New and looking for some help!

[rort]

Hello everyone!

I am brand new to the forum and also to keeping Chameleons. I know I face a few different situations than a lot of you who live on the mainland, but I live in Waikiki (moved out from Long Beach,CA). I have been taking care of specialty animals for YEARS specifically in Saltwater Aquariums. I have worked in the industry for 3 years and finished working at the Long Beach Aquarium of the Pacific. I am finishing up school in HI and can't set up an aquarium in my apartment, so was hoping to get a sweet Jackson Chameleon.

I have been doing my research, but was hoping to get some advice from you guys! I am also looking for any connections to people in HI who have Jacksons or even breeders? I know you can bring in wild caught ones but as I am starting out I would prefer to not have to worry about quarantining and treating for parasites.

Mahalo in advance!!!

 

[RAFASTAR23]

Welcome to the forums! ...You'll find a lot of people here with experience keeping jackson's. I know there are people on here with better advice on how to keep one of these chameleons in HI. But I will give you some info to get started, but before i do so i must ask you some questions. Will you keep the chameleon indoors or outdoors? (since you are in HI, you can actually keep it in an outdoor cage or free-range if you have the space). do you have a cage set-up? (minimum size 24"x24"x36" for an adult, or 16"x16"x20" for a juvinile). Do you have the propper lightning (if keeping it indoors)? uvb is vital for chams. Temp and Humidity should not be a problem for you in HI. There are many other things to consider, but i think it will be easier to answer specific questions you may have. So ask away!

 

[melric]

There are some breeders in Waimanalo. Also when I was searching we saw some Jackson's for $10 at a pet shop in Kailua. When I asked the shops where to find them they always said they had someone who looked for them, but not sure where.

 

[Chris Jury]

Hi Rort,

I'm over in Kaneohe. Sounds like we have a somewhat similar background. I'm a doctoral student in oceanography at UH working on coral calcification physiology/ocean acidification for my dissertation, and I too am sad that having a reeftank here is impractical (although, the ocean is right there...). I bred Veiled chameleons a number of years ago, kept a pair of T. deremensis for a time, and have been keeping Jackson's for a while here in Hawaii. I know there are at least a handfull of other folks here that are on Oahu as well.

I'm not sure you'll find many cb here largely because they're just not terribly valuable, fetching maybe $20-25 in a pet store, and therefore not worth the effort in breeding and raising them as compared to just going and collecting them. Some friends had a female drop some babies a few months ago, though I haven't caught up with them about the neonates since. I have a wc female that is getting fatter by the day, though I have no idea when she'll be ready. In general, however, because of the short chain of custody, you can find very healthy animals, at least at the few pet shops I've been to, as long as they haven't been sitting there too long. Housing conditions range between poor and piss poor at the pet shops here IME, especially because of overcrowding. However, turnover seems fast at the store I frequent, so generally the animals seem healthy, despite poor housing. I have three animals currently that were all wc, none of which have given me any problems at all. Again, short chain of custody is key. These animals haven't been put through the wringers the way most wc chameleons are.

If you can keep the cage on a lanai, or otherwise outside, care is easy IME. Given a sufficient cage, food, and plenty of water, they thrive in our climate.

I'd be happy to talk with you further, or let any of the other local folks chime in.

Aloha,

cj

 

[jojackson]

Be captive or wild, quarantine is a good idea if you have other lizards.
Welcome

 

[rort]

Welcome to the forums! ...You'll find a lot of people here with experience keeping jackson's. I know there are people on here with better advice on how to keep one of these chameleons in HI. But I will give you some info to get started, but before i do so i must ask you some questions. Will you keep the chameleon indoors or outdoors? (since you are in HI, you can actually keep it in an outdoor cage or free-range if you have the space). do you have a cage set-up? (minimum size 24"x24"x36" for an adult, or 16"x16"x20" for a juvinile). Do you have the propper lightning (if keeping it indoors)? uvb is vital for chams. Temp and Humidity should not be a problem for you in HI. There are many other things to consider, but i think it will be easier to answer specific questions you may have. So ask away!

Thanks Rafastar! I will most likely be keeping the cham in doors. I dont believe that will be that big of a problem as I don't run an AC and my windows are open at all times, allowing the inside temp to perfectly reflect the outside which I believe is perfect for them. I am taking this project on as a DIY and would like to build my own cage. I have done a LOT of work with Saltwater tanks and feel I can handle this. I plan for it to be 24"x24"x48" and will most likely be a foot or two off the ground, with shelving below it.

Lighting and housing I will need to purchase and will be looking into that.

Hi Rort,

I'm over in Kaneohe. Sounds like we have a somewhat similar background. I'm a doctoral student in oceanography at UH working on coral calcification physiology/ocean acidification for my dissertation, and I too am sad that having a reeftank here is impractical (although, the ocean is right there...). I bred Veiled chameleons a number of years ago, kept a pair of T. deremensis for a time, and have been keeping Jackson's for a while here in Hawaii. I know there are at least a handfull of other folks here that are on Oahu as well.

I'm not sure you'll find many cb here largely because they're just not terribly valuable, fetching maybe $20-25 in a pet store, and therefore not worth the effort in breeding and raising them as compared to just going and collecting them. Some friends had a female drop some babies a few months ago, though I haven't caught up with them about the neonates since. I have a wc female that is getting fatter by the day, though I have no idea when she'll be ready. In general, however, because of the short chain of custody, you can find very healthy animals, at least at the few pet shops I've been to, as long as they haven't been sitting there too long. Housing conditions range between poor and piss poor at the pet shops here IME, especially because of overcrowding. However, turnover seems fast at the store I frequent, so generally the animals seem healthy, despite poor housing. I have three animals currently that were all wc, none of which have given me any problems at all. Again, short chain of custody is key. These animals haven't been put through the wringers the way most wc chameleons are.

If you can keep the cage on a lanai, or otherwise outside, care is easy IME. Given a sufficient cage, food, and plenty of water, they thrive in our climate.

I'd be happy to talk with you further, or let any of the other local folks chime in.

Aloha,

cj

Hey Chris, thats awesome to see another Saltwater person closely in the chameleon hobby. I am at HPU and wish we had some of the facilities and especially diving program that UH offers!! I am in Waikiki but next summer I will most likely be moving over to Kaneohe.

Thanks for the heads up on the cb chams. I would prefer to start out with one of those, but if I have to start out with wild caught I can do that. Would be interesting to go out and look for one. I have been fish collecting a good amount of times but never for chameleons! Unfortunately we are not allow to keep anything too large on our lanai or else it would work perfect for a Jackson. He will have to be indoors though it is extremely ventilated and does not get too cold at night. I would love to find a healthy juvenile to start out with if you know of anyone on island that has them! I was previously raising 4 different species of clownfish, Banggai Cardinals, and came close but failed at raising Orange Spotted Filefish while I was in CA. But I would eventually like to try my hand at breeding these guys, even if the payoff is not that great!

Another unfortunate situation I face is not having a car tho I do have a pretty sweet moped! haha So getting to ALL the different pet shops will prove difficult though I can use a car from a friend here and there. Any you might recommend on my side of the island? And I will definitly take you up on a further conversation and will try to send ya a PM soon. (I have a huge Bio test coming up early next week that will most likely be taking up most of my time.)

Be captive or wild, quarantine is a good idea if you have other lizards.
Welcome

I am quite familiar with the process of quarantining animals as I ran an 80 system qt set up at my previous work for saltwater fish. Tho I will for sure need more info on how to set one up for chameleons! But at this time I will only be starting out with one and seeing how that goes.

----------


I am not too concerned with the attention that they will need as I am home most of the time and will be able to supply that. I am more looking for info for their specific food requirements and proper ways to build a bad@$$ enclosure for them. I guess the idea in my head is:

24"x24"x48" enclosure made out of window screening (with aluminum lining).
- Bottom will most likely be wood with a protective material on top (suggestions?)
- Top will use aluminum wire mesh to compensate for the use of the UV light (any suggestions for cage size?)
- I would love to have a live plant and have heard one of the best ways to go is a ficus?

Feeding is my biggest concern...
- are there stores that I can readily purchase HEALTHY bugs (and what kind would you recommend?)
- I would like to stay away from too noisy crickets as it will be in my room
- I have been told that even the roaches I can catch that ever so often pop up in my kitchen are safe?
- And how about silk worms, that I would raise myself and feed?

I know that is a lot of questions and I thank you all in advance! I have not been apart of a forum for almost a year now and I am very excited from the warm welcome.

 

[jojackson]

I have been told that even the roaches I can catch that ever so often pop up in my kitchen are safe?....

I wouldnt do that, roaches travel, though you may not use pesticides, neighbours might.
See if commercially bred roaches are avail on the Island, perhaps joining a reptile/cham keepers club there will give you feeder breeder contacts?
Silkworms are great. Recommend as much variety as possible.
P.S Chams generally dont drink from still water, most use misting, dripper systems, hence drainage should be a consideration if your building a cage. Ficus is great!

 

[reptoman]

draintable

Welcome to the forums! Thought I would show you my simple drain table that costs very little to build and is quite functional. See pics at the link and let me know if you have any specific questions. I build my own cages and the biggest problem IMO is figuring out where all the excess water goes from drippers, misting, etc. I use petscreen which is PVC coated nylon for my cage bottoms. Its very strong and allows for good drainage. Easy to clean as well. Hope this helps. Good luck!

https://picasaweb.google.com/bcstinso/Draintable#

 

[rort]

I have been told that even the roaches I can catch that ever so often pop up in my kitchen are safe?....

I wouldnt do that, roaches travel, though you may not use pesticides, neighbours might.
See if commercially bred roaches are avail on the Island, perhaps joining a reptile/cham keepers club there will give you feeder breeder contacts?
Silkworms are great. Recommend as much variety as possible.
P.S Chams generally dont drink from still water, most use misting, dripper systems, hence drainage should be a consideration if your building a cage. Ficus is great!

That is vey true! Did not think of that with the roaches. I have thought about the water situation and it looks like reptoman has a great suggestion.

Welcome to the forums! Thought I would show you my simple drain table that costs very little to build and is quite functional. See pics at the link and let me know if you have any specific questions. I build my own cages and the biggest problem IMO is figuring out where all the excess water goes from drippers, misting, etc. I use petscreen which is PVC coated nylon for my cage bottoms. Its very strong and allows for good drainage. Easy to clean as well. Hope this helps. Good luck!

https://picasaweb.google.com/bcstinso/Draintable#

That looks like a great idea! So for the bottom of the cage just used a mesh screen that allows excess water to exit out, into a bulk head that drops into a bucket? Great design!! When you say pet screen you mean the actually bottom piece of the cage? What did you use for the flexible/bowing water basin to catch all the excess water?

As far as water, it is already pretty damn humid here in Hawaii, so I was planning on using a simple drip system like this: http://www.aquariumpw.com/shopping/pricelist.asp?prid=756

 

[rort]

If I can skip back to the feeding as well. What kind of set up do you guys use to store/hold your chams food?

 

[reptoman]

For the basin of the drain table, I used PVC shower pan liner. Its pretty thick and very flexible, and you can buy it by the linear foot off a roll from home depot. Not sure you have that there but any type of heavy plastic or PVC liner would work.

I am talking about the bottom of the cage when I said petscreen. Its strong enough to set a 10-12" potted plant on top of the PVC pipe supports and will not tear like aluminum screen. A dogs claws cannot rip through it at all so it makes great screen for building cham cages. The only drawback is it cant withstand heat from a basking light (so I use aluminum screen for my cage tops) and you cannot see through it as easily as aluminum screen. Another benifit is there is almost no chance of a chams nails being damaged by petscreen. Aluminum screen can cause chams nails to break off, or in some cases, to be torn out.

 

[jojackson]

In most cases a suitable sized plastic tub with lid and ventilation, sometimes a heat mat etc beneath dependant on climate, crickets/roaches, like to hide, so egg cartons in a stack,
small chinese food container for food/gutload, and a source of moisture (water never works well) I use raw carrot, others use commercial water crystals or the like.
Thats basically it.
Some worms like mealworms or superworms, just live in the food source (eg bran) with the moisture source and food placed ontop.
Toilet roll cores included make handling them less fuss since bugs hide in them, just pick up the core and shake it out.

 

[rort]

For the basin of the drain table, I used PVC shower pan liner. Its pretty thick and very flexible, and you can buy it by the linear foot off a roll from home depot. Not sure you have that there but any type of heavy plastic or PVC liner would work.

I am talking about the bottom of the cage when I said petscreen. Its strong enough to set a 10-12" potted plant on top of the PVC pipe supports and will not tear like aluminum screen. A dogs claws cannot rip through it at all so it makes great screen for building cham cages. The only drawback is it cant withstand heat from a basking light (so I use aluminum screen for my cage tops) and you cannot see through it as easily as aluminum screen. Another benifit is there is almost no chance of a chams nails being damaged by petscreen. Aluminum screen can cause chams nails to break off, or in some cases, to be torn out.

We do have home depot and some smaller mom and pop hardware stores that I can look into. And thank you for the info on the screening! I will use that over the normal window screening I was planning on. And will follow ur advice on the aluminum on top!

In most cases a suitable sized plastic tub with lid and ventilation, sometimes a heat mat etc beneath dependant on climate, crickets/roaches, like to hide, so egg cartons in a stack,
small chinese food container for food/gutload, and a source of moisture (water never works well) I use raw carrot, others use commercial water crystals or the like.
Thats basically it.
Some worms like mealworms or superworms, just live in the food source (eg bran) with the moisture source and food placed ontop.
Toilet roll cores included make handling them less fuss since bugs hide in them, just pick up the core and shake it out.

My main fear again, is that I will be having all of this in my room, so I would prefer to stay away from crickets and would probably just purchase them twice a week to feed and only a limited number to eliminate the possibility of them getting out in my apartment. But it doesn't seem that extensive to set up two separate plastic containers for silk worms and roaches to feed? (though, with roaches I would most likely get a specialized container to ensure that they stay in... dont need any MORE roaches in hawaii...)

-------

Thank you again everyone for the advice! I am already learning so much!!!!

 

[jojackson]

A bit messy but a smearing of ky jelly around the inner rim of the tub will see bugs stay inside. Less messy but more expensive initially, is a product called fluon, its basically liquid teflon, used in the same manner it works even better to prevent crawlies passing a vertical barrier, great to keep ants and other bugs out by painting on the outside of the tub aswell.
This product is sold in Australia relatively cheap, one bottle will last years, you may be able to arrange shipping, or find a similar product elsewhere online.

http://www.herpshop.com.au/Food.html

 

[rort]

A bit messy but a smearing of ky jelly around the inner rim of the tub will see bugs stay inside. Less messy but more expensive initially, is a product called fluon, its basically liquid teflon, used in the same manner it works even better to prevent crawlies passing a vertical barrier, great to keep ants and other bugs out by painting on the outside of the tub aswell.
This product is sold in Australia relatively cheap, one bottle will last years, you may be able to arrange shipping, or find a similar product elsewhere online.

http://www.herpshop.com.au/Food.html

Wow! That sounds like it would work perfectly!!! Now lets just see if I can get it shipped out here. Would you apply it with some kind of brush?

 

[jojackson]

Yes, just a small paint brush, a nice broad line around the rim, it dries white. If you shake the stuff, let it settle again before you paint, since bubbles in the finish will create irregularities and defeat your purpose some. Dries pretty quick, really neat stuff.
I hope you can get it shipped, cant see why not.

 

[rort]

I am currently studying for a pretty big Bio test on Tuesday and am swamped with that and it seems that my brain is slowly shutting down from too much information.... GENETICS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

But I will be sure follow up with them and try to get that ordered, along with checking out some local pet shops and see what they have!

 

[wsidepinoy]

aloha !

i lived in hawaii from 3 years while i lived with my parents and that is where my fascination with chameleons began.....the good ole jackson chameleons...LOL parents never lemme keep one...

i miss that weather..the EASIEST climate to keep a chameleon in!

my friend kept their chameleon in their lanai / back sun room in a bird cage with tons of sticks etc and the chameleon was fine and healthy !

 

[rort]

aloha !

i lived in hawaii from 3 years while i lived with my parents and that is where my fascination with chameleons began.....the good ole jackson chameleons...LOL parents never lemme keep one...

i miss that weather..the EASIEST climate to keep a chameleon in!

my friend kept their chameleon in their lanai / back sun room in a bird cage with tons of sticks etc and the chameleon was fine and healthy !

Apartment co. doesnt allow us to keep anything really on our lanai or else I would have it there right away!! What part of Island were you on?

 

[rort]

Well, Bio test that I was studying like crazy for did not happen due to a student stealing 3 of the tests before the exam. So until I know what is going to happen with that, I get to do MORE research into getting a little guy soon!