Veiled female MBD, possible constipation
- Thread starter Riven
- Start date
D
DavidBuchan
Guest
I've tried the sneak approach, she's too fast for me and shuts her mouth before I get near. I guess tonight we'll try one more time and if she doesn't eat we're going to make bug soup... not exactly what was on the menu but I guess my girls will learn to like it...
Girls plural? You don't all have to have the same meals you know.....most people feed the chams differently from the rest of the family
Well I wasn't sure what to make anyway so I figured I'd just make the same for everyone! LOL
I went in to check on her earlier and she got mad, I guess that means she's feeling better. Oddly enough I have no issues with putting bugs in her mouth, but putting them in a blender kind of reminds me of that part on Gremlins....
I went in to check on her earlier and she got mad, I guess that means she's feeling better. Oddly enough I have no issues with putting bugs in her mouth, but putting them in a blender kind of reminds me of that part on Gremlins....
So... I've done a lot of gross things in my life, working at a vet you do, but today may have been the grossest thing yet. I made up a mix of pureed bug soup... she ate quite of bit off the syringe, so that's good. I'm going to try to take her into the vet tomorrow, but I need to make sure he'll be there, I haven't gotten a hold of him yet, so we'll see. Overall better, I just want to have him double check her with her saggy lip, rule out URI and vitamin deficiency.
Elizadolots
New Member
Oh, please...you are a mother...I'll grant you that pureeing bugs is disgusting, but compare that to the poop viewing you did when you daughter was a baby....
It's great that she took it and you might find her much stronger in the next few days.
Hang in there...It's just like being a Mom...it's hard while it happens, it looks good in retrospect.
It's great that she took it and you might find her much stronger in the next few days.
Hang in there...It's just like being a Mom...it's hard while it happens, it looks good in retrospect.
Definitely feisty today. Ate a little bit of the "soup" today, looked at the worms. If I could just get her eating I know everything would be so much better....
Left a message for the vet, haven't heard back yet, but I can take her tomorrow or Friday as I'm open during the day either of those days.
Left a message for the vet, haven't heard back yet, but I can take her tomorrow or Friday as I'm open during the day either of those days.
Still haven't heard back yet... but need to take her in the morning to get in so we might just take a drive...
I'm thinking it's URI or mouth rot, or possibly both. She's been having excess saliva, her "gums" are now swollen and have a yellowing color to them, and I've been hearing some adventitious noises in her breathing.
Hopefully if we can get this cleared up she'll start eating again. Today there are 2 butter worms missing, I searched the cage looking for them with no success so I'm going to assume they're in her belly!
Can't blame her for not wanting to eat if her mouth if not well. Oh, also yesterday her tongue was sticking out some, been trying to push the fluids to help prevent further dehydration.
I'm thinking it's URI or mouth rot, or possibly both. She's been having excess saliva, her "gums" are now swollen and have a yellowing color to them, and I've been hearing some adventitious noises in her breathing.
Hopefully if we can get this cleared up she'll start eating again. Today there are 2 butter worms missing, I searched the cage looking for them with no success so I'm going to assume they're in her belly!
Can't blame her for not wanting to eat if her mouth if not well. Oh, also yesterday her tongue was sticking out some, been trying to push the fluids to help prevent further dehydration.
Elizadolots
New Member
Sounds like you're on to something. Perhaps a round of antibiotics will help her recovery.
So... can't seem to get a reply from the vet so I talked with the local vet who did her xrays, and he said either way ( mouth rot or URI ) Baytril would work. He's not used to dealing with lizards so yea. I just wanted to verify the dose he gave me, it seems right but since he doesn't have a lot of experience I thought it'd be good to double check. He said .01 ML orally or IM I believe, it's written on the sheet, the afternoon's just been crazy. I do know that I've got some major diluting to do as what I have is Baytril 100 ( 100 mg/mL )
Opps, she's 30 grams for weight forgot to add that.
Opps, she's 30 grams for weight forgot to add that.
BocaJan
New Member
When I fed my rescue I placed the food between her teeth on the side of her mouth and let him take a few chews. Since he didn't have good use of his tongue like your cham, it took awhile to get some chewing done so this way he was able to get a handle on the killing of the bug before I let it off the tweezer. Sometimes I had to use my fingers to kind of keep it it from falling out of his mouth, but with perseverence I was able to help him actually keep the food in his mouth and let him chew it and swallow it down. Eventually he did get his tongue working again.
There is always a danger in the future that the cham will bite their tongue off. Things are never quite right when they are as sick as our two are/were, no matter how much they seem to recover it is never up to normal. We do the best we can do and help them have some quality of life for the time they have.
There is always a danger in the future that the cham will bite their tongue off. Things are never quite right when they are as sick as our two are/were, no matter how much they seem to recover it is never up to normal. We do the best we can do and help them have some quality of life for the time they have.
Elizadolots
New Member
kinyonga, I was hoping you'd have some input on the proper dosage of Baytril. Riven's earlier post said this:
Usual starting dose is 5mg/kg. At her weight she should be getting 0.15mg and at a concentration of 100mg/mL she needs 0.0015 mL, which is an absurdly tiny amount. Technically 0.1mL is too much, but you just can't measure it as any less which is why you got that amount. If you could dilute it out better (mix 0.1mL baytril with 0.9mL water) and then give 0.1mL then the dose will be more appropriate. If you mix it with water you can only give it orally. Injections should be sterile, which water isn't. Injectable baytril oral doesn't taste good.
Last edited:
bechsgaard
New Member
hope she gets better 
SonTigerPantherCham
New Member
Dan, have you not read any of the last 18 pages of this thread? if you had, you would be amazed at what Riven is doing for this Cham
Elizadolots
New Member
ferretinmyshoes, thank you! I knew there were experts here who could help Riven with the dosage.
SonTigerPantherCham, Riven is amazing isn't she? It's so inspiring to come to this thread and see what she's doing.
I'm so grateful to be able to witness it and maybe participate a little. It warms the ancient cockles of my heart, knowing she's doing so much for this little chameleon.
SonTigerPantherCham, Riven is amazing isn't she? It's so inspiring to come to this thread and see what she's doing.
I'm so grateful to be able to witness it and maybe participate a little. It warms the ancient cockles of my heart, knowing she's doing so much for this little chameleon.
Thanks Ferretinyourshoes ( keep 'em out of mine! ) I did dilute by .9 to reduce it and make it more measurable. I'm wondering if I can get some tb syringes... they have ridiculously small increments... I've never tried Baytril, but yea, I've been told it tastes nasty, for the chins we often cut it with dex to make it taste better, but I don't have any dex here. I do have sterile saline, but I'm afraid she doesn't have much muscle to inject into, so that concerns me for injection. I know injection is preferred with chins as it's more effective and doesn't cause digestion issues.
I've been trying to make sure to get at least 1 mL of "bug soup" into her daily, and we got that this morning. I know it's a small goal, but as we achieve that easily I'll bump it up. I had a microdrip IV set around here to make a watering system for her that works better than what we're doing and it moved apparently... so my goal is to find it today and get that set up. I dislike about it that I can't keep easy track of what she's drinking, but I think it will help her hydrate better...
I think it looks like the swelling has reduced some in the corners of her mouth, still hear some crackling and popping in her nose when she breathes and she's been mouth breathing a little, which I'm sure doesn't help her mouth hydration. Might do some more subq fluids today if I don't see her drinking more, she hates that worse than her calcium shots...
She's moving around a lot better, much better control of her legs, and I really think if we can get this mouth thing under control we'll be golden. Today we're going to clean her cage super good to kill and bacteria in there and try to promote healing when it warms up a bit more and we'll put her outside for some sun. Her chin, which I can't ever seem to retain the term for, is healing up well. I hope it eventually makes a full recovery, I know the skin will, but I don't know if the little "skin tags" under there will. If that's the worst thing she comes out with we're doing great.
Most of all.... Thanks to everyone who's been following. I'd be lying not to say it's been a frustrating battle, but each little achievement seems so big and that helps. We wouldn't be where we are right now without the help and support of everyone here. Every battle needs an army, and although it may seem like I'm doing the work, you guys are the army behind her.
I've been trying to make sure to get at least 1 mL of "bug soup" into her daily, and we got that this morning. I know it's a small goal, but as we achieve that easily I'll bump it up. I had a microdrip IV set around here to make a watering system for her that works better than what we're doing and it moved apparently... so my goal is to find it today and get that set up. I dislike about it that I can't keep easy track of what she's drinking, but I think it will help her hydrate better...
I think it looks like the swelling has reduced some in the corners of her mouth, still hear some crackling and popping in her nose when she breathes and she's been mouth breathing a little, which I'm sure doesn't help her mouth hydration. Might do some more subq fluids today if I don't see her drinking more, she hates that worse than her calcium shots...
She's moving around a lot better, much better control of her legs, and I really think if we can get this mouth thing under control we'll be golden. Today we're going to clean her cage super good to kill and bacteria in there and try to promote healing when it warms up a bit more and we'll put her outside for some sun. Her chin, which I can't ever seem to retain the term for, is healing up well. I hope it eventually makes a full recovery, I know the skin will, but I don't know if the little "skin tags" under there will. If that's the worst thing she comes out with we're doing great.
Most of all.... Thanks to everyone who's been following. I'd be lying not to say it's been a frustrating battle, but each little achievement seems so big and that helps. We wouldn't be where we are right now without the help and support of everyone here. Every battle needs an army, and although it may seem like I'm doing the work, you guys are the army behind her.
Injection is not preferred in reptiles, especially into the muscle. Baytril IM injections can cause muscle necrosis where you give it. If you were to give an injection it should be SC. But oral is actually better because it works just as well and you don't have the sensitive gut flora in chams like chins do. If you can give her a mL of bug soap just mix the baytril into that so it's not separate and doesn't taste so bad! Make sure she is well hydrated when giving baytril.
You are doing an amazing job! Every vet hopes to have clients like you.
You are doing an amazing job! Every vet hopes to have clients like you.
