Male veiled chameleon hunger strike

[Angrychair]

I rescued a 'female' veiled chameleon from someone who had him in a glass enclosure and fed him only 5 crickets. It was immediately obvious that he was a male to me, tall veil and... duh the spurs.

I've had him for 2 months now and he has been doing great up until the last week. He has been shedding good, in fact he's shed at least 3 times in 2 months. I figure he is adult, he's pretty big, good size, very active. He explores his cage all day between baskings.

I have him in a zoo/med 18x18x36 mesh, with uva/uvb and a 75 watt basking bulb, his basking spot is 95°F and the cool side is around 80 at day and 70-75 at night. I keep a water dish with fresh water in his cage, and I have a dripper. I feed him blaptica dubia and super worm, dusted with repcal and calcium with d3, he's not much on eating greens though I offer them from time to time. For the last 7-10 days I haven't got him to eat anything. I usually put his feeders in a bowl inside his enclosure and he eats them out of there throughout the day at his leisure, and sometimes i set a superworm free on the screen and he'll go after it. But he just doesn't care.

I don't handle him, and I mess with him as little as possible. I have moved him to a room that gets little to no person traffic, so he can't be stressed out by seeing people too much, not that he was in a high traffic area anyway.

As far as I know I'm doing everything right. I'm starting to worry, what say you enthusiasts? This is my first and only chameleon, he is really good looking.

 

[KatiLemons]

His basking spot is to hot if its at 95 degrees, try using a 60 watt instead of a 75 watt.
Supplements:
Calcium w/o D3 every feeding
Calcium w/ D3 every two weeks
Herptivite every two weeks
the last two alternate every other week.


Copy and Paste and Fill this form out completly and down to the T description.

https://www.chameleonforums.com/how-ask-help-66/

 

[camimom]

I rescued a 'female' veiled chameleon from someone who had him in a glass enclosure and fed him only 5 crickets. It was immediately obvious that he was a male to me, tall veil and... duh the spurs.

I've had him for 2 months now and he has been doing great up until the last week. He has been shedding good, in fact he's shed at least 3 times in 2 months. I figure he is adult, he's pretty big, good size, very active. He explores his cage all day between baskings.

I have him in a zoo/med 18x18x36 mesh, with uva/uvb and a 75 watt basking bulb, his basking spot is 95°F and the cool side is around 80 at day and 70-75 at night. I keep a water dish with fresh water in his cage, and I have a dripper. I feed him blaptica dubia and super worm, dusted with repcal and calcium with d3, he's not much on eating greens though I offer them from time to time. For the last 7-10 days I haven't got him to eat anything. I usually put his feeders in a bowl inside his enclosure and he eats them out of there throughout the day at his leisure, and sometimes i set a superworm free on the screen and he'll go after it. But he just doesn't care.

I don't handle him, and I mess with him as little as possible. I have moved him to a room that gets little to no person traffic, so he can't be stressed out by seeing people too much, not that he was in a high traffic area anyway.

As far as I know I'm doing everything right. I'm starting to worry, what say you enthusiasts? This is my first and only chameleon, he is really good looking.

So can you post a few pics of him on something we can compare his size to, to see if hes actulal fully grown?
ALso, as the previouis poster said, 95 is too hot for basking, pls lower that temp to around 85.
pls remove the water dish, chams drinking dripping water, nto standing water, and if he poops in it, then decides to drink from it, it will grow bacteria and make your cham sick.
Also, if hes fully grown,the cage hes in is a bit small. males generally use 24*24*48, the one you have is better suited for females.
do not feed super worms often, first they arent high in nutrients, second, they are coverd in a hard exo skeleton which can cause impaction, and third, if the cham loves them he can go on a roach/cricket strike, and refuse to eat anything but worms.

 

[Angrychair]

I keep the water dish for added humidity and i wash it out EVERY day. But if you still want me to remove it.

Behavior wise, I've noticed him exploring his cage a LOT, aka cage stress. He used to bask more and just chill compared to recently.


Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?

yemen veiled male, age unknown, 1-2 years??? he is about 5.5 inches from nose to vent. I've had him for 2 months.

Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?

once in two months since I've had him.

Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?

dubia, super worm, wax worm to the lesser. I offer him what ever he will eat daily, i lightly dust with a mixture of repcal vitamin and calcium w and w/o d3 50% of the time.

Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?

oops just covered it. Zoomed calcium and repcal repti vitamins. I dust 3-4 days out of the week.

Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?

I mist him and his enclosure a few timse a day, he has a dripper I run once or twice a day, and that water bowl you told me to remove that i wash daily

Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?

his fecal is a norma poop shape, firm, tested for parasites 1 month ago that came back negative. I do have benibac in supply if needed.

History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

I just purchased him 1 month ago and he has been doing fine until recently. He did start shedding recently but he it didn't effect his appetite previously.

Cage Info:
Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?

screen 18x18x36

Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?

reptiglo 5.0 and 2.0 compact and a 75w basking bulb. using the compact hood that i got with him, but changed the bulbs, and added a basking lamp

Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?

Upon actual thermal measurement with a quality infared gun, His basking spot is ~86°F and about 75°F cool side, night temps are 70-75

Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?

I live in Missouri and ambient humidity varies, its around 55% now. I keep him misted and have a waster dish in his enclosure.

Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?

parlor palm.

Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?

In a spare room, on a stand 2 feet tall, top of cage is at 5 feet. No high traffic.

Location - Where are you geographically located?

St. Louis, Mo


Here are some pictures.














thanks for help and quick responses guys. Liking this forum already.

 

[camimom]

If you wash the water dish everyday, you can keep it, though most of us are still uncomfortable with them.
For supplementing- you should use a calicum without d3 everyfeeding, calciwum with d3 twice a month, and a multivitamin twice a month.
hes only 5.5 inches from nose to vent? that doesnt seem quite full grown to me. can you post a pic of him on your arm or hand please?
he looks pretty good, can you maybe get a pic of his face fro the front, showing the front of the casque? it seems pretty dark to me.

86 is a good temp for basking for him.
If you want to keep humidity up, get more live plants, or tape a plastic shower curtain two 2 sides of his enclosure.

edit- just saw a pic of the front of his face, i thought he might have had a burn there, but theres nothing, must have been a shadow.
i would add some more foliage towards the top of his cage, this can help reduce stress.

 

[Angrychair]

more pictures, sure, let me upload some. I handled him ONCE, to get some pictures, I kept him on his stick that he has in his enclosure, and he walked onto my arm.

 

[SliK JiM]

I read your other post as well so i'll answer them both here!

Firstly, he looks in 'pretty' good health. It's always hard to see from photos, but his spine looks good, no severely bend limbs and he looks alert in the photo (of him looking alert) so they're all good signs that he will be fine. The slight bend in his cask shouldn't be an issue.

Hunger strikes aren't uncommon. My male veiled went for about a week without eating anything. No real reasons for it, just one of those things. If there are no 'symptoms' then dont worry. Being active is a great sign as is drinking water. If either of those stop, then there may be something else wrong.

As for your set up:

I think it looks good, but there is room for improvement. I would suggest moving him into something bigger soon, as he is quite a large guy for 18x18x36. 24x24x48 is the minimum id have him in (I really like big cages though!).

Adding a bit more foliage at the top wouldn't go amiss to give him more places to hide.

I don't know if its a big thing in the states, but compact UV bulbs have been slated in the UK so I would personally ditch those. I also wouldn't use a 10.0 and a 2.0 together. A 5.0 would probably be ample in your current set up, but moving to a taller cage would certainly warrant the 10.0.

If you're happy to mist manually (which i think you're doing) then stick with it, but a mist king (or other misting system) will make life much easier and more convenient.

Again, its hard to diagnose problems on line, but as things are he looks ok. I would probably remove the 2.0 UV bulb immediately leaving just the 10.0 (as it would have burned in by now and won't be that intense) but see if this increases his appetite. If it does, consider going down to a 5.0 or going to a larger enclosure with the 10.0.

I hope that helps!

 

[Angrychair]

I read your other post as well so i'll answer them both here!

Firstly, he looks in 'pretty' good health. It's always hard to see from photos, but his spine looks good, no severely bend limbs and he looks alert in the photo (of him looking alert) so they're all good signs that he will be fine. The slight bend in his cask shouldn't be an issue.

Hunger strikes aren't uncommon. My male veiled went for about a week without eating anything. No real reasons for it, just one of those things. If there are no 'symptoms' then dont worry. Being active is a great sign as is drinking water. If either of those stop, then there may be something else wrong.

As for your set up:

I think it looks good, but there is room for improvement. I would suggest moving him into something bigger soon, as he is quite a large guy for 18x18x36. 24x24x48 is the minimum id have him in (I really like big cages though!).

Adding a bit more foliage at the top wouldn't go amiss to give him more places to hide.

I don't know if its a big thing in the states, but compact UV bulbs have been slated in the UK so I would personally ditch those. I also wouldn't use a 10.0 and a 2.0 together. A 5.0 would probably be ample in your current set up, but moving to a taller cage would certainly warrant the 10.0.

If you're happy to mist manually (which i think you're doing) then stick with it, but a mist king (or other misting system) will make life much easier and more convenient.

Again, its hard to diagnose problems on line, but as things are he looks ok. I would probably remove the 2.0 UV bulb immediately leaving just the 10.0 (as it would have burned in by now and won't be that intense) but see if this increases his appetite. If it does, consider going down to a 5.0 or going to a larger enclosure with the 10.0.

I hope that helps!

Thank you sir, I'll heed all your advice. Well except the mist king, they are expensive, at least for now. I've read a lot on bulbs, and I do agree the compacts suck compared to long tubes. They create intense spots. I went with a compact 10 though because from my personal research, and bulb degredation, I though it would be better and more close to actual sun light, as the bulb is losing intensity since it's going through a screen, and foliage, to some degree. I'm not agrueing, just discussing my point of view based on my knowledge. I would like to get a 18" tube fixture in the future and go to a 5.0 bulb then, but I just purchased one, and a reptisun 10.0 18", along with a 160w powersun MVB for my frilled dragons new 4ft tall x 4ft wide x 2ft deep enclosure, and that ran me $110, OUCH. I'll do what I can with my current situation.

Now that my A.D.D has kicked in and I don't even remember what I was talking about to begin with, thanks. I'll check back tomorrow or so.

 

[Angrychair]

I wanted to ask one more thing, how much can these guys be handled?

and I don't mean get him out and play with him. I realize it is a display animal that is high stress etc. But when I need to or have to move him etc for cleaning / maintenance. I just don't want to add any undue stress that I should be avoiding. Heck I'm afraid to even go into the spare room I put him in now.

 

[camimom]

Thank you sir, I'll heed all your advice. Well except the mist king, they are expensive, at least for now. I've read a lot on bulbs, and I do agree the compacts suck compared to long tubes. They create intense spots. I went with a compact 10 though because from my personal research, and bulb degredation, I though it would be better and more close to actual sun light, as the bulb is losing intensity since it's going through a screen, and foliage, to some degree. I'm not agrueing, just discussing my point of view based on my knowledge. I would like to get a 18" tube fixture in the future and go to a 5.0 bulb then, but I just purchased one, and a reptisun 10.0 18", along with a 160w powersun MVB for my frilled dragons new 4ft tall x 4ft wide x 2ft deep enclosure, and that ran me $110, OUCH. I'll do what I can with my current situation.

Now that my A.D.D has kicked in and I don't even remember what I was talking about to begin with, thanks. I'll check back tomorrow or so.

I agree, he looks decent. Thank you for the pic of him on your arm. It helps with sizing. I do not think he is quite fully grown, maybe around a year old, bit under perhaps. he does need some fattening up though.
If you need a new cage, petco.com has 24*24*48 reptibreezes for 75 bucks with free shipping.

I use the spiral bulb, i have had no problems with it.
the thicker your folaige, the higher uvb i would go with. a 10.0 is fine if its gotta deal with alot of stuff in the wy. just make sure your cham doesnt keep its eyes closed alot during the day. if so, then change it to a lower wattage.

ps. pretty boy.

i handle my boy once a day. some cant tolerate it at all. if he doestn hiss and try to bite you, then you should be fine with the required handling.

 

[SliK JiM]

Thank you sir, I'll heed all your advice. Well except the mist king, they are expensive, at least for now. I've read a lot on bulbs, and I do agree the compacts suck compared to long tubes. They create intense spots. I went with a compact 10 though because from my personal research, and bulb degredation, I though it would be better and more close to actual sun light, as the bulb is losing intensity since it's going through a screen, and foliage, to some degree. I'm not agrueing, just discussing my point of view based on my knowledge. I would like to get a 18" tube fixture in the future and go to a 5.0 bulb then, but I just purchased one, and a reptisun 10.0 18", along with a 160w powersun MVB for my frilled dragons new 4ft tall x 4ft wide x 2ft deep enclosure, and that ran me $110, OUCH. I'll do what I can with my current situation.

Now that my A.D.D has kicked in and I don't even remember what I was talking about to begin with, thanks. I'll check back tomorrow or so.

It took me a while to get a mist king mainly because im in the UK and the import tax was going to be extortionate! Something like another 40% on top of all other costs (including the bloody postage costs!)! Bloody UK postal system! Anyway, I got one from a Polish distributor and it was money well spent! But it is definitely an initial whack of cash that can be avoided!!!

If i had my way with lighting, I would personally use megaray bulbs as the main light source for an enclosure, then a small supplementary bulb for basking. Sadly, as I like to use as much space as I can for the enclosure, I can't fit the MVB bulb high enough above the cage for the levels of UVB to be acceptable. I think this is where the issues arise with compact bulbs is that people treat them like linear tubes and just slap them on top when ideally they should have a good gap between the bulb face and the top mesh.

A great resource for this is: http://www.uvguide.co.uk/ I don't think its updated all that often any more, but when I started with chams this was the place to go for lighting advice!

But again, i think your current set up should be fine as the bulb had been burned in for a few months.

I wanted to ask one more thing, how much can these guys be handled?

and I don't mean get him out and play with him. I realize it is a display animal that is high stress etc. But when I need to or have to move him etc for cleaning / maintenance. I just don't want to add any undue stress that I should be avoiding. Heck I'm afraid to even go into the spare room I put him in now.

This is a very subjective question! It depends massively on the individual chameleon. People tend to generalise species into friendly/not friendly which is utter rubbish. It depends entirely on your chameleon. My veiled will not go near me! He tolerates me being in the room he's in and if i put food into his cage, he will normally hang around if he's hungry. Other than that, if im cleaning/watering plants etc he will quite literally run away and hide.

My panther chameleon on the other hand will come out almost all the time and 'appears' to enjoy the interaction and will often ride on my shoulder/head if I'm walking around the house with absolutely no worries!

They are completely opposite, but their behavior is exactly the same when they're in their enclosure and I'm in the room. I think they realise the enclosure is 'closed' and they're safe in their little bubble! Cleaning/maintenance is completely necessary so you just have to do what you have to do. He will become accustomed to it with time. If he seeks interaction with you, then go for it! Hand feeding treats (like waxworms) can be a great way to interact and lessen the impact of interactions in the future as he will associate you with treats (like Pavlov with his dog experiment).

I'm hoping all this helps! Everyone will have their own opinion so find what works for you!

 

[Angrychair]

man, when i first got him, i could get him to eat food items off my hand, or from tongs easily, but he started doing that less, up to this point where he hasn't been eating for a week. Bahhumbug.

Thanks a ton slik jim, camimom, and everyone else. I keep you posted.

 

[Wolfengod]

I read your other post as well so i'll answer them both here!

Firstly, he looks in 'pretty' good health. It's always hard to see from photos, but his spine looks good, no severely bend limbs and he looks alert in the photo (of him looking alert) so they're all good signs that he will be fine. The slight bend in his cask shouldn't be an issue.

Hunger strikes aren't uncommon. My male veiled went for about a week without eating anything. No real reasons for it, just one of those things. If there are no 'symptoms' then dont worry. Being active is a great sign as is drinking water. If either of those stop, then there may be something else wrong.

As for your set up:

I think it looks good, but there is room for improvement. I would suggest moving him into something bigger soon, as he is quite a large guy for 18x18x36. 24x24x48 is the minimum id have him in (I really like big cages though!).

Adding a bit more foliage at the top wouldn't go amiss to give him more places to hide.

I don't know if its a big thing in the states, but compact UV bulbs have been slated in the UK so I would personally ditch those. I also wouldn't use a 10.0 and a 2.0 together. A 5.0 would probably be ample in your current set up, but moving to a taller cage would certainly warrant the 10.0.

If you're happy to mist manually (which i think you're doing) then stick with it, but a mist king (or other misting system) will make life much easier and more convenient.

Again, its hard to diagnose problems on line, but as things are he looks ok. I would probably remove the 2.0 UV bulb immediately leaving just the 10.0 (as it would have burned in by now and won't be that intense) but see if this increases his appetite. If it does, consider going down to a 5.0 or going to a larger enclosure with the 10.0.

I hope that helps!

i completely agree we were told the compact bulbs cause blinding and other issues by the vet who specializes in all reptiles. we bought a fixture for the long tubes and it works great. unfortunatley we could not save our lil amiela she was in horrible shape from the breeder with broken back and malnutrition. but as the previous posts it looks well maybe try a wet dogfood mix in a siringe (ear style) to cause an interest in eating something new. variety is expected in the breed.

 

[SliK JiM]

Any improvement?

 

[Angrychair]

not really. I have been doing what I can. I sold a pc part on craiglist today and bought a reptisun 5.0 18" UVB and pit it in an old black light fixture I had. He's still really active and alert, between stopping to warm back up in his basking spot.

 

[SliK JiM]

not really. I have been doing what I can. I sold a pc part on craiglist today and bought a reptisun 5.0 18" UVB and pit it in an old black light fixture I had. He's still really active and alert, between stopping to warm back up in his basking spot.

If he's moving around then I wouldn't worry. Try using a different feeder if you have the option? Something that flies will definitely get his interest!

Keep us updated!

 

[Angrychair]

my girlfriend is a wildlife biologist and manages a rescue center for mammals, and local reptiles and amphibians.

She wanted me to ask if you guys think we should give him a B complex injection to stimulate appetite. As she specializes in native stuff. Also, pedialite orally??????

 

[SliK JiM]

my girlfriend is a wildlife biologist and manages a rescue center for mammals, and local reptiles and amphibians.

She wanted me to ask if you guys think we should give him a B complex injection to stimulate appetite. As she specializes in native stuff. Also, pedialite orally??????

Way too technical for me! I'd possibly start a new thread with that in the title and see if you get any posts that way!

Has there been no change then? Still active/drinking just not eating? When was the last poo and shed?

 

[Angrychair]

still active, not really drinking much, or eating at all really. Last shed was last week, still pooing, just really small, 1/4 of the normal or less.

 

[Angrychair]

Ok, he still isn't eating, an drinking very little, i syringe fed him some pedialite today because I'm worried. I've upgraded his cage with some live plants and shifted some fake ones farther u, and given him a 18" reptisun 5.0 over the crappy compacts. I washed the plants leaves with soapy water and rinsed it before I put it in there.

I've also included some pictures of him. It wasn't so easy.

Please let me know if he is looking skinny or dehydrated so I know how much to keep worrying about him not feeding/drinking. I have horn worms coming soon to try to stimulate his appetite. I also do not like doing wild caught feeders, but I did catch a house fly and a walking stick that I offered him, though the walking stick died and he didn't eat it, and I think the fly just escaped his enclosure. Sorry for over exposed pictures my lighting sucks and the flash is meh.