Senegal not moving well

N

nicole88

New Member
Ok so i have had a male and female senegal chameleon for a few months.
For a start i have not seen either of them eat for a past few days, although the famale is sheeding.
The male lately just doesnt seem to be moving much, he just sits on the branchs not wanting to do anything, whereas the female is full of enrgy climging all over the place. When he does move he strugles to get hold of branchs with his front feet, and it take him a while to grip on. i dont know if he has hurt himself or not.

Please could anyone help me?
 
Senegals are usually wild caught and loaded with parasites. Did you get a fecal done? They are also notoriously harder to keep alive. If you have them housed together this could also be an issue. I would separate them and see if maybe there is a dominance issue.

Answering these questions will also help us troubleshoot.

Cage Info:
Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
Location - Where are you geographically located?

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.
Current Problem - The current problem that you are concerned about.
 
No we didnt get a fecal done. They have lived together all there lives so far. they where in the same viv in the reptile store and have not had problems with each other so far.

Answering these questions will also help us troubleshoot.

Cage Info:
Cage Type -Its a Full glass viv 45square cm, but we have got a new viv come tomorrow which is wooden with glass sliding doors which is 3ft x 2ft x 2ft
Lighting - We have a repti glo 5 uvb/uva tube lights come on at 8am and off at 8pm
Temperature - a constant temp of 80F during the day is kept but we have also bought a new bought a new heat buld for the new viv
Humidity - I mist the tank several times through out the day to keep the viv humid. We have also a medium exo terra waterfall. we have a hygrometer which is at moderate
Plants - no live plants, just plastic
Placement - the tank isnt near a window. it is however near a breaded dragon and a tortoise neither of which can see into the chameleons viv tho.
It is at chest level
Location - Doncaster UK

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - Senegal, Male (i think),he is 5 months old, ive ownd him for 4 months
Handling - As often as we can, we try to everyday (they like being handled)
Feeding - Locusts around 10 a day (between two chameleons)
Supplements - the last time we gave them calcium, around 2 months ago, they stopped eating so we havnt given them it since
Watering - mist the tank several times a day and we have a waterfall, yes i do see them drinking pritty much everyday (specialy the male)
Fecal Description - normal, but doesnt seem to have passed for a few days, never been tested for parasites
Current Problem - he isnt walking properly and hardly moves at all. He doesnt grip branchs well and strugles to hold on. He doesnt seem to be eating either.
 
OK-Lots wrong here. Don't take offense-I am only trying to help. If he was only 1 month old when you got him, he would have been an inch and 1/2 long-was that the case? Being accross the ocean there, it is common to use glass cages. Here in the states we would scream screen cage-especially for a Senegal. They also like a bit cooler temps-so 80-82ish for a basking spot is good, but you want the rest of your cage low to mid 70's. Waterfalls are terrible and are breeding grounds for bacteia. Search for them on here and see what people say. Live plants are also necessary for humidity. IF you did in fact get him as a tiny hatchling, he could be CB and there would be a lesser chance of parasites. Even though your new cage is sizeable, they really still need to be housed separatley. Lastly, you are way overhandling. Chameleons just do not like to be handled, and even though they might be biting or hissing, you are stressing them. Stress leads to illness. Housing them together causes stress issues.
 
You said..."They have lived together all there lives so far. they where in the same viv in the reptile store and have not had problems with each other so far"...its not advised to keep two chameleons of most species in the same cage after they are 3 or so months of age. Male Senegals are easily stressed and between the frequent handling you are giving him and the fact that he is sharing a cage, the stress is likely causing him a lot of problem.

Low 80's in the warm area of the cage is good. All you need for a basking light is a regular incandescent household bulb in a hood. Is there any glass or plastic between the UVB light and the chameleons?

You said..."the last time we gave them calcium, around 2 months ago, they stopped eating so we havnt given them it since"...its important to dust the insects with a phos.-free calcium powder at most feedings. (They shouldn't look like ghosts...just be lightly dusted.)

I also dust twice a month with a vitamin powder that contains a beta carotene source of vitamin A. Preformed vitamin A can build up in the system and prevent the D3 from doing its job so its important not to overdo it. Its not known whether all/any chameleons can convert beta carotene though so you might have to give it a tiny bit of preformed once in a while.

I dust twice a month with a phos.-free calcium/D3 powder. D3 from supplements also can build up in the system...so be careful.

Senegals need to be well watered every day...so its good that they are drinking.

You said the chameleon hasn't pooped for a couple of days...do you have a substrate in the cage? Does the male sleep during the day? Female?

From your description and the fact that you aren't dusting with calcium, its quite likely that the male has MBD.

Can you post a picture?

BTW...there should be a place for the female to lay eggs in case she needs to.
 
ok thanks for the help so far
the chameleons are always wanting to come out and have always been handed even by the shop we bought them from. They seem happest when they are being handled and dont hist or bite or show any signs of being stressed. So should we stop handling them even though they want to come out?
Yes i figured they would be lacking in calcium and we have started giving it to them again today so we are closely watching it
We will be seperating the two chameleons when the new viv gets here to see if they change in anyway but they dont seem to be unhappy living with each other anyway
I didnt know the waterfalls where a bad thing. we clean it everyday if that changes anything
i will post some pictures tomorrow of how he looks

he still isnt mobilising well. will this have something to do with lacking in calcium? or be something more serious like he has hurt/broken a leg?
 
Your perception of them wanting to come out could be less about them wanting to socialize, and more about wanting to get out of the cage.

I find with a level of inexperience it is hard to recognize the smaller details of stress.

I hope you do not discount any of the husbandry advice offered and instead take it to heart.
 
You said the chameleon hasn't pooped for a couple of days...do you have a substrate in the cage? Does the male sleep during the day? Female?

If it is MBD then you have to do more than just start the calcium up again....you need to make up for the lack that has built up while you weren't providing it.
 
I have a senegal (male) and these chameleons are called the black sheep of the family of wanting to be out! Mine has a great cage and if the door is open here he comes running. Of course he comes out sometimes to eat because if i have a dead cricket (not a hard dried one) he will eat right out of my hand. Now mine is very active in the morning and will just sit on the basking branch in the evening. I also agree with juli on the heat part. mine hates very high temps.

Thanks
Eric
 
kinyonga said:
You said the chameleon hasn't pooped for a couple of days...do you have a substrate in the cage? Does the male sleep during the day? Female?

If it is MBD then you have to do more than just start the calcium up again....you need to make up for the lack that has built up while you weren't providing it.
Click to expand...

how would i make up for it?

the substrate is sand which is what i was recomended. no they dont sleep during the day, they wake up with their lights and go to sleep when they go off.

i have the heat as what you are suggesting anyway,so atleast i have one part right
 
Remove the sand-it can cause impaction. Get your supplements-you need a calcium without D3 that you will use 5-6X weekly, a calcium with D3 that you would use 2X monthly, and a vit/mineral supplement that you would use 1-2X monthly. Make sure there is no glass or plastic cover over your UVB tube and that the cham can get within 6" of it. Please take pictures. If it is MBD a vet visit for a shot of calcium is needed.
 
pictures are on their way
i think you may be on to something here with the UVB tube
about a month or so ago we moved the uv tube from inside the tank, as the chameleons started to climb on it
it is now situated behind the glass at the back of the tank, they can get close to it
 
pictures
gizmo.jpg

gizmo2.jpg
 
That front leg looks a mess-MBD for sure unless the picture is making the leg look curved. No calcium and no UVB is a recipe for that. So there is glass between the UVB and the chams? UVB will not pass through glass or plastic. Can you take some more pictures of the chams and the cage?
 
yeh his leg is curved. so take him to the vets?
yeh we are moving the viv are now to sort it
what substrate would you advise?
 
No substrate. Bare cage floors are the best, and easiest to keep clean. The Vet can give him a calcium boost. It really looks like the leg is liming his mobility. I have a Panther rescue with severe MBD-he has a good bit of trouble moving around.
 
The quickest way to correct the calcium issues is to get her to a vet so she can have calcium injections followed by an injection of calcitonin when the blood calcium levels are high enough.

Your husbandry has to be corrected to prevent them from falling back into the same situation.

The male may be low in the cage to keep away from the female if she is gravid and showing non-receptive coloration.
 
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