mbd my boys have it

G

globug

New Member
my boys just instantly went from healthy active guys to bent leg weak boys. one week they were fine days later they were a wreck. i have one in a nursey cause weak and ready to fall. i'm totally wrecked a devastated and sad. i've fail them. now that the crying is over got new uvb bulbs and i am siringe feeding them calcium in water. in the mbd sticky doesn't give enough info about care/treatment. i'd like a link to a long list of more care and health ideas please. tell me where i can find EVERYTHIN about treating them.

Super super sad bad glo.......
 
So sorry you are having calcium problems.

Calcium without d3 will not help them. And calcium with water is not a good idea even if he already has mbd. You want the calcium with d3 included with food (either something you syringe feed) or dusted on insects. Calcium given straight up in water is not a good idea...
 
The reason the sticky thread doesn't have complete treatment suggestions (although pretty close) is that each case is different and should be customized for the stage of disease and other factors involved for each chameleon. These customizations can only be made by an experienced reptile vet when all factors are taken into consideration. We can point you in the right direction if you fill out the husbandry form in the link and post pictures of your affecting chameleons.
 
I'm so sorry to hear that. I really hope everything gets better for you and your little guys. Keep your head up. I know it's hard but sometimes chameleon owners mess up because it's a lot and that's normal but everything is going to get better. Just be strong and keep us updated.
 
no more calcium in water, I read in that sticky thread about drops of calcium in water dropper....And of course about my location as I said I'm completely alone here with this.
NO VET CARE SO I HAVE NOTHING BUT YOUR GUYS HELP!

help help help

anything any advice suggestion id do any thing for my babies i was a nursing assistant for many years so i can heal my babies i know i can i trust you guys

yes have uvb over tanks how close my other uvb were bulbs and they died quickly so now I bought the long neon kind
 
So very sorry to hear this, read all you can about this condition and read these boards, ask questions and keep the faith.....never thought my boy would get over the loss of his tongue, but he has and with the help of many people on this forum.
 
Liquid calcium is not just calcium in water, it is a liquid formulation of calcium (usually calcium Glubionate). So you don't add the calcium yourself, it is made that way specifically and you buy it already liquid. Fill out the husbandry questionnaire and post some pictures and we'll get you on track.
 
Your Chameleon vieled yemes

Handling - daily

Feeding - meal worms and i just found some bigger one that are creep but they loved them I feed them regularly always have worms in enclosures I also feed the worms every day a variety of left veggies

Supplements - both once a week sprinkled with Repti calcium and Repti vitimins

Watering - one drinks from the homemade dripper i made other drinks from bowl

Fecal Description - Big brown log with white blop and puddle of water. LG had a huge one a couple days ago but Nacho hasn't for a week (scared he's impacted)

History -

Cage Info:
Cage Type - plexi glass is all that's available here but it has a screen top heat lamps and uvb is on top, 1 meter high by 1/3 meter square

Lighting - heat and uvb on when ever I'm home, mornings and evening for at least 10 hours

Temperature - no thermomator at that shop

Humidity - spray twice a day and home made dripper on top

Plants - no plants

Placement - in livingroom in corner no breezes or fans and I live alone now and rarely have people around

Location I'm in harbin China as north as you can get without going into russia
 
okay did it again, I currently have Nacho in the baby tak laid on it's side with open top and he is laying around and moving around it there. I did created a kind of hammock in his big one but now i'm scared of him falling. He grew so fast and so fat and now he can't support his weight. LG is still moving around and eating but not as well as before. The are both weak and bent limbs......sad again to say it. sad sad sad
 
Your supplements should be plain calcium without d3 daily and calcium with d3 and multivits twice a month. Check what it says on I've container. As suggested before you may have a girl. With veileds the males have a spur ( knob ) on the back of of their back feet. Do you only feed them worms? This can cause impaction. Are you able to post pics?
 
Here's where i'm at. Nacho is in one of the baby enclosures laying on it's side with no climbing things so he's always walking or laying flat. He pooed last week a giant poo. I hand syringe him water every day. a few days ago i saw him eat a worm. I don't know if he has eaten these days. So i did a gross thing and crushed up some of those giant worms I got. I guess these are called superworms. I googled them. I added calcium and multi vitamin and apple and lettuce and a little apple juice. I just syringed fed him 2mls of this. I'm doing my best in Northern China with no medical help and support. He seemed to struggle at first but maybe he either got tired of fighting it or he liked the flavor. Still waiting and hoping for a little more advice and support.

The worst part of this is that my 9 year old French Bulldog is suffering pyometra which is a deadly uterus infection which I am treating her myself with injection antibiotics. My life with my babies is poo now and I'd love some more advice.
 
Also report your temperature and give us a better idea of your growth rate.

Superworms with 1x per week calcium and a fast growth rate = the trouble you may be experiencing.

Also someone said d3 2x per month. I would recommend more than that if your growth rate is fast and/or if you have a calcium deficiency going already.

Superworms alone aren't the greatest idea either, but if you can round things out some with shredded veggies directly to the chameleon it will help if you are pinched in your location and can't get anything but zoophobas worms. Here's how to start an interest in veggies if your chameleon is able to feed on his own from a bowl. Shred the veggies very fine (like bean thread noodles fine (aka vermacilli)) put them in a bowl and throw your worms in there. As the worms move throught he veggies it will attract the veiled to eat and he will either eat moving veggies or worms and accidentally pick a few veggies up. After a while he will begin to eat more and more of the veggies regardless of whether they are moving or whether there are worms in them. This should help round things out if superworms are all you have.

If he was mine, I'd use repti calcium with d3 every feeding for a few weeks, and then start reducing and replacing some days with repti-calcium without d3. Calcium products don't stick so well to worms anyway. But sounds like he hasn't had enough calcium for sure if you've only been using any calcium 1x per week.
 
Regarding bone health...it's important that the nutrients be in balance...mainly calcium, phos, D3 and vitamin A. It's also important to provide UVB...and it should not pass through glass or plastic. Another important factor is the temperature.

Appropriate temperatures allow the chameleon to digest its food properly and thus play a part indirectly in nutrient absorption.

Exposure to UVB allows the chameleon to produce D3 which allows it to use the calcium in its system. As long as the chameleon can move in and out of the UVB it won't overdose on D3 from the UVB.

Since most feeder insects have a poor ratio of calcium to phos its important to dust the insects a phos - free calcium powder at most feedings to make up for it.

It's also recommended that the insects be dusted twice a month with phos - free calcium / D3 powder to ensure that it gets some D3 without overdosing it and leaving it to produce the rest from its exposure to the UVB.

It's recommended that the insects are dusted twice a month with a vitamin powder that contains a beta carotene (prOformed) source of vitamin A. This will ensure that it gets its vitamins without overdosing the vitamin A and leaving it up to the owner to decide how much prEformed vitamin A to give it....or whether to not use a prEformed source.

It's also important to feed/gutload the insects well. For crickets, superworms, roaches, locusts, etc. A wide assortment of greens ( dandelion greens, collards, endive, escarole, mustard greens, kale, etc ) can be used along with veggies ( carrots, squash, zucchini, sweet red pepper, sweet potato., etc).

Feeding a good variety of insects is also beneficial. You can use the one listed above as well as silkworms, butterworms and once in a while, waxworms.

To correct the MBD you should have a vet help you. You need to bring back a balance of nutrients and then use he information above to keep the balance to prevent the MBD from returning
 
First I want to say that sorry I can't answer questions about temperate and humidity and that as I have no gauges. Also I don't know how to post pictures and that, however;

Well, here's the status of my boyz and Baby too. Baby is a little piggie and has been living is Nacho's big enclosure while he's recovering. She's loving it and I'll keep a close eye on her growth and calcium and UVB. LG is great and seems fine and mobile but of course has the bends in his arms which I'm sure are permanent. Poos every couple of days, also monitoring the calcium and VUB.

Nacho is doing great. He's in the baby tank on it's side and flat on pad and bark. Eats when I throw stuff in. Has lots of UVB and has had a second big poop in two weeks. I've noticed he's starting to get pretty feisty again and perhaps ready to climb around a bit.

I take all of them out every day to 'eye dropped' them water. I haven't had a chance to go to that guys shop to see if he can order misters and drippers from his supplier in Beijing. At least I know how much water they are getting and they are all eating well. When I take Nacho out his grip on me is like steal, very strong. Taking tomorrow off so thinking about 'up-righting' the enclosure and adding a couple branches. I wanted him flat so bones, if healing, could heal flat.

Everything is looking good and with the drama of by old dog needing an emergency hysterectomy here in China this has been a nightmare month and especially week. But seems like things are looking up. Thank the heavens. Chinese new Year holiday starts in a week and I can hang out at home and stare at everyone all day. LOL
 
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