Thinking of going Senegal

[arkist]

Still doing alot of research but I think I have settled on getting Senegal. Because they are on the smaller side, I will be able to provide him with relativly more space then I would a large species.

I have read that Senegals can be kept in a 16x16x30 encloser. Is that accurate?

I understand that the majority of Senegal's are WC, and thus can carry parasites. How many times should I have him tested before he would be considered "safe"?

I'm also having difficulty finding where to purchase a sengal from. So far http://www.reptilesncritters.com/senegal-chameleons.html is the only place I have seen that sells Senegals. Are there any other reliable sources out there? Preferably one that has CB Senegals.

Many more questions to follow I'm sure, but for now, I need to find out what encloser I'm getting so that I can design my mist/drip/drain system.

 

[bllanosr]

I'm new to chameleons as well and I'm still at the research stage before I get my very first. I've only heard of the senegal chameleon from another post and they do look pretty. However I don't think they are one of the beginner chameleons so I would be cautious of that species just yet. Try talking to Brad Ramsey, Kent (I think) or one of the people who have keep those (it's listed in one of the threads). But if you're not going to get the typical veiled or panther as beginner chameleon I would personally go for the carpets. They look great and also require a smaller enclousure. Oh yeah thanks for bring up that reptilesncritters.com, I've never heard of it. Well if you didn't know other sites that our reputable and have a wide collection are lllreptile.com and flchams.com. Good luck on getting your chameleon.

 

[arkist]

I'm new to chameleons as well and I'm still at the research stage before I get my very first. I've only heard of the senegal chameleon from another post and they do look pretty. However I don't think they are one of the beginner chameleons so I would be cautious of that species just yet. Try talking to Brad Ramsey, Kent (I think) or one of the people who have keep those (it's listed in one of the threads). But if you're not going to get the typical veiled or panther as beginner chameleon I would personally go for the carpets. They look great and also require a smaller enclousure. Oh yeah thanks for bring up that reptilesncritters.com, I've never heard of it. Well if you didn't know other sites that our reputable and have a wide collection are lllreptile.com and flchams.com. Good luck on getting your chameleon.

I've looked into carpet chams, but they are a little too small for me. I beleive the Senegal size (<12") is right where I would like to be at. They are kept much like veileds, but I don't have the space for an adult veiled, thus why I went to Senegal. I have not run into any issues that appear to make them harder to keep (besides commonly being WC).

Thank you for your advice, but I have checked LLL as well as FL and neither of them carry Senegals

 

[dectr6]

You might want to check out this article on senegal's. It lists this as a very difficult species to keep due to a very high parasite load. http://www.adcham.com/html/taxonomy/species/chsenegalensis.html. Have you thought of a CB rudis? These are stunning little chams that can usually be found cb with a little work. Try nick mole at first choice reptiles. I've had a few of these years ago and their great little chameleons. Good luck. David

 

[arkist]

So are there no CB Senegals at all?

 

[dectr6]

I've never heard of any being bred successfully. Maybe other members will have more info. Good luck with your search. David

 

[arkist]

/facepalm

alrighty I guess its back to the drawing board.

Thanks for your help, Ill be back after a few more days of research

 

[dectr6]

You might write Nick Mole at First choice and see if he can get any farm raised senegals out of Tanzania. He can usually get things nobody else can. The website is www.firstchoicereptiles.com. He will have a list of what he has and also what he expects to be recieving.

 

[Brad Ramsey]

People have had some trouble acclimating WC senegals and they do usually have some parasite issues.

As far as I know any captive breeding success is very minimal or not at all in the States (this is why I want to take on this project)
I think CB senegals could be a very attractive offering.

Unfortunately, the WC ones are not very highly regarded and you won't find many people who even bother with them.

Don't count a WC one out if you find one though. A lot of people have had good success acclimating them and they have a decent life span.
You have help on the forums from some of these people.

-Brad

 

[dectr6]

Brad, Do I have my species mixed up or is the senegal the one that has issues with iodine in it's diet?

 

[Brad Ramsey]

Brad, Do I have my species mixed up or is the senegal the one that has issues with iodine in it's diet?

I can't say one way or the other.
I am not aware of any iodine issues with senegalensis, but I am really just starting to learn specifics about the species myself.

-Brad

 

[arkist]

People have had some trouble acclimating WC senegals and they do usually have some parasite issues.

As far as I know any captive breeding success is very minimal or not at all in the States (this is why I want to take on this project)
I think CB senegals could be a very attractive offering.

Unfortunately, the WC ones are not very highly regarded and you won't find many people who even bother with them.

Don't count a WC one out if you find one though. A lot of people have had good success acclimating them and they have a decent life span.
You have help on the forums from some of these people.

-Brad

I do have a source for obtaining a Senegal, but I'm sure that they are WC.

So what is the process for getting them tested/cleaned? And how "safe" are they once they are treated?

 

[Brad Ramsey]

You would want to set up the environment, get a dripper working properly and then (once the animal is in the enclosure) be sure to do a decent amount of misting ... a few times a day for the first couple of weeks.

When you are able to collect a fecal sample, take it to the vet to test for parasites. Senegals are prone to subcutaneous worms as well so a wellness check (actual visit with the chameleon) is a good idea.

Be sure to mention the possibility of subcutaneous nematodes to the vet so he/she is sure to check for them. They may have to be cut out if present.
You can look for them as well, if you are able to see the animal before purchasing. They look like little worms under the skin.

A worming treatment will be prescribed by the vet if parasites are present (likely).
Subsequent fecal checks are also in order to insure that the animal is clean.

I would not do any of the vet visit or treatment for the first couple of weeks. Make sure to water and feed really well and get the animal comfortable in the new environment first.

-Brad

 

[arkist]

This is actually very close to what I have been planning on doing. In fact I plan on having the entire setup; encloser, mysting/dripping/draining, foliage, lighting, and have humity, uvb, and heat thoroughly tested before even purchasing my cham. Obviously the first step is deciding definitively which cham is going to be obtained, so the appropriate cage size can be used in the pre purchase testing, thus where I am at now.

My concern now is about the safety of having a parasite infested chameleon in house where my family lives. Is it unsafe to a cham with a heavy parasite load in the house? What about after he has been appropreiatly treated? Will it be safe to hand feed him or handle him?

 

[Brad Ramsey]

You are pretty safe.
You should always wash your hands after working with reptiles or their enclosures, etc. anyway.

-Brad

 

[arkist]

So when your treating a chameleon with parasites, you do so to ensure the health of the chameleon, not because they present a danger to humans? And of course I will use careful handwashing practices before and after handling any chameleon.

 

[Brad Ramsey]

Yes and excellent!

Someone will surely bring up roundworms, coccidia etc ... still if you are clean and careful, I say you should not worry about contracting anything yourself.

-Brad

 

[arkist]

Brad thank you so much.

Your input has been so helpful

So would a 16x16x30 be big enough for senegal? I can go bigger but it would probably have to be an apogee cage if I did.

 

[Brad Ramsey]

That size is perfect.

-Brad

 

[arkist]

Just an update:

I spoke with reptilesncritters, the only place I can find that will actually sell a Senegal chameleon. Apparently the reason there are no CB Senegals is that the parasites carried by Senegals are easly transmitted to other animals. You can see how this would be a problem for breeders and would deter them from chosing to breed this species.

But as long as you follow basic cleanliness procedures as you would with any reptile, they are harmless.