Chameleon Slow to Rise

[PabloTheChameleon]

First post here so please let me know if I leave anything out and I will comment!

We have a baby ambilobe panther chameleon right at 2.5 months old. He is in a 24x24x48 bioactive enclosure. We have been feeding gutloaded crickets (repashys bug burger dusted with calcium plus) and giving right around 13 hours of daylight. Feeding twice a day, once in the morning about an hour after lights and mist turn on and about 2 hours before lights turn off and last mist.

Misting schedule is a 10 min mist about 45 mins after lights turn on (6:00am lights on 6:45 mist)a 3 min mist at 12:30 and a 3 min mist at 5:40. Lights off at 7:30.

I think that gives enough background, to the problem we’re having! Our little guy is really slow to wake up in the mornings and it is concerning us. Lights on at 6 as mentioned but won’t even budge when we try to feed him in the morning. He will stay in the exact spot he slept in until around 11am. He is awake, but he is not getting up, just staying in his sleep spot. He has done this the past two days but once he’s up, he is active! He’ll sunbathe under the heat/uvb lamps and wander the cage. Is there something wrong with our little guy or is he just a slow riser?! Pics shown are his sleeping spots and a pic of his enclosure

 

[MissSkittles]

Hi and welcome! How many crickets are you feeding him daily? Are you dusting the crickets with calcium plus?

 

[PabloTheChameleon]

Hi and welcome! How many crickets are you feeding him daily? Are you dusting the crickets with calcium plus?

We try to do 6 in morning and 6 in evening, however, he has had trouble the last two days getting up so I cannot ensure he has eaten 6 in the morning.

Crickets are fed repashys bug burger and dusted with repashys calcium plus with every feeding.

 

[MissSkittles]

We try to do 6 in morning and 6 in evening, however, he has had trouble the last two days getting up so I cannot ensure he has eaten 6 in the morning.

Crickets are fed repashys bug burger and dusted with repashys calcium plus with every feeding.

So, you don’t want to use the Repashy Calcium Plus at all…it’s too high in some vitamins for chameleons (I can’t recall which specifically). Repashy Calcium Plus Lo D is much better BUT you only use the combination multivitamin/D3 for 2 feedings per month. Your little guy has been getting overdosed on D3 and vitamin A, amongst others, but those are the fat soluble ones that build up in the body and can reach toxic levels. Being just a little one, it might be affecting him worse than it would an adult. Unfortunately, there isn’t really a way to remove the overage of vitamins A and D other than time. Do try to keep him well hydrated. If you can get small enough silkworms, that adds some hydration. You want to lightly dust daily feedings in a phosphorus-free calcium without D3 - Repashy Supercal NoD is a great choice as it doesn’t cake like most others. You will want to hold off on using the multivitamin/D3 for at least 2-3 weeks if not a month. Being such a little guy, I’m not sure how long is best. @kinyonga may know.
How many feeders are you offering daily? For such a young baby, he should be getting as many feeder insects as he can eat in about a 15-20 minute period, twice a day. He looks quite thin to me. Maybe add a couple of small wax worms into his daily food. Variety is best anyhow. Here is the feeder graphic. Roaches are quite nutritious too and will hold on to a gutload for longer. Many insect vendors on line offer variety packs, but I’m not sure if the feeders would be small enough. https://www.lindasgonebuggie.com/page/397479218 is a fantastic source for feeders and you can contact her and she’s very easy to work to accommodate your needs. On Facebook she is Linda Bussema. Being in Florida though, her roaches are discoid and not dubia (I’ve heard discoid are more nutritious anyhow).

 

[PabloTheChameleon]

So, you don’t want to use the Repashy Calcium Plus at all…it’s too high in some vitamins for chameleons (I can’t recall which specifically). Repashy Calcium Plus Lo D is much better BUT you only use the combination multivitamin/D3 for 2 feedings per month. Your little guy has been getting overdosed on D3 and vitamin A, amongst others, but those are the fat soluble ones that build up in the body and can reach toxic levels. Being just a little one, it might be affecting him worse than it would an adult. Unfortunately, there isn’t really a way to remove the overage of vitamins A and D other than time. Do try to keep him well hydrated. If you can get small enough silkworms, that adds some hydration. You want to lightly dust daily feedings in a phosphorus-free calcium without D3 - Repashy Supercal NoD is a great choice as it doesn’t cake like most others. You will want to hold off on using the multivitamin/D3 for at least 2-3 weeks if not a month. Being such a little guy, I’m not sure how long is best. @kinyonga may know.
How many feeders are you offering daily? For such a young baby, he should be getting as many feeder insects as he can eat in about a 15-20 minute period, twice a day. He looks quite thin to me. Maybe add a couple of small wax worms into his daily food. Variety is best anyhow. Here is the feeder graphic. Roaches are quite nutritious too and will hold on to a gutload for longer. Many insect vendors on line offer variety packs, but I’m not sure if the feeders would be small enough. https://www.lindasgonebuggie.com/page/397479218 is a fantastic source for feeders and you can contact her and she’s very easy to work to accommodate your needs. On Facebook she is Linda Bussema. Being in Florida though, her roaches are discoid and not dubia (I’ve heard discoid are more nutritious anyhow).
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Oh my goodness that is just the worst of news! Thank you for all the information and suggestions. We will not dust the crickets anymore. How do we know if we’ve gone too far with the supplements? It has been about a week straight of morning/evening feedings coated in the calcium plus.

Also, side note, do you think he is too small for a smaller hornworm? Or should we stick with crickets and try to get some small dubia roaches?

 

[LizardLurkin]

Supplementation can be confusing. For future reference, in case the wording of supplement scheduling is confusing, here's a little calendar I made!

 

[MissSkittles]

Oh my goodness that is just the worst of news! Thank you for all the information and suggestions. We will not dust the crickets anymore. How do we know if we’ve gone too far with the supplements? It has been about a week straight of morning/evening feedings coated in the calcium plus.

Also, side note, do you think he is too small for a smaller hornworm? Or should we stick with crickets and try to get some small dubia roaches?

If you can get some tiny enough hornworms, sure. The problem is that they grow unbelievably fast…literally overnight can go from just right to way too big. I just had some hawk moths emerge from their cocoons and gave me some eggs last week and they’ve gone from itty bitty eyelash bebes to feeding size for my chameleons in less than a week. My silkworms which hatched out 2-3 weeks ago are still too small for even my smallest leopard gecko, which is why I suggested them. A great feeder and one which doesn’t even need dusting with calcium is bsfl (aka Phoenix worms, calci worms). They are smaller and usually available in most pet stores. You could give some of those in the morning and then something like dubia and silkworms in the evening. Wax worms are also smaller but are fatty, so are for treats. But your baby looks a bit thin, so I would give 1-2 mixed in with the regular staple feeders. Superworms are also fatty treat feeders, but finding small enough ones may be a challenge.
When dusting with whatever supplement, you want it to be done very lightly…just enough to give a slightly dusty appearance to the bugs. If they are looking like powdered donuts, it’s too much.

 

[Beman]

Get a feeder run as well. Load this up. This baby should be taking down at least 2 dozen small crickets a day. Make the changes to the supplements and remember lightly dust not powdered donuts.