New panther owner questions!!! Help!

[sydneymarie93]

I bought my first panther chameleon from Petco(I know I should of done my research, I will no longer be buying animals from them) on November 27, 2015. They told us he was a juvenile about two to three months. He's grown a lot and has shredded once. To me it seems he eats a lot! He's probably eating about 9 medium sized crickets a day. He poops regularly and moves quite a bit. He also has a regular sleep schedule. His humidity stays between 70-90 and his basking temp is 85-90 during the day and his cage doesn't drop below 75 at night.

I just wanted to know if anyone could give me more information about what exact kind he is and maybe how old he is. I haven't got an exact measurement but I'd say he's about 6 inches nose to the beginning of his tail. Also about how much I should be feeding him. Basically any advice for a beginner!! Also I call him a him but I'm not sure what his sex is lol

Thank you so much in advance!!!

 

[sydneymarie93]

I just took this photo of him.

 

[jpowell86]

Hello and Welcome to the Forums! First off, that is a male, so you can keep calling it a him, lol. My advice to you is going to be about husbandry. Inside his enclosure, you need to put a plethora of perches for him. This is important for thermoregulation. Allowing him to choose the area of the enclosure that suits him in regards to temperature and UVB exposure is crucial. Also, I would suggest placing additional plants in the enclosure, live ones preferably. They help maintain humidity, give the chameleon places to hide and really are more aesthetically pleasing. The temperatures in your enclosure are fine, but that night temp could drop some. If you are keeping a heat source on at night, you can stop that. Chameleons actually desire a good drop in temp at night, so no worries there. As long as the room he is in doesn't drop into the 50's, he will be just fine. As far as food is concerned, let him eat. Being young, the food should not be rationed. Although I will caution that a fecal should be done sooner than later to rule out parasitic involvement. I would also take him because in that first pic he looks to be having a little bit of a mouth issue. Just to be on the safe side. Other than that, keep asking questions and I look forward to watching him grow up here on the Forums. Does he have a name? Congratulations on the new boy!

 

[MissLissa]

Welcome to the Forum! There are a ton of people who have a lot of experience on here, so I'm sure you will find what you are looking for We're basically a friendly lot, so don't be shy.

You have a male panther chameleon. It's impossible to know his locale without knowing his geneology or import status. He is certainly older than 4 months of age- likely more like 6 months+. At four months most panthers do not have much of a rostral process, nor are they so well-coloured or as large as your guy. 4 month old panthers still have a "baby" look about them that yours lacks.

You will want to take him to the vet sooner than later, for a fecal check for parasites, and to have his mouth looked at- it does not look quite right in one of your photos.

A 6-8 month panther is not fully mature yet, and should be fed as much as they will eat daily of a variety of well gut-loaded insect prey (crickets, super worms, silkworms, hornworms, stick insects, roaches, locusts, etc). Mealworms are difficult to digest and should be fed as a treat only, if at all. Prey items should be dusted daily with phosphorus-free calcium withOUT D3, once every two weeks with a multivitamin containing prOformed vitamin A (not prEformed), and once every two weeks (alternating weeks with the multivitamin) with a phosphorus-free calcium WITH D3.
See this link for more information on gutloading and proper nutrition:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/care/food/

Regarding your enclosure:

I would just take that water dish right out. Chameleons do not drink from still water sources; they require dripping or moving water to drink from. A water dish will just get pooped in and fouled without adding any benefit to your cham. Misting him for several minutes several times a day will be a better way to keep your cham well hydrated, which is of critical importance.
See this link for more information on water and hydration:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/care/water/

Your cham will require a cage 24x24x48" in size at least; I'm not sure what your current cage's dimensions are, but the photo makes it look small. The photo also makes it look like you are using a red heat bulb- just get rid of that. There are several issues using red heat lights with chameleons- if you want more information on that, just ask. Instead, use a white light heat bulb or a simple incandescent bulb what you would use for your light fixtures at home. A white light source of heat of the right wattage and a T5 (if you have a really tall enclosure, T8) tube UVB bulb is all you need. Make sure you are checking his temperatures and humidity with accurate tools, especially when changing bulbs etc. Most UVB bulbs only last 4-6 months, so check your manufacturer for usage recommendations.
See this link for more information on enclosures:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/care/enclosures/
See this link for more information on lighting:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/care/lighting/

For more complete care infformation, see the extremely extensive resource materials this forum provides on Panthers and general chameleon care, found here:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/care/caresheets/panther/

 

[sydneymarie93]

Thank y'all so much for the advice!! We have him in an 18 x 18 x 36 but will be moving him into a bigger cage ASAP. About how old would y'all say to start giving him a set amount of food? I'm just just so worried of over feed ing. I'll attach pictures of him on our hands that were taken just now so you can see his size better. The first one I posted was when we first got him!

Thank you in advance!!

 

[jpowell86]

In this pic he looks to be around 7-8 months old. You're not feeding him too much. But when he gets around a year old you will start to taper off his food. I feed my adults about 3-4 large feeders every other day on average. But remember that every chameleon is individualistic in their needs so try to tailor a feeding regimen for your chameleon that suits his needs. For example, my ambilobe and nosy faly are almost the exact same age, but my nosy faly makes my ambilobe look tiny. So, I will work some extra feeders in there for him every week. His colors are really trying to come out...he's beautiful!

 

[sydneymarie93]

In this pic he looks to be around 7-8 months old. You're not feeding him too much. But when he gets around a year old you will start to taper off his food. I feed my adults about 3-4 large feeders every other day on average. But remember that every chameleon is individualistic in their needs so try to tailor a feeding regimen for your chameleon that suits his needs. For example, my ambilobe and nosy faly are almost the exact same age, but my nosy faly makes my ambilobe look tiny. So, I will work some extra feeders in there for him every week. His colors are really trying to come out...he's beautiful!

Thank you so much

 

[Savsherps]

Beautiful Iil guy you have!! Seems to be a blue bar ambilobe like mine. Look up soon care sheets and feeding/dusting supplement schedules and your good to go!

 

[MissLissa]

In this pic he looks to be around 7-8 months old.

You think that old? My ambilobe is a touch over 8 months and from those pictures he could comfortably swallow this little panther. But then, Vladislav is a moose

@sydneymarie93; in any case, jpowell86 won't steer you wrong Your cham is gorgeous: you gotta love those blues! What's his name?

 

[jpowell86]

You think that old? My ambilobe is a touch over 8 months and from those pictures he could comfortably swallow this little panther. But then, Vladislav is a moose

If he were from a reputable breeder, I would have guessed 5-6 months, but I just figured the best care he has probably been given has been in the short time since sydneymarie93 picked him up. I could be over factoring too many variables.

I've seen pics of Vladislav....if he were my comparison, I would say this guy just hatched. HA!!

 

[sydneymarie93]

You think that old? My ambilobe is a touch over 8 months and from those pictures he could comfortably swallow this little panther. But then, Vladislav is a moose

@sydneymarie93; in any case, jpowell86 won't steer you wrong Your cham is gorgeous: you gotta love those blues! What's his name?

We named him King Leonidas after the 300 movies lol his mood doesn't fit though. I'm happy that he is calm and isn't hard to handle!! Thanks for you advice I need all I can get lol

 

[sydneymarie93]

If he were from a reputable breeder, I would have guessed 5-6 months, but I just figured the best care he has probably been given has been in the short time since sydneymarie93 picked him up. I could be over factoring too many variables.

I've seen pics of Vladislav....if he were my comparison, I would say this guy just hatched. HA!!

Just in the month I've had him he's grown ALOT. After doing more research into chameleons Petco doesn't even keep their humidity past 20%. I had to tell the manager that isn't right and how's that suppose to make me feel knowing I bought him from there and they don't have their enviorment anywhere close to where it needs to be.

 

[BMO]

A 18x18x36 cage is fine for an adult male panther.

 

[jpowell86]

A 18x18x36 cage is fine for an adult male panther.

I have to completely and respectfully disagree with this. 18x18x36 is a minimum size for a female panther..minimum. You will want a 48x24x24 enclosure for King Leonidas.

 

[MissLissa]

A 18x18x36 cage is fine for an adult male panther.

I would disagree with this, pretty strongly. I have my guy in a 36x24x60 cage and he uses every single bit of it. An adult male panther reaches somewhere between 17" to 19" long, so he could reasonably touch both sides of a 18' wide cage at the same time. That does not seem like nearly enough room for them to roam like they need to. I don't see why their cages shouldn't be the absolute largest cage we can possibly give them, especially since males will definitely use the space. But then, you should see the cages I think are appropriate for captive birds: now those are some large cages!

I'd say a 18x18x36 is the minimum for a female panther, who aren't quite as large or as obsessively active as males. I think a male could possibly (maybe) survive in a 18x36, but I don't think they would thrive as well as they would in a larger cage (unless they were handicapped or specifically needed the smaller space for some health reason).

 

[sydneymarie93]

I would disagree with this, pretty strongly. I have my guy in a 36x24x60 cage and he uses every single bit of it. An adult male panther reaches somewhere between 17" to 19" long, so he could reasonably touch both sides of a 18' wide cage at the same time. That does not seem like nearly enough room for them to roam like they need to. I don't see why their cages shouldn't be the absolute largest cage we can possibly give them, especially since males will definitely use the space. But then, you should see the cages I think are appropriate for captive birds: now those are some large cages!

I'd say a 18x18x36 is the minimum for a female panther, who aren't quite as large or as obsessively active as males. I think a male could possibly (maybe) survive in a 18x36, but I don't think they would thrive as well as they would in a larger cage (unless they were handicapped or specifically needed the smaller space for some health reason).

Yes mam I will be setting something up with my father in law to custom build us a bigger one. But do you think he should be okay for now in the 18x18x36 for the next month or so until we can get one built or should I invest in a larger already built one???

Thank y'all so much for the advice!! Please keep it coming if you can think of anything else

 

[sydneymarie93]

I have to completely and respectfully disagree with this. 18x18x36 is a minimum size for a female panther..minimum. You will want a 48x24x24 enclosure for King Leonidas.

My father in law can custom build me a cage to whatever diminsions I want. But do you think we will be fine in the set up for the next month maybe 2 tops until we could get a custom one built? Or should we invest in a store bought one sooner?

 

[sydneymarie93]

Also was wondering where I could find the wood for the perches? Ive looked around at Petco and the only thing that is wide enough to set across the cage is the vines. I know real plants are the best. My dad is working on re potting me a hibiscus plant. Any suggestions??

 

[MissLissa]

Watch for noserubs in the smaller cage: the teenage boys really wanna roam and they can damage their rostrums if she rub their nose too aggressively on the mesh. If you are going to have another enclosure up and running in the next few weeks I would think it would be fine to have in him the 36" until you have the new one set up. Chams stress a great deal in new environments: I would not want to switch his cage too often. He's also on the small side still; if he was full size I'd say go with the 48" now.

For branches I use cut trees from outdoors (apple, birch, other pet-safe ones since some chams will chew) , scrub them with a 5% bleach solution, rincse wella nd bake them in the oven until try. Others just rinse them with water, give them a bit of a scrub, and use them straight. If you want store-bought perches, look in the bird section. Most large pet stores should have a selection of natural perches there for their feathered customers. Dont use dowels or other uniform perches, though: you want ones of varying diameters, like natural branches. Java wood may be too slick for some chams, so if you so with that kind of wood you may have to sand it gown or carve a few grooves in it with a fork or similar to improve the grip.

Pothos is a good plant to go with; they are inexpensive, grow pretty much anywhere, put up with the abuse a chameleon will heap on them, and grow pretty quickly to fill up the enclosure which is exactly what you want. Other good plants are Ficus trees; though they can be a bit fussy and slow-growing, or umbrella plants (Schefflera arboricola). With the umbrella, make sure it's properly identified as S. arboricola, as there is a look-alike that is not good to use. Make sure you repot the plants with a good inch of drainage layer and with quick draining soil that does not have a lot of heavy compos or any fertilizer, antifungals, insecticides or herbicides. If you take a list of plants you want and requirements for soil to your local nursery they should be able to pick out the proper plants and soils for you. Cover all the soil with large rocks- make sure there is no possible way your cham can swallow them because if they can, they will. Chams will also eat soil, which can be an impaction risk. I try to get rocks that are at least 2x the size of my cham's head, because he can't even pick those ones up and ruin my landscaping lol