So I contacted Petsmart's corporate office...

[FrankTheTank]

I agree, it is stupid to set up a cage improperly because someone might complain about the lack of access to water! It would be much simpler to explain the proper husbandry to the person complaining or even easier put a sign on the cage explaining why there is no water bowl. The problem is that the employee may not even know the correct way to water a chameleon. What was most infuriating the day I was speaking to the manager at PETCO was that the chameleon looked ill and she insisted it was cleared by the vet "just the other day". She also said that the chameleon was well known to the veterinary practice suggesting it had been chronically ill over a long period of time. I told her that it may have been cleared the other day but it is clearly ill again and should be taken back to the vet. I don't know what happened to it as I left my cart where it was standing and walked out of the store. I haven't been back since.

I'm glad some of you get where I am coming from. This is what I am trying to get across.

 

[fluxlizard]

Originally Posted by ridgebax1 View Post
I agree, it is stupid to set up a cage improperly because someone might complain about the lack of access to water! It would be much simpler to explain the proper husbandry to the person complaining or even easier put a sign on the cage explaining why there is no water bowl. The problem is that the employee may not even know the correct way to water a chameleon. What was most infuriating the day I was speaking to the manager at PETCO was that the chameleon looked ill and she insisted it was cleared by the vet "just the other day". She also said that the chameleon was well known to the veterinary practice suggesting it had been chronically ill over a long period of time. I told her that it may have been cleared the other day but it is clearly ill again and should be taken back to the vet. I don't know what happened to it as I left my cart where it was standing and walked out of the store. I haven't been back since.
I'm glad some of you get where I am coming from. This is what I am trying to get across.

While I agree with all of the above, I can also see the other side a bit too.

I imagine petsmart is a pretty big target for nutjob animal rights groups. They probably live in constant fear of bad publicity/legal problems. You can win in court and it is still loose a lot of money fighting the legal fight and still loose in the public opinion arena. Most people are only going to see lack of water if there is no water bowl. Some locations require a constant supply of water to animals in shops by law.

That said, I really dislike petsmart. The mom and pop shops that used to be near us were really interesting places to shop, with lots of unique and interesting species. Now there is only petsmart and petco.

At petsmart the animal selection is really boring. And because they have to be set up like a walmart or something, their ability to innovate on in-store species specific housing and displays is pitiful.

I think that is their biggest problem as far as reptiles go. They can only have a few species, and their display is standardized, which means chams are stuck in the same retarded design terraria as frogs or tortoises or snakes or skinks or anoles.

 

[tony19]

While I agree with all of the above, I can also see the other side a bit too.

I imagine petsmart is a pretty big target for nutjob animal rights groups. They probably live in constant fear of bad publicity/legal problems. You can win in court and it is still loose a lot of money fighting the legal fight and still loose in the public opinion arena. Most people are only going to see lack of water if there is no water bowl. Some locations require a constant supply of water to animals in shops by law.

That said, I really dislike petsmart. The mom and pop shops that used to be near us were really interesting places to shop, with lots of unique and interesting species. Now there is only petsmart and petco.

At petsmart the animal selection is really boring. And because they have to be set up like a walmart or something, their ability to innovate on in-store species specific housing and displays is pitiful.

I think that is their biggest problem as far as reptiles go. They can only have a few species, and their display is standardized, which means chams are stuck in the same retarded design terraria as frogs or tortoises or snakes or skinks or anoles.

I can't stand animal rights aactivists. Most of the time they are dead wrong on what there fighting for and are vary miss and formed most of the time, and cause more damage then good.

we only have 1 petsmart around were I live and its good distance. I try to inform people of a really good mom & pop shop close to me, there vary good and seem to do well. But I think if a petsmart were to move closer they may unfortunately disappear also.

 

[FrankTheTank]

While I agree with all of the above, I can also see the other side a bit too.

I imagine petsmart is a pretty big target for nutjob animal rights groups. They probably live in constant fear of bad publicity/legal problems. You can win in court and it is still loose a lot of money fighting the legal fight and still loose in the public opinion arena. Most people are only going to see lack of water if there is no water bowl. Some locations require a constant supply of water to animals in shops by law.


That said, I really dislike petsmart. The mom and pop shops that used to be near us were really interesting places to shop, with lots of unique and interesting species. Now there is only petsmart and petco.

At petsmart the animal selection is really boring. And because they have to be set up like a walmart or something, their ability to innovate on in-store species specific housing and displays is pitiful.

I think that is their biggest problem as far as reptiles go. They can only have a few species, and their display is standardized, which means chams are stuck in the same retarded design terraria as frogs or tortoises or snakes or skinks or anoles.

I'm ok with having fresh water in there aslong as they supplement that with regular misting, but the substrate needs to go. I definitely understand why they have to put them in those horrible enclosures but that doesn't mean the substrate has to be in there. We still have mom and pops around here but they are very small and don't offer very much reptile wise. And everything is so pricey there. There isn't a big reptile following around here so they can't justifiably keep feeders. Im rambling though. I hope they can at the very least remove the substrate. That would mean so much to me. Just one small battle won.

 

[mrfixit01]

I know what you mean. My local PetSmart put the mom'n'pops out of business and now there is nothing else local. Several people complained about the chameleon care and they responded. Now they don't carry chameleons at all! Problem solved.

 

[Olimpia]

I don't think the water bowls or the substrate are the serious issues with pet store chameleons. Neither of those two cause MBD or the other very serious issues new members usually come with regarding their new Petsmart/Petco chameleon.

Is bark chip substrate a good idea? No, certainly not, but it's not the worst problem these chameleons face. UVB, supplementation, temps, and humidity are the vitals I'd have corrected first (if we assume that they are getting misted regularly.) I've seen more tiny babies roasting at 90-something degrees than having issues from substrate.

That said, I applaud any efforts to better conditions. I can't boycott these chains because I have dogs and buy 90% of everything they need from there and love their trainers but I understand those who do.

 

[FrankTheTank]

I don't think the water bowls or the substrate are the serious issues with pet store chameleons. Neither of those two cause MBD or the other very serious issues new members usually come with regarding their new Petsmart/Petco chameleon.

Is bark chip substrate a good idea? No, certainly not, but it's not the worst problem these chameleons face. UVB, supplementation, temps, and humidity are the vitals I'd have corrected first (if we assume that they are getting misted regularly.) I've seen more tiny babies roasting at 90-something degrees than having issues from substrate.

That said, I applaud any efforts to better conditions. I can't boycott these chains because I have dogs and buy 90% of everything they need from there and love their trainers but I understand those who do.

You are definitely right! I thought the substrate was a good place to start bc it would be an easy thing for them to change. They will probably. Ever supplement or give the proper UVB sources. We'd be lucky if they would just regulate their temperatures. The temps always seem to be ok at my store but I guess if we all would go into our local stores and try to respectfully educate the employees, then that would be the best place to start. I will definitely try to talk to someone next time I am in there. Wish I could take on a second job lol