius.eu/ site (new to me) you mentioned.

I look forward to your post about panther chameleons. I hope it will be possible to keep one successfully at room temperatures or above; I can handle controlling humidity, but chilling down an enclosure below 68°F/20°C is not feasible for me.

you can also refer to my site

www.chameleons.info

 

[Reptofreak]

so, consider all my commentssterting IMHO

Much better. Wasn’t arguing, just stating my opinion as you did. I just have a pet peeve about people stating observational opinion as scientific fact.

 

[DocZ]

I haven’t had time to read this yet, but here’s an article discussing the effects of temperature on longevity
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4486781/pdf/10522_2015_Article_9571.pdf

 

[DocZ]

no let me be more explicit.

the IR source , basking spot lamp is the one to be limited to 2 hours daily while the UV source should be on (almost) all day.

the reason is:

they BASK short
but
they are exposed to UV of low levels whole day.

For exposure to low levels of UV, what do you recommend? UVI 1-3?

 

[PetNcs]

For exposure to low levels of UV, what do you recommend? UVI 1-3?

In the wild they sit in 0-2 in the bushes and bask at around 6
I would do same

 

[CasqueAbove]

I do not know why people get confused by @PetNcs , byt maybe this will help simplify some concepts about temp and humidity.

First take cages out of the equation as it adds to many variables that would be dealt with on an individual level.

So now imagine you are going to take 2 trips this year to beautiful Yemen, and it is beautiful and I will avoid politics, but save Yemen.

Now you will be visiting Ibb and driving to Yarim. One trip will be in December and one in June.

Now figure out what cloths you will need for each. Warm gear, Cold gear, Wet Dry.

If you look at it this way you'll get a better concept of their natural world.

 

[kinyonga]

I think temperature plays a part too...but I also think diet is a part of longevity too.

Also found this to be interesting......
https://phys.org/news/2019-10-2c-warmer-lizards-healthily.html

 

[Klyde O'Scope]

However (there is always a big "but")

I'm hearing rap lyrics in my head, and I don't even ascribe to that (but) particular fetish...

raising a veiled in Florida is going to be different than raising a veiled in Germany. To create the artificial environment that Pete recommends, is impossible in certain regions. Even if you reached the temps, the air conditioning(or heating) in the enclosed environment will be detrimental.

I know this because i have done it. Go ahead and try to mimic Pete in ohio winter, everyone will end up with URI. Try to do the same in the summer when the overnight air temps are higher than Pete's basking temp recommendations. lets see how well that cham does in 24/7 air conditioning to keep the temps below 70...

Im in the boat "prep for your area" and hope for the best.

I think this is a really good point, yet it makes me feel both better and worse at the same time.

I've waited (literally) a lifetime to get a chameleon because I wanted to do it "right," and things just weren't—such is life. Now that I have the time (retired) and resources to do it "right," I'm now finding myself vexed by this conundrum quandary: Will "'prep for your area' and hope for the best" be good enough, or should I abandon this lifelong (now bucket list) dream entirely? (This is a rhetorical question for my own introspection.)

Dang. ?

 

[nightanole]

I'm hearing rap lyrics in my head, and I don't even ascribe to that (but) particular fetish...


I think this is a really good point, yet it makes me feel both better and worse at the same time.

I've waited (literally) a lifetime to get a chameleon because I wanted to do it "right," and things just weren't—such is life. Now that I have the time (retired) and resources to do it "right," I'm now finding myself vexed by this conundrum quandary: Will "'prep for your area' and hope for the best" be good enough, or should I abandon this lifelong (now bucket list) dream entirely? (This is a rhetorical question for my own introspection.)

Dang. ?

I started "chameleoning" in the 1990's as a teenager. I had to save up for a Captive bred veiled, because i did not want to get one of those cheap non hardy parsons. So even with ; OHIO, a vita-lite(we didnt have lizard lights back then, so you are talking .25 UVI), and a mostly pinky diet. He lived 7 years and always had excellent vet reports.


With modern tech and practices, this should be easy. But as i said the best advice i ever got was "prep for your area". I do not worry about keeping the humdity up while the air conditioner is running in Florida. The Floridian is not worried about keeping the humidity up (while keeping mildew down) running the furnace with the windows closed 7 months a year like ohio.

 

[NashansCamos]

With modern tech and practices, this should be easy.

and this forum

 

[Klyde O'Scope]

First take cages out of the equation as it adds to many variables that would be dealt with on an individual level.

I get your point, and don't disagree with the thought experiment (I've often responded to questions here citing climatological conditions), but on a forum where the main topic of discussion is keeping animals in captivity, I don't see how taking enclosures* out of the equation is pragmatic. YMMV.

If I've been too pedantic, I apologize.

*Personally, I prefer "enclosure" to "cage".

Enclosure is a general, technical term for a cage or pen. It is generally neutral with no negative connotations.
https://www.englishforums.com/English/CageEnclosurePen/bcjcqx/post.htm

 

[Klyde O'Scope]

look, I do not want to cause any arguing, no aggression, like everyone, I have the right to have my own opinion.

Everyone absolutely has a right to their own opinions. I appreciate your information, viewpoints, and passion for the subject matter. I also appreciate the information and work that's gone into the 2 websites mentioned; I have both bookmarked, and have taken several notes (so far—there is much to digest) into my OneNote notebook on reptiles.

1.
in my case backed up
Rigorous climatic data and field studies
2.
In the case of this site based on NOTHING

However, I have trouble reconciling "no aggression" with #2. Disagreement notwithstanding, I think it's a bit harsh and dismissive. I have trouble believing the info presented in the Resources here is based on nothing; I expect it's the product of much research & discussion of data, experience & materials available.