Jackson's
- Thread starter dino1920
- Start date
Benjlan
Member
That's exactly the way my female looks. Do you have experience keeping male and female together and can it be done?
Benjlan
Member
My couple live in separate enclosures inside. They were together till the male harassed the female too much. He wants to breed but she doesn't. Botttom cage temperature is 71 top is 83 degrees Fahrenheit but at night igoes down to 65.Yes you can absolutely. Males together = Never, but M+F, no issue til they decide to do something together
Well, which kind of lighting to you use ? Do you keep them outside ?
They don't need a big gap of temperature night and day, while most people use to say.
Benjlan
Member
Use a 36" uvb and two compact uvb. I be is accomplish by two ge reveal Fourty watts
Seiryu
Established Member
Fred. I'm not trying to argue with you. I have bred xantholophus and also Jacksonii as well as other species. There is no benefit at all, to keep Jackson's chameleons together. Can it be done with a large enough enclosure and watching them on a daily basis? Sure. But I can also tell from the picture of yours you posted, you have 2 VERY stressed chameleons.
The only benefit to keeping 2 in the same enclosure is to the keeper for cutting corners to save money on extra cages, lights etc. That's about it. Otherwise you will have stressed chameleons, and a female that is getting annoyed by a male on a daily basis.
The only benefit to keeping 2 in the same enclosure is to the keeper for cutting corners to save money on extra cages, lights etc. That's about it. Otherwise you will have stressed chameleons, and a female that is getting annoyed by a male on a daily basis.
FREDCO
Member
i understand well. about the pictures and stress animal, i am pretty sure that you know chams don't like pictures... i have had till 220 chameleons and i can recognize stress because of this or this. But again, a couple of jacksoni is not an issue, sure you need a correct enclosure size and vegetation etc... Obviously, it's always better to keep them into their own enclosure, separately. I agree. After there is season, age etc for breeding, it's during this periode you need to take care and to do the necessary to separate. Again, my opinion. To me, it's clear, chameleon needs correct enclosure anyway. For some, it mandatory to get a room, or special location, not enclosure.
leedragon
Chameleon Enthusiast
220 chameleons are nothing really if you are counting the chameleons in each batch. lets say you have 4 pair they each give a batch of 20 you just have to have 3 batches of each to get to 220. and I am guessing not all of them are jacksons? if you indeed hade 220 adult jacksons or kept the babies until the reach 3 years or so. So you have seen and experience the change of their needs and consequences of the exposure of your particular husbandry. keeping those 220 babies gives you only so much to go on with.
Yes all the respect to neccas. but since the updated his last book tons of new information some correcting his statements in his book. some adding new info to it have been made. And plenty of this information can be found here. I have even asked him if he iis planing on updating his book with this new informating and I am yet awaiting for his answer.
I may be remembering incorrectly but Christ Andersson has recommend not keeping chameleons together in some threads here. he can correct me if I am wrong.
Keeping them together will result in mating. giving birth to the neonates takes alot from the female so that´s a reason to not keep them together. stress is and other many many times stress goes unnoticed until the chameleon goes thrue the days with they eyes closed and not eating. then is often too late and you go and wonder why is this so if I did everything right.
pregnad females need to be housed aloned regardless so when your 2 chameleons mate you need to separed them. then after birth the female need to go alone so she has time to recover. in this proces a year can pass with the female being alone. so why even bother to keep them together when you are not planing in mating them right now ( and by right now I mean the specific moment when they are together)
in conclution the chameleon may take huge harm by been housed with an other chameleon. it will take non by being housed alone.
Yes all the respect to neccas. but since the updated his last book tons of new information some correcting his statements in his book. some adding new info to it have been made. And plenty of this information can be found here. I have even asked him if he iis planing on updating his book with this new informating and I am yet awaiting for his answer.
I may be remembering incorrectly but Christ Andersson has recommend not keeping chameleons together in some threads here. he can correct me if I am wrong.
Keeping them together will result in mating. giving birth to the neonates takes alot from the female so that´s a reason to not keep them together. stress is and other many many times stress goes unnoticed until the chameleon goes thrue the days with they eyes closed and not eating. then is often too late and you go and wonder why is this so if I did everything right.
pregnad females need to be housed aloned regardless so when your 2 chameleons mate you need to separed them. then after birth the female need to go alone so she has time to recover. in this proces a year can pass with the female being alone. so why even bother to keep them together when you are not planing in mating them right now ( and by right now I mean the specific moment when they are together)
in conclution the chameleon may take huge harm by been housed with an other chameleon. it will take non by being housed alone.
FREDCO
Member
Lot of words, trying to say something clear. When we use to say that you can keep couple it's clearly a question of season and to be able to consider gravidity of female. I don't want to try to be the specialist of nothing. But instead of trying to give me lessons, i think it's better to teach lighting, heating, enclosure for a first chameleon of some people. 44 years, i started 26 y old with our animals and i know so much this way of thinking on website.
About the numbers of chameleons and so, i let you write what you want. I am here to share and it's always because of people like you that discussion has no interest at the end. Only "you can because" or "your can't because" of ? Long way to be sure of something with cameleon, and take care not to be too sure of something your hear and not experimented in real and during years. Bye, wow... in each country a giver of lessons...
About the numbers of chameleons and so, i let you write what you want. I am here to share and it's always because of people like you that discussion has no interest at the end. Only "you can because" or "your can't because" of ? Long way to be sure of something with cameleon, and take care not to be too sure of something your hear and not experimented in real and during years. Bye, wow... in each country a giver of lessons...
Carlton
Chameleon Enthusiast
Alright folks, let me offer another view about this please. We have here a difference of opinion between several experienced keepers. The majority of people seeking information from this forum are hobby keepers who are NOT experienced enough to detect subtle individual signs of cumulative stress in their jackson's, and who are getting poor information from various pet shops, websites, or dealers. The majority of keepers will be keeping one or two chams as indoor pets, not setting up long term breeding situations. They usually find this forum when their animals are already in trouble, or they have decided to learn more about giving their chams a decent quality of life. They also do not have the ability to provide large adaptable living spaces where a group of them could realistically co-exist. It is better for the chams to recommend caging individually under these circumstances.
Forum members have to consider the audience that is listening to the information we present and err on the conservative more protective side. This is not a competition for bragging rights. it is an advisory group. Please set the egos aside for a moment. Nothing is absolutely black and white as we all know. There will always be intolerant individual chams and those who don't seem to mind group housing. We can't predict this and we can't expect most hobby keepers to know. While I may decide to follow my own experience in how I keep a particular cham, its done with a very careful eye and long experience. What I suggest to a newbie is NOT always the same. I want to give someone the best chance to give their pets a decent quality of life, not prove my point.
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FREDCO
Member
My only advise is just to say this : first a chameleon is not an animal to handle, if you need, take a dog. (could be with some pardalis sometimes...) The interest to breed is to Watch, to figure out, to test and assess where you are after many years of Learning and own experience.
I also agree with the way of thinking of Carlton and you are right to consider the audience as expecting the right information. And at the end, that's the question... right information ? Again, no glass inclosure, right lighting, uv, no lighting at night etc etc... The battle is to help and support, not to struggle for his own way of thinking.
I also agree with the way of thinking of Carlton and you are right to consider the audience as expecting the right information. And at the end, that's the question... right information ? Again, no glass inclosure, right lighting, uv, no lighting at night etc etc... The battle is to help and support, not to struggle for his own way of thinking.
leedragon
Chameleon Enthusiast
yet you didn't mention any of it. I am not giving you lessons. I am contradicting your advice. you obviously have already stablesh adults. don't know how they are doing but you do have them. I am as said contradicting your advice given to his person and telling you why.
About the numbers. you wrote it as credibility and I review it. if you have 220 chameleons and the majority of them are babies from the batches. That is nothing. breeder make those number for every expo they attend.
And no. you don´t know my kin. THAT would be a first.
I make mistakes, seek for people who made them too and overcome them. I give the information to the ones who are experiencing the same problem and observe their results..
Thats why I am on this site.
About the numbers. you wrote it as credibility and I review it. if you have 220 chameleons and the majority of them are babies from the batches. That is nothing. breeder make those number for every expo they attend.
And no. you don´t know my kin. THAT would be a first.
I make mistakes, seek for people who made them too and overcome them. I give the information to the ones who are experiencing the same problem and observe their results..
Thats why I am on this site.
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FREDCO
Member
Leedragon, can i post in general ,not answering to you ? it's the case. I don't like your welcome and i have other things to do than spending my time to struggle here with you. If it should be the case, let me know, i understand "you are on this site" and i will see what's going on in another place.
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