How long does it take for poor nutrition to manifest in problems?

[Ceycham]

I've found that this chameleon brings out the worrier in me, so I am hoping for reassurance. I've had him since June and other than our current frustrating issues with getting water in him, he seems healthy. If I were not doing enough, would his health have deteriorated by now? Is it safe to let myself stop worrying about whether I'm supplementing enough or too much, or not giving enough variety, and feel confident that my current regimen is working well? He's growing, shedding, eating (albeit much less and pickier than he used to be) and drinking (a very little...this is a work in progress). His bones appear straight, his color decent if not as bright as I'd like. Does this mean I'm doing all right? Does he look good to you?

 

[nightanole]

2-3 months min. Hell they can go a month without nutrition (hunger strike or transport, or just plain old brumation during winter or dry spells).

If it makes you feel better, 9/10 poor nutrition problems are from over supplementing, not under...

 

[Syreptyon]

Fill out this help form and we'll be able to tell you if your husbandry sounds good! He doesn't look bad to me, but oftentimes chameleons will hide signs of poor health.

Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
• Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
• Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
• Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
• Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
• Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
• History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
• Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
• Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
• Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
• Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
• Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
• Location - Where are you geographically located?

Current Problem - The current problem you are concerned about.

 

[Ceycham]

Fill out this help form and we'll be able to tell you if your husbandry sounds good! He doesn't look bad to me, but oftentimes chameleons will hide signs of poor health.

Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon - Male veiled approximately 10 months old, in my care since June 2017
• Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon? Once in a while. Generally only when he insists, or if I need to clean.
• Feeding - Once was on a decent variety regimen with crickets, BBF, BSF, wax worms, roaches and occasionally hornworms. Lately his appetite has dropped significantly and he's unexcited about his crickets. he will snatch up waxworms and other larvae pretty readily, but crickets he eats a couple when he gets around to it. Hornworms are a favorite, so I've had to cut back so he'll eat other stuff. I haven't any roaches at the moment.
• Supplements - I dust all crickets with calcium no D, then once a week either vitamins or calcium with D, alternating. I've only been dusting the crickets, and occasionally the hornworms when they are of good size (because its easy)
• Watering - Mist several times daily for 45 seconds each, dripper, and have recently added showering when I feel he's not taking in otherwise. Having a bad time with his water lately. When I try something new he seems to catch on and do great, then his drinking tapers off and suddenly he will take nothing (that I see)
• Fecal Description - Dark brown poop, they appear moist when freshly dropped but they dry to shriveled things if I notice them late.
• History - nothing notable. I've worried a lot about his post puberty behaviors but I'm becoming aware that they are normal. He's a rollercoaster of doing great then failing to do great, then doing great again, etc

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - custom screen 22x30x42
• Lighting - reptisun 5.0 fluorescent, 100w house bulb for heat
• Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Basking is in low 80's, I don't really measure lower. House temp stays 70
• Humidity - 45-55.
• Plants - live pothos and some fake leaves too
• Placement - Where is your cage located? (Living room) Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas?( high traffic yes) At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor? (About 5.5 feet off floor)
• Location - Iowa

Current Problem - Having problems with hydration currently, but otherwise seems healthy. Still less than enthused about his crickets, but he eats a few of them. Jut want to feel ok about his overall health.

 

[zordtaz]

I agree with @nightanole. I think maybe adjust the temperature to 2-3 degrees. The rest is fine. He is look chubby as well.

 

[Graves923]

For you hydration issue, try increasing misting duration to 2 minutes each time you spray the cage. 45 seconds might not be long enough to stimulate him to drink or clean his eyes.

Also, try to get your basking temp up to the upper mid 80s F. Around a year old you can bump it to about 90F. Just remember to keep a close eye for thermal burns anytime you raise basking light temps since generally we measure temp at the branch but when the cham is basking, their back is acouple inches above the measurement point.

Overall from your photo and help form answers he seems pretty healthy.

 

[Ceycham]

Will make all the adjustments you've all recommended, and thank you. Next order of business will be purchasing a mist king, as his current mister doesn't go past 45 seconds. The only thing that leaves me concerned is that I've tried repeating the cycle over and over so that he gets longer mists that way, and he ignores it. He won't move away or hide, just lets it wash over him with his eyes closed without drinking. I've twice brought him to the shower and run it for as long as 20 minutes and never once saw him drink. He just wants to climb the shower hose lol. He's like a darned horse (you can bring them to water but you can't make them drink). Today some hornworms arrived so he'll get some of those, but they are still quite small and not as juicy as they will soon be. His urates look terrible so we need an intervention for sure.

 

[JacksJill]

If you have decent drainage hand misting might work better. I'm getting better results hand misting in the cage rather than a shower. You need a hand mister that you can pressurize and patience. I start with a short spray to get them wet and let them get over the shock of being sprayed. Once they settle down again I do several long gentle sprays with short breaks to pressurize. Eventually even my most stubborn will start to drink and clean their eyes. As always try not to stare at them and stay below them if you so they aren't intimidated.
This might get you through until you get a better system.

 

[kinyonga]

How long do you run the dripper for? How fast does it drip?

 

[Ceycham]

If you have decent drainage hand misting might work better. I'm getting better results hand misting in the cage rather than a shower. You need a hand mister that you can pressurize and patience. I start with a short spray to get them wet and let them get over the shock of being sprayed. Once they settle down again I do several long gentle sprays with short breaks to pressurize. Eventually even my most stubborn will start to drink and clean their eyes. As always try not to stare at them and stay below them if you so they aren't intimidated.
This might get you through until you get a better system.View attachment 198671

How can i tell if he drinks without staring...I can tell my watching intimidates him but how else to catch him drinking?

 

[Ceycham]

How long do you run the dripper for? How fast does it drip?

I fill the dripper with about 5-8 oz at a time, and run it so it drips about once a second. I've also tried faster and slower, but if he seems interested he's too slow to catch the drips. ir's so frustrating as he could just go up to it and open his mouth, but goofy has to shoot his tongue at the drips, and takes too long aiming! As for how often i =fill it...every time I'm home and looking at him worrying about his intake, which is several times daily

 

[JacksJill]

How can i tell if he drinks without staring...I can tell my watching intimidates him but how else to catch him drinking?

I try to look at other things in the cage and use my peripheral vision. Just keep glancing away.
Chameleons stare at each other before combat and stare directly at their food before eating. A two eyed stare is a challenge but one eye or a glance doesn't seem as intimidating. These are just my observations from hand feeding and spraying. I have more success when I'm lower than the chameleon and i don't look to intensely.

 

[zordtaz]

If he shoot to get water, it is normal. I saw mine do it one time. He constantly shoot to get water that drop from the leave too. You will be surprised how they have special talent. Trust me.

 

[Ceycham]

If he shoot to get water, it is normal. I saw mine do it one time. He constantly shoot to get water that drop from the leave too. You will be surprised how they have special talent. Trust me.

I would be, but I'm not sure how talented my guy is...He aims too carefully, and lets the drop get away before he gets an opportunity to shoot. You can see the poor guy with tongue at the ready, but he never gets a shot off because the drop falls and he has to restart the aiming process (with continued same results) for the next drop, and the next!

 

[Ceycham]

I try to look at other things in the cage and use my peripheral vision. Just keep glancing away.
Chameleons stare at each other before combat and stare directly at their food before eating. A two eyed stare is a challenge but one eye or a glance doesn't seem as intimidating. These are just my observations from hand feeding and spraying. I have more success when I'm lower than the chameleon and i don't look to intensely.

I will give it a try! Thanks!