MBD in tail and back legs

Arhneo

New Member
I’m aware he has mbd and I have been treating it but I don’t really know why his tail and spine is curving like this. I’ve tried to change his whole cage set up because I thought he was bending it up when he’s laying down but maybe it’s something else? I’ve been treating him for maybe 4 months now and I haven’t seen a change. If you need anymore info lmk I just haven’t seen anyone else with this problem.
His names Neo and he’s very sweet. he’s never hissed or snapped at all and the only time he gets blue dotty or upset is when he gets too hot. He’s my first Cham so if you could give me any tips it would make us both very happy
 

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ERKleRose

Chameleon Enthusiast
Welcome! Do you take him to an experienced chameleon vet? He also looks overweight as well. Could you fill out this form with as much detail as possible (including more pics of him, his full cage- lights to bottom, and his lights), please?

Chameleon Info:
  • Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
  • Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
  • Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
  • Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
  • Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
  • Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
  • History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

Cage Info:
  • Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
  • Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
  • Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
  • Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
  • Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
  • Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
  • Location - Where are you geographically located?

Current Problem - The current problem you are concerned about.

--------------

Please Note:
  1. The more details you provide the better and more accurate help you will receive.
  2. Photos can be very helpful.
 

Arhneo

New Member
He’s a male veiled chameleon. I don’t know his exact age because I got him from a pet store but I’ve had him for about 2 years now. He’s very comfortable around me I hold him atleast once a day. He gets about 3-5 crickets a day and 2-3 worms with calcium and vitamins. I wouldn’t doubt that he is overweight because someone already told us he needed to take in more calcium. We feed the crickets with their own calcium diet. We mist him ourselves with two different bottles. He usually drinks only whenever I give him water for some reason I use the little blue bottle. I don’t believe he’s dehydrated we do make sure to water him a lot throughout the day. His poop is normal solid and pee is a light yellow to white. His cage is all screen I don’t know the exact dimensions but it’s the basic chameleon tall cage. I just bought a new bulb for his light and that usually stays on 10-12 hours same with his heat lamp. His cage is on a tall table in front of a window he likes to look out of and there is a ceiling fan I turn it on sometimes when he would need a breeze. He doesn’t have any real plants in the cage but we do feed him pothos.
my main concern about him is his crooked tail and spine which I think is causing his back legs to cramp up and be uncomfortable. Is it a small cage? Placement of what is in it? Is it just developed bone disease that’s incurable?
 

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ERKleRose

Chameleon Enthusiast
He’s a male veiled chameleon. I don’t know his exact age because I got him from a pet store but I’ve had him for about 2 years now. He’s very comfortable around me I hold him atleast once a day. He gets about 3-5 crickets a day and 2-3 worms with calcium and vitamins. I wouldn’t doubt that he is overweight because someone already told us he needed to take in more calcium. We feed the crickets with their own calcium diet. We mist him ourselves with two different bottles. He usually drinks only whenever I give him water for some reason I use the little blue bottle. I don’t believe he’s dehydrated we do make sure to water him a lot throughout the day. His poop is normal solid and pee is a light yellow to white. His cage is all screen I don’t know the exact dimensions but it’s the basic chameleon tall cage. I just bought a new bulb for his light and that usually stays on 10-12 hours same with his heat lamp. His cage is on a tall table in front of a window he likes to look out of and there is a ceiling fan I turn it on sometimes when he would need a breeze. He doesn’t have any real plants in the cage but we do feed him pothos.
my main concern about him is his crooked tail and spine which I think is causing his back legs to cramp up and be uncomfortable. Is it a small cage? Placement of what is in it? Is it just developed bone disease that’s incurable?
Could you elaborate on his supplements, misting, lights, and more, etc? Filling out the form (with as much detail as possible) is more organized for us to give you proper feedback. Could you also add more photos him (with him fully in the pic) and his full cage, please?
 

kinyonga

Chameleon Enthusiast
You said.."I’ve been treating him for maybe 4 months now and I haven’t seen a change"...how have you been treating it?

You said..."He gets about 3-5 crickets a day and 2-3 worms with calcium and vitamins"...you need to be specific about the supplements....how often do you dust with each one?
I don't recommend using the orange cubes. It's better to feed crickets, superworms, locusts, roaches with a wide assortment of greens such as dandelion greens, kale, collards, endive, escarole, etc and veggies such as squash, zucchini, sweet potatoes, sweet red pepper, etc and a small amount of berries, apples, pears, etc.

You said..."I wouldn’t doubt that he is overweight because someone already told us he needed to take in more calcium"... Don't know what the being overweight has to do with needing calcium in a male.

You said..."We feed the crickets with their own calcium diet" ...specifically?

You said..."I just bought a new bulb for his light and that usually stays on 10-12 hours same with his heat lamp"...what specific UVB bulb do you sue? Long linear tube or compact? Brand? Heat lamp?

You said..."His cage is on a tall table in front of a window he likes to look out of and there is a ceiling fan I turn it on sometimes when he would need a breeze"...where do you live?

You said..."He doesn’t have any real plants in the cage but we do feed him pothos"...plants should be real, non toxic and well washed high sides if the leaves. No reason to feed him pothos....or other plant leaves.

You said..."my main concern about him is his crooked tail and spine which I think is causing his back legs to cramp up and be uncomfortable"...he also has gular edema....that needs investigation too.

You said..."Is it just developed bone disease that’s incurable?"... MBD can be corrected but any damage to his bones such as breaks, bends, etc will remain likely. It can be kept from returning by correcting your husbandry.
 

cruz.m

Avid Member
You said.."I’ve been treating him for maybe 4 months now and I haven’t seen a change"...how have you been treating it?

You said..."He gets about 3-5 crickets a day and 2-3 worms with calcium and vitamins"...you need to be specific about the supplements....how often do you dust with each one?
I don't recommend using the orange cubes. It's better to feed crickets, superworms, locusts, roaches with a wide assortment of greens such as dandelion greens, kale, collards, endive, escarole, etc and veggies such as squash, zucchini, sweet potatoes, sweet red pepper, etc and a small amount of berries, apples, pears, etc.

You said..."I wouldn’t doubt that he is overweight because someone already told us he needed to take in more calcium"... Don't know what the being overweight has to do with needing calcium in a male.

You said..."We feed the crickets with their own calcium diet" ...specifically?

You said..."I just bought a new bulb for his light and that usually stays on 10-12 hours same with his heat lamp"...what specific UVB bulb do you sue? Long linear tube or compact? Brand? Heat lamp?

You said..."His cage is on a tall table in front of a window he likes to look out of and there is a ceiling fan I turn it on sometimes when he would need a breeze"...where do you live?

You said..."He doesn’t have any real plants in the cage but we do feed him pothos"...plants should be real, non toxic and well washed high sides if the leaves. No reason to feed him pothos....or other plant leaves.

You said..."my main concern about him is his crooked tail and spine which I think is causing his back legs to cramp up and be uncomfortable"...he also has gular edema....that needs investigation too.

You said..."Is it just developed bone disease that’s incurable?"... MBD can be corrected but any damage to his bones such as breaks, bends, etc will remain likely. It can be kept from returning by correcting your husbandry.
👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼 I really needed to say this for some reason but if you’ve been “treating it” for 4 MONTHS how do you not know what you’re “treating”? Also MBD is irreversible and everything you said just concerned and baffled me :)
 

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kinyonga

Chameleon Enthusiast
@cruz.m you outed my post and said this...
"👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼 I really needed to say this for some reason but if you’ve been “treating it” for 4 MONTHS how do you not know what you’re “treating”? Also MBD is irreversible and everything you said just concerned and baffled me :)"...are you talking to me or the OP?
I've no idea what you're inferring.


You might like to read this...it's only some of the effects of the MBD, like crooked bones, etc, that are unable to be correected/reversed. The bone and muscle weaknesses can be reversed.
http://www.reptilesplus.co.uk/blog/blog.php?id=mbd
"With proper treatment and correction of any environmental or nutritional factors, the calcium deficiency and MBD can be corrected. However, many of the effects of MBD will be permanent, such as bone deformities"
 
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cruz.m

Avid Member
@cruz.m you outed my post and said this...
"👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼 I really needed to say this for some reason but if you’ve been “treating it” for 4 MONTHS how do you not know what you’re “treating”? Also MBD is irreversible and everything you said just concerned and baffled me :)"...are you talking to me or the OP?
I've no idea what you're inferring.
I’m talking to the OP but I replied to your post because I agree with what you said and had the same questions sorry for the misunderstanding 😆 also OP said that they have been “treating” the MBD but later inferred that they didn’t know what MBD was so I was just like you’ve been supposedly “treating” this MBD for 4 months as he said but didn’t know what exactly he was treating. It just didn’t make sense to me, again I’m sorry!

I’ve read the link before @kinyonga I’m not good with words sometimes but thanks for clarifying 😊
 
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Fraservet

New Member
I would suspect he has permanent bones deformities from the previous MBD. As has been said, you can improve the bones and prevent further problems by correcting the deficiency/lighting etc. but you won’t fix those sort of changes.

Definitely need to do something about his weight - especially with boney issues as it won’t help his joints etc.
 

Beman

Chameleon Enthusiast
I’m aware he has mbd and I have been treating it but I don’t really know why his tail and spine is curving like this. I’ve tried to change his whole cage set up because I thought he was bending it up when he’s laying down but maybe it’s something else? I’ve been treating him for maybe 4 months now and I haven’t seen a change. If you need anymore info lmk I just haven’t seen anyone else with this problem.
His names Neo and he’s very sweet. he’s never hissed or snapped at all and the only time he gets blue dotty or upset is when he gets too hot. He’s my first Cham so if you could give me any tips it would make us both very happy
You need a reptile vet... This boy is extremely obese and has gular edema as well as the MBD. This would be very painful for him. Your husbandry is wrong. He should not be eating every day.

Please expand on how you are using the supplements and the type of lighting your using along with the distance to the branch below it.
Take a picture of the entire cage including the lights.
 
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