Veiled Chameleon puffing, posturing swaying

[Dql3218]

I have a young, female veiled chameleon, my son has named her Karen b/c she always looks angry. We've had her for about 2 weeks now and I know that's a short time but I'm hoping to get ahead of the issue. Every time I reach into her enclosure she puffs up and sways toward me, like if a bully were to lunge at you to get you to flinch; she does this even if I'm not reaching toward her, for instance if Im just reaching in to get her feeding dish on the opposite side of the enclosure. I haven't really tried to handle her yet as I'm trying to let her acclimate to her environment. I've tried to hand feed her a couple of crickets, but she just stares at me, puffed up, and swinging; she won't even look at the food.

A little backstory. She is my 2nd chameleon, my first was/is a juvenile male panther (about 10m old). We got Karen from Petsmart, and I'd guess her age at probably 4-5m based on her size. At the pet store she was friendly, she let me handle her with no issues. I have her in a full screen enclosure (16×16×30), lots of vines for climbing, a medium size live hosta that provides good shade and concealment. She has a UVB/halogen lamp combo and a UVB/Ceramic heater combo both running on a 12h timer (the ceramic heater stays on for 24h to maintain moderate ambient heat through the night). I run a fogger for her over night and spritz the enclosure 3-4x a day ( Im getting a mister system set up, just waiting on parts atm). She is eating well, roughly 15-20 small/med dubia roaches a day, and the occasional horn worm and/or a couple of large superworms. She is active within the enclosure, moving around quite a bit.

Really I'm just looking for advice on how to socialize her without stressing her out. The panther is very social, he loves to be handled, and I know that veiled chameleons can be finicky. So any advice is welcome. Thanks in advance.

 

[AmandaS]

First, I'd like to inform you that you have a handsome male. Second, he will likely be angry all the time. Karen's are like that.

What are the temps and uv readings you're getting from the halogen/uvb?? And what are your nighttime temps? I wouldn't use a heater unless your temps drop below 40 at night.

 

[jamest0o0]

I would just like to second everything said here^ And there is a good chance a healthy veiled will never tolerate handling. Panthers are much friendlier generally speaking. Many panthers you don’t really have to do anything with and they’ll warm up to you. Veileds can be chill, but often are grumpy no matter what you do.

 

[Beman]

I agree with everything above.... Veileds can be nasty as far as their temperament. They honestly do not want anyone in their space at all. Make sure he can not see your Panther or this will just aggravate him even more. The key with a Veiled is food... If you can associate yourself with the food then they will tolerate you slightly. Here is my blog I did hopefully it will help. https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/building-trust-with-your-chameleon.2396/

 

[Lindasjackson]

Hi and welcome! Just some friendly questions and advice. Is your uvb bulb a long linear one? What is the strength and brand? Chameleons don’t need heat at night at all. They enjoy and actually need a good temp drop at night so you won’t need the ceramic heater at all.

 

[Lindasjackson]

You might want to do a husbandryreview just to make sure you’ve got everything perfect for your guy so he can have a long healthy life with you. Here’s a link to the questions, just fill them in and paste back

• Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
• Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
• Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
• Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
• Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
• Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
• History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
• Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
• Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
• Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
• Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
• Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
• Location - Where are you geographically located?

Current Problem - The current problem you are concerned about.

--------------

Please Note:

1. The more details you provide the better and more accurate help you will receive.
2. Photos can be very helpful.

Last edited: Jan 20, 2010
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[BostonKeith]

Attitude is a understatement This is how my girl gets when she sees soil gnats. She will be basking and charge 4 feet down to go get a closer look. Yet she barely shows colors when i rummage her crib. Not sure if shes more upset or excited lol

 

[Dql3218]

Hi and welcome! Just some friendly questions and advice. Is your uvb bulb a long linear one? What is the strength and brand? Chameleons don’t need heat at night at all. They enjoy and actually need a good temp drop at night so you won’t need the ceramic heater at all.

Thank you for the reply. My UV bulb

I agree with everything above.... Veileds can be nasty as far as their temperament. They honestly do not want anyone in their space at all. Make sure he can not see your Panther or this will just aggravate him even more. The key with a Veiled is food... If you can associate yourself with the food then they will tolerate you slightly. Here is my blog I did hopefully it will help. https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/building-trust-with-your-chameleon.2396/

The veiled and the panthers enclosures are next to eachother, but there is a barrier between the two. They cannot see each other.

Thank you for the link, I look forward to reading it this evening.

 

[BostonKeith]

I would ditch the uv bulb and get a linear t5 with a 6%. Those bulbs put out almost no uvb. Much Love!

 

[Dql3218]

Chameleon - Juvenile male veiled chameleon, appx 6" from nose to tail base. I've had him for about a month now. Names "Dink" (thanks to my son)

Handling - I handled him in the shop with no issues. However I have not handled him since placing him in his enclosure at my home. He is very aggressive toward and encroachment into his habitat, even swatting, hissing and snapping at me when I reach for his food dish.

Feeding - I feed the a mix of dubia roaches and BSFL, with the occasional crickets or superworms for variety, and I treat them to a blue horn worm about once a week. The veiled typically gets 10-12 medium dubias and 12-15 med BSFL per feeding; which is typically around 1700. The roaches get dubia diet (Ingredients include: Wheat middlings, ground oats, wheat germ, brewers dried yeast, dehydrated alfalfa meal, dried beet pulp) and some fresh spinach and berries.

Supplements - I use Rep-Cal without Vit-D to dust the roaches. Currently no other supplements.

Watering - Currently I use a spray bottle and spritz the enclosure 3-4x a day. I do see them drinking from time to time. I run a fogger at night.

Fecal Description - I'd say it has a normal consistency, firm but not hard. Typically dark color with white towards one end. To my knowledge no parasite testing has been done.

History - I don't have much hx on him. We got him from PetSmart. He's relatively small, so I'm assuming he's just young. He seemed fine with handling at the petstore, I handled him for about 15-20m there. He was active, mobile and docile. But since he's been at multiple home his demeanor has changed. I attributed it to stress from the move and a new environment, so I haven't been really aggressive toward handling, I want him to feel safe.

Cage Type - His current cage is a full screen enclosure, 16x16x30. I have plans to move him to a larger enclosure in the next couple of months. I'm looking at either a 24x24x48 or 18x36x36. I'm open to suggestions.

Lighting - Currently he has a zoo-med tropical combo light, 1 DayLight Blue 60w Bulb, 1 ReptiSun Mini Compact 5.0 (13w) Fluorescent Bulb. Lights are on a timer, on from 0800-2015 every day. This lighting setup will be replaced when I upgrade the enclosure.

Temperature - Temp ranges from about 69°- 95°? Lowest overnight temp is 68°. Measured with a digital thermometer probe in the enclosure?

Humidity - humidity varies between 60% to 80%? It drops during the day while I'm at work. I currently spray the enclosures with a bottle but I am preparing to install a mister system to provide more consistency. Measured with a digital hydrometer probe in the enclosure.

Plants - Currently he has a planted hosta, appx 18-20" tall in the middle of the enclosure which provides lots of leafy cover.

Placement - The enclosure is located in my living room, against an exterior wall. There is a floor register next to the stand, but it is usually closed. I have a 12" vaulted ceiling with a fan that runs on high 24/7 and the home thermostat is set to 68°.

Location - I live in Southern Illinois, just south of St. Louis, Mo

Current Problem - It's not so much a problem at this point, I'm really just looking more for advice. But, my veiled cham is extremely aggressive whenever I reach into his habitat; even if I'm just reaching in to retrieve his food dish. I would really like to try and socialize him so that he would be more amenable to handling. I enjoy taking my panther outside and letting him get fresh air and natural sunlight, and I'd like to be able to do this for the veiled as well.

I am relatively new to chameleons, so please feel free to make any suggestions/corrections to my current methodologies. Thank you.

 

[Dql3218]

I would ditch the uv bulb and get a linear t5 with a 6%. Those bulbs put out almost no uvb. Much Love!

I have plans to upgrade his lighting along with his enclosure here in the very near future! But thanks for the advice!

 

[Dql3218]

First, I'd like to inform you that you have a handsome male. Second, he will likely be angry all the time. Karen's are like that.

What are the temps and uv readings you're getting from the halogen/uvb?? And what are your nighttime temps? I wouldn't use a heater unless your temps drop below 40 at night.

Ty for the advice, I have removed the night time heating lamp. General temps range from about 70°-95° throughout the enclosure during the day, and my home thermostat is set to 68°, and I can pretty much guarantee the temps don't drop below that at night.

 

[Dql3218]

Hi and welcome! Just some friendly questions and advice. Is your uvb bulb a long linear one? What is the strength and brand? Chameleons don’t need heat at night at all. They enjoy and actually need a good temp drop at night so you won’t need the ceramic heater at all.

Thx for the heads up. A few other users gave me the same advice as well, so I have removed the night time heater from his enclosure.

 

[Morpheo's Mom]

Hi! Looking at the info you put I see you don't have a multivitamin or calcium with d3. You should buy some Reptivite with d3 and dust food every 2 weeks with it

 

[BostonKeith]

95 is too hot. A male is happy at 85

 

[BostonKeith]

Watering - Currently I use a spray bottle and spritz the enclosure 3-4x a day. I do see them drinking from time to time. I run a fogger at night.

You want to be misting at night and morning before or after lights are on.
Will post image attached with recommend hydration schedule.

Cage Type - His current cage is a full screen enclosure, 16x16x30. I have plans to move him to a larger enclosure in the next couple of months. I'm looking at either a 24x24x48 or 18x36x36. I'm open to suggestions.

24x24x48 is the recommend minimum.

Your uvb lighting and a automatic mister should be your 1st upgrades. Followed by a enclosure soon after.
Get a T5 HO arcadia 6% sized for the enclosure that he will forever be in. Your uvb should span the entire length of enclosure. Best of luck of your dragon journey!

 

[MissSkittles]

Hi. You’ve been getting great advice. I just want to add my 2 cents.
Your variety of feeders is great, but you may want to start decreasing the number of feeders you’re giving. Veileds are bottomless pits when it comes to food and can easily become obese. Also, usually feeding early in the day is preferable so that they have time to bask and properly digest. For gutloading, attaching a graphic. I would eliminate the spinach since it contains high levels of oxalates which can bind to calcium. Lower oxalates greens include dandelion, mustard, turnip, collards, arugula etc, but not kale.
Also, your humidity is too high for a veiled. Ideal daytime range is between 30-50%. It is a challenge if your panther is next to your veiled as panther humidity range is between 50-70%. I have the same and try to maintain a compromise of humidity between 45-50%.
Also giving a safe plant graphic. Having lots of plants will provide more hiding spots and help your cham feel more secure. If your enclosure is on the floor, I suggest raising it up as height also makes for security for chams.
Veileds are rather notorious for their sassiness…just another reason we love them. Moving slow and avoiding direct and prolonged eye contact may help reduce some of the aggression you’re seeing. Several times a week I just spend several minutes with each of my chams, slowly reaching & resting a hand near them and just letting them know I’m not a threat. One of my girls who I’ve had for going on 3 years just isn’t getting the memo and still fiercely tries to attack (when she isn’t thinking my fingers are fat worms and trying to eat them). You could try getting a feeding station and setting it close to or even on the door to avoid needing to reach inside fully.

 

[Dql3218]

Hi. You’ve been getting great advice. I just want to add my 2 cents.
Your variety of feeders is great, but you may want to start decreasing the number of feeders you’re giving. Veileds are bottomless pits when it comes to food and can easily become obese. Also, usually feeding early in the day is preferable so that they have time to bask and properly digest. For gutloading, attaching a graphic. I would eliminate the spinach since it contains high levels of oxalates which can bind to calcium. Lower oxalates greens include dandelion, mustard, turnip, collards, arugula etc, but not kale.
Also, your humidity is too high for a veiled. Ideal daytime range is between 30-50%. It is a challenge if your panther is next to your veiled as panther humidity range is between 50-70%. I have the same and try to maintain a compromise of humidity between 45-50%.
Also giving a safe plant graphic. Having lots of plants will provide more hiding spots and help your cham feel more secure. If your enclosure is on the floor, I suggest raising it up as height also makes for security for chams.
Veileds are rather notorious for their sassiness…just another reason we love them. Moving slow and avoiding direct and prolonged eye contact may help reduce some of the aggression you’re seeing. Several times a week I just spend several minutes with each of my chams, slowly reaching & resting a hand near them and just letting them know I’m not a threat. One of my girls who I’ve had for going on 3 years just isn’t getting the memo and still fiercely tries to attack (when she isn’t thinking my fingers are fat worms and trying to eat them). You could try getting a feeding station and setting it close to or even on the door to avoid needing to reach inside fully.
View attachment 326287View attachment 326288

Awesome advice and graphics, theses are hugely helpful. The reason for feeding later in the day is more necessity than choice. I leave for work at about 0630 in the morning, and on top of getting 2 small boys up and out the door for school my chams are still asleep at that time, and I don't want to disturb them.

As for the plants, his current enclosure is small-ish, and I don't want to overcrowd the space, that's why I went with the hosta, it covers the bottom 2/3 of the enclosure with shady area, and the broad leaves provide lots of surface area for the mist to pool. Once I upgrade the enclosure I'll be able to add a better variety of live plants for him. As for the volume of feeders, that was just from observation; he would eat all of his roaches and fly larvae, and then he would also start eating the leaves.I assumed I wasn't feeding him enough since I had read that juveniles can be ravenous and some may even eat 2x a day. But I can certainly dial him back a bit, that's no problem.

 

[kinyonga]

You said..."Supplements - I use Rep-Cal without Vit-D to dust the roaches. Currently no other supplements"...this might be part of the reason he's eating the leaves. You should be using a vitamin powder like reptivite with D3 and preformed vitamin A in it twice a month ( every two weeks).

 

[Lindasjackson]

You can put his feeders in at 5 or 6 in the morning and you won’t disturb your chams. Then they can eat in the morning and have time to digest their food before the afternoon cools down. They really need to eat n the morning for this reason.