Worried about my girl after laying eggs

CLP

New Member
Hi All,

As some of you know from my recent posts, my veiled female just finished laying 39 eggs. It was a bit of a trying experience as she layed them over the course of two days. Anyhow, she came out of her bin on Wednesday. I offered her some superworms Wednesday afternoon and she ate two. I have not been able to get her to eat anything else since. I have offered crickets and superworms (all that I have in stock right now), but no go. She shows some interest i.e. looks at them like she's going to strike, but nothing happens.

She is still quite active, but does have one eye she's keeping closed. I assume she got some sand/dirt in it while in the bin. I flushed it last night with saline and it seemed to help for awhile, but she had it closed again by the time she went to bed and again this morning. I also found the two superworms I gave her Wednesday pooped out almost completely in tact.

I am going to pick up some silkworms and hornworms to see if those "treats" will temp her, but I am starting to really worry. Any input is appreciated.
 

jannb

Chameleon Enthusiast
Not eating after laying in a very bad sign. It is a sign that something in wrong. Get her to the vets ASAP. Veiled girls are normally starving after laying and eating everything. She has to really feel bad not to eat.
 

CLP

New Member
There is a very limited number of experienced vets in my area, and when I say area, I mean 4-5 hours drive. The earliest appointment I can get is Tuesday morning. My only other option is a vet with very little experience with chameleons, and I'm relucatant to do that. ANY advice on what to do between now and then is greatly appreciated! And please keep your fingers crossed for my girl. She is a sweetheart and I'd be devastated to lose her! :(
 

AngieL

Avid Member
She def needs the vet, my girl eats like a pig for days after laying. Is there a bird vet? Next best thing. She will need to be seen sooner than Tuesday as things like this can progress very fast and be fatal. Good luck!
 

jannb

Chameleon Enthusiast
Have you check here for a vet? Don't go into the links just read each post where members here have recommended their vet. https://www.chameleonforums.com/area-area-country-vet-list-32880/
Even a dog and cat vet could take an Xray to see if there's more eggs. Sometimes they have another egg or two that they need to lay and Ocytocin injections will be given and if that doesn't work they need surgery. It could also be more serious. Sometimes they have internal bleeding and bloodwork will show that. Also sometimes something will rupture. She could have Coelomitis like my Sadie just had. https://www.chameleonforums.com/sadies-autopsy-results-114542/
The longer you wait the weaker she will be and the smaller the chance of surviving if she need surgery.

It might be worth trying this link. it's more recent that the ones in the thread. http://www.arav.org/find-a-vet/#Florida
 

CLP

New Member
I understand the urgency, believe me, and I have followed Sadie's story. I live in Nova Scotia, Canada. It is a VERY small province (less than 1 million people in the entire province). It is also very much a farming province, so most vets that specialize, go the farm animal route. That being said, there are ONLY 2 vets that specialize in reptiles here (they also are the "bird" experts), and one other with some basic knowledge that works the emergency clinic here. I can't call them until 8 pm when they open. I have spoken with the clinic I use that happens to have the most knowledgable vet in the province. I have called the other vet they recommend and the only other one (from the emergency clinic) with any experience. Believe me, when I got my chameleons, I did my research. This is all we've got here.

I have looked through the list of vets post-by-post (now and previously). Nothing is even listed in my province nor the adjoining ones. The closet listing is Ontario which would take me 20+ hours to drive. I'm not being lazy or not trying hard enough to find someone that has experience. They just don't exist in any numbers here. I know this is a hard concept for those of you in the US, but it is my reality.

That being said, unless the vet at the emergency clinic with the basic experience is working tonight or over the weekend (there are several that take "turns"), my beautiful girl and I are in trouble. So PLEASE, I don't need any urging to try to find a vet, I am and have done everything I can on that front. What I am looking for at this point is ANY suggestion you may if I can't get her in ASAP.

I will call the emergency clinic when the open, and worst case scenario, maybe I'll have to just take her to whatever vet can see her regarless of experience, and hope for the best.
 

laurie

Retired Moderator
I am right there with you. I live in the US but 30 miles south of Canada. I am below Medicine Hat. I hit temps of -zero. I am 5 1/2 hours form a vet. I learn to handle most things at home. If it were me, I would mix up some bug juice and drip it on her nose. She very well may starting eating. For bug juice I blend bugs, usually crickets and dubia plus pedalite and ensure. Then take a syringe with no needle and slowly drip it on her nose. PM me any time I can help. And no I will not tell you to head for a vet all time as I understand you and I save that for emergency's.
 

CLP

New Member
Thanks Laurie. I will give the bug juice a try if she won't eat the silkworms I'm picking up after work (her favorite). A trip to the vet may still be necessary, I know, but I also don't want to take her to someone that hasn't got a clue what they're doing. Cross your fingers. Hopefully she'll pull through!
 

CLP

New Member
She ate a big juicy hornworm! Oh, I hope she's OK! I will try her on more food in the morning. I also have the ingredients to make bug juice if necessary. Cross your fingers that she'll eat some more tomorrow!
 

Tyaeda

Member
Maybe you can call an expert vet, tell him/her your situation and ask them what they would do if you brought her in. If they tell you what tests they would do, maybe you can take that information to one of your local vets, so they know what to do about it, or what medicines to give? I'm not an expert, just a thought.
 

CLP

New Member
Things are really not looking good. I took her to the emergency clinic today as she seemed to be getting worse. Yesterday she went back into the bin dug and hole, and spent the rest of the day and night in the bin. When she climbed out in the morning, I checked the bin, but no eggs. She was not looking well, so I took her in.

The vet admitted to not being experienced with reptiles, but I told her what I thought the problems is, so they did an x-ray. We say what looked like at least one egg, possibly a few more, but they were not as defined. The vet gave her an oxytocin injections (I can only hope at the right dosage - she says she looked it up) but did not have the "correct" calcium to use in conjunction. Anyhow, that was nearly 3 hours ago. My girl is looking progressively worse. No eggs have been laid and she is currently under her basking light with both eyes closed. I don't know what else to do.

Monday is a holiday here, the only time I can get her into her regular and experience vet is Tuesday. I tried Laurie's bug juice, but she has no interest in anything, including water. Anyone have ANY other suggestions??

Please keep your fingers crossed. I will be SO sad to lose this sweet little girl!
 

jannb

Chameleon Enthusiast
Things are really not looking good. I took her to the emergency clinic today as she seemed to be getting worse. Yesterday she went back into the bin dug and hole, and spent the rest of the day and night in the bin. When she climbed out in the morning, I checked the bin, but no eggs. She was not looking well, so I took her in.

The vet admitted to not being experienced with reptiles, but I told her what I thought the problems is, so they did an x-ray. We say what looked like at least one egg, possibly a few more, but they were not as defined. The vet gave her an oxytocin injections (I can only hope at the right dosage - she says she looked it up) but did not have the "correct" calcium to use in conjunction. Anyhow, that was nearly 3 hours ago. My girl is looking progressively worse. No eggs have been laid and she is currently under her basking light with both eyes closed. I don't know what else to do.

Monday is a holiday here, the only time I can get her into her regular and experience vet is Tuesday. I tried Laurie's bug juice, but she has no interest in anything, including water. Anyone have ANY other suggestions??

Please keep your fingers crossed. I will be SO sad to lose this sweet little girl!

I am so very sad to hear this. It normally takes several oxytocin injection (one every 6 hours) before it works and it doesn't always work on reptiles. If she does lay she will probably just drop the egg/eggs. I will keep you and your girl in my prayers.
 

CLP

New Member
She's had another injection. Cross your fingers that this one works. She's such a sweet girl, it would break my heart to lose her!
 

CLP

New Member
This has been an absolute nightmare. I had sent a PM to ferretinmyshoes yesterday to ask about the dosage of oxytocin they had given my girl. She said that was fine, but expressed surprise about them not having the appropriate calcium (calcium glutonate) as every emergency vet should have it in stock. So, I called the emergency clinic back (it's a holiday here today). If you can believe it, they tried to cut me off when I explained that I had heard from a chameleon expert vet that said they should have the correct calcium. When I said calcium glutonate, they told me that according to their "expert" who happens to be a vet tech that works there, chameleons can't absorb that kind of calcium. I insisted, and they said they'd give the calcium glutonate with another dose of oxytocin, but the calcium would be against their recommendations.

Needless to say, I brought her back in. They took her into the back to give her the injections. When the vet came back she told me that not only had they given her saline for hydration (which I had also asked for), and the calcium, but also "multiple doses" of oxytocin :eek:. I can only assume this was a very dangerous thing to do, but it was too late. The injections were done. I had not asked for "multiple doses" of anything!!! Needless to say, we didn't have to pay for this visit.

The injections were given about 3 hours ago. She has been having VERY strong contractions, but has not passed any eggs. She has been gaping and her eyes are sunken in. Not good! All I can do now is cross my fingers and hope she makes it through this. Hopefully passing her eggs as well.

PLEASE send good thoughts our way. My little girl needs all the help she can get! :(
 

CLP

New Member
This has been an absolute nightmare. I had sent a PM to ferretinmyshoes yesterday to ask about the dosage of oxytocin they had given my girl. She said that was fine, but expressed surprise about them not having the appropriate calcium (calcium glutonate) as every emergency vet should have it in stock. So, I called the emergency clinic back (it's a holiday here today). If you can believe it, they tried to cut me off when I explained that I had heard from a chameleon expert vet that said they should have the correct calcium. When I said calcium glutonate, they told me that according to their "expert" who happens to be a vet tech that works there, chameleons can't absorb that kind of calcium. I insisted, and they said they'd give the calcium glutonate with another dose of oxytocin, but the calcium would be against their recommendations.

Needless to say, I brought her back in. They took her into the back to give her the injections. When the vet came back she told me that not only had they given her saline for hydration (which I had also asked for), and the calcium, but also "multiple doses" of oxytocin :eek:. I can only assume this was a very dangerous thing to do, but it was too late. The injections were done. I had not asked for "multiple doses" of anything!!! Needless to say, we didn't have to pay for this visit.

The injections were given about 3 hours ago. She has been having VERY strong contractions, but has not passed any eggs. She has been gaping and her eyes are sunken in. Not good! All I can do now is cross my fingers and hope she makes it through this. Hopefully passing her eggs as well.

PLEASE send good thoughts our way. My little girl needs all the help she can get! :(

To add further to the nightmare, I just found out my reptile vet is not able to perform surgery on reptile as they are not properly equipped. Before you tell me to find a new vet, please read my earlier posts in this thread. We don't have any others here. They refer to a clinic in the US that is at least a 10 hour drive. Bad enough, but I am scheduled for gallbladder surgery on Wednesday, so can't take her there anyhow.

At this point, I guess there's not much else to do but pray she lays those eggs. Nothing yet though and I fear she's rapidly going downhill.
 
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