Help worried about new jevenile panther

[Beman]

Hey there welcome to the forum. So a few things here... Was the breeder only feeding crickets or were they feeding mainly dubia? This is important to know because the lack of eating could be linked to not having the food type baby is used to. If this is the case then that is why there is not the appetite we would expect of a 4 month old. If they were actively feeding dubia then the lack of appetite could be linked to illness and or new to his environment. But my concern is if the link is illness.

Secondly... I do not like the way he is gasping in and the tongue movements. My concern here would be an early RI... Which would not develop in the few days you have had baby.

Can I see a few more pics of the entire cage so I can see set up? So from the lighting down?

Also can I see a few more pics of baby?

I agree with reducing the basking temp a bit. This will also help drop your ambient temp lower to 70 rather than sitting so close to 80.

Are you by chance running a pc fan on top of your hybrid cage aimed so it is pulling air up and out of the enclosure? If not I would buy one and run it 24/7 because this will help with overall circulation and the chimney effect.

 

[spoogfps]

None were bigger than the distance between his eyes? Just asking in case he was struggling to get

Hey there welcome to the forum. So a few things here... Was the breeder only feeding crickets or were they feeding mainly dubia? This is important to know because the lack of eating could be linked to not having the food type baby is used to. If this is the case then that is why there is not the appetite we would expect of a 4 month old. If they were actively feeding dubia then the lack of appetite could be linked to illness and or new to his environment. But my concern is if the link is illness.

Secondly... I do not like the way he is gasping in and the tongue movements. My concern here would be an early RI... Which would not develop in the few days you have had baby.

Can I see a few more pics of the entire cage so I can see set up? So from the lighting down?

Also can I see a few more pics of baby?

I agree with reducing the basking temp a bit. This will also help drop your ambient temp lower to 70 rather than sitting so close to 80.

Are you by chance running a pc fan on top of your hybrid cage aimed so it is pulling air up and out of the enclosure? If not I would buy one and run it 24/7 because this will help with overall circulation and the chimney effect.

He was eating mostly crickets before I brought him home I believe this was his first time being introduced to dubias. How long would an RI take to develop? This is the full setup and him right now. It looks like he's going for the food now. He was on his basking branch right before I put the food in. I also caught him drinking off of a leaf last night when I was walking in but I left right away so he wouldn’t get nervous to drink. He seems pretty active so far today and I haven’t seen any weird behaviors but I will continue to keep an eye on him. As for the PC fan I don’t have one but I will get one and set that up

 

[Beman]

He was eating mostly crickets before I brought him home I believe this was his first time being introduced to dubias. How long would an RI take to develop? This is the full setup and him right now. It looks like he's going for the food now. He was on his basking branch right before I put the food in. I also caught him drinking off of a leaf last night when I was walking in but I left right away so he wouldn’t get nervous to drink. He seems pretty active so far today and I haven’t seen any weird behaviors but I will continue to keep an eye on him. As for the PC fan I don’t have one but I will get one and set that up

Ok so I hate to tell you this but you need to order crickets. Rainbowmealworms sells them. You will mix the crickets in with the dubia... You do not want a baby this young not eating what they should especially when they have dealt with the stress of a move and new environment. The stress lowers their immune system and makes them more susceptible to illness. So you need them eating so they are getting the nourishment they need.

Watch him closely... If he starts pointing his nose up this is a bad sign. In the mean time you will want to find a reptile vet near you. Call them some are booked out for weeks. Get an appointment set up. I would get a fecal done as well since he is new to you.

Double check your basking temps. Depending on the heat bulb your using it could be much hotter than you realize at basking.

What UVB type and bulb strength are you using? What is your distance to the branches directly below it?

 

[spoogfps]

Ok so I hate to tell you this but you need to order crickets. Rainbowmealworms sells them. You will mix the crickets in with the dubia... You do not want a baby this young not eating what they should especially when they have dealt with the stress of a move and new environment. The stress lowers their immune system and makes them more susceptible to illness. So you need them eating so they are getting the nourishment they need.

Watch him closely... If he starts pointing his nose up this is a bad sign. In the mean time you will want to find a reptile vet near you. Call them some are booked out for weeks. Get an appointment set up. I would get a fecal done as well since he is new to you.

Double check your basking temps. Depending on the heat bulb your using it could be much hotter than you realize at basking.

What UVB type and bulb strength are you using? What is your distance to the branches directly below it?

Thanks for that information! I'm getting some crickets today for him. I'll check the basking temps and find a vet as well. The UVB I'm using is the reptisun t5 5.0 UVB and it's 6.5 inches from the highest branch

 

[Beman]

Thanks for that information! I'm getting some crickets today for him. I'll check the basking temps and find a vet as well. The UVB I'm using is the reptisun t5 5.0 UVB and it's 6.5 inches from the highest branch

So you want a full 8-9 inches between the UVB and the branch. This puts the cham in the correct UVI exposure level. I would have the same at least for the heat as well. Thermal burns are not fun to deal with.

 

[spoogfps]

So you want a full 8-9 inches between the UVB and the branch. This puts the cham in the correct UVI exposure level. I would have the same at least for the heat as well. Thermal burns are not fun to deal with.

Got it! I’ll lift the lights up a bit then so I don’t mess with him in the enclosure

 

[spoogfps]

So you want a full 8-9 inches between the UVB and the branch. This puts the cham in the correct UVI exposure level. I would have the same at least for the heat as well. Thermal burns are not fun to deal with.

Hi, little update! So I lifted the heat lamp up a bit but not the UVB yet since he got stressed out by me lifting the lamp. He seems to have liked it actually. I saw him drink water and he ate a small super worm. He's also been pretty active and moving around the enclosure more than usual (in a good way). I haven't seen him lift his head or anything. I made an appointment with the vet for tomorrow just to double-check everything on him though since I could be seeing very early signs and I would rather be safe than sorry. Just out of curiosity, I have seen some posts about using baytril with a nebulizer if this were the case. I heard it's a lot better on the system overall. Do you have any experience with that form of treatment or any other alternatives to baytril that don't impact the kidneys as much? Or is that even something I should worry about? I just don't know if I should be advocating for a better treatment than just baytril. Also, you said that stress could cause immune system issues. Would the trip to the vet and back stress him even more and potentially cause a deeper issue? He had a 3 hour drive to get home on Thursday so I just want some advice on how I should be handling this.

 

[ChamelaChameleon]

My Panther Cham is 4 months as well. I took him for a Vet visit. He did fine. Make sure and take a fresh poop sample for a fecal -parasite check. If you get poop today, put it in a baggie, store it in a cool dry place and take it with you. You could transport in a size appropriate box with holes for air. I can't address the medication. Side bar- have you tried feeding grasshoppers?

 

[spoogfps]

My Panther Cham is 4 months as well. I took him for a Vet visit. He did fine. Make sure and take a fresh poop sample for a fecal -parasite check. If you get poop today, put it in a baggie, store it in a cool dry place and take it with you. You could transport in a size appropriate box with holes for air. I can't address the medication. Side bar- have you tried feeding grasshoppers?

Awesome, will do! Thanks for the advice. I have not tried grasshoppers. Wouldn’t they be too big?

 

[ChamelaChameleon]

Awesome, will do! Thanks for the advice. I have not tried grasshoppers. Wouldn’t they be too big?

They have baby grasshoppers. Both of my Chams love love them. Also the grasshoppers are easy to keep, they live a long time, don't make noise or require water. I feed mine dandelion greens. For my adult Cham, 1 order of 40 will last 3 months. For my Baby Bolt, 40 will last 1 month. I give him a mix of feeders. He eats 10-13 feeders a day. However the first week in my home he did not eat much.

 

[spoogfps]

They have baby grasshoppers. Both of my Chams love love them. Also the grasshoppers are easy to keep, they live a long time, don't make noise or require water. I feed mine dandelion greens. For my adult Cham, 1 order of 40 will last 3 months. For my Baby Bolt, 40 will last 1 month. I give him a mix of feeders. He eats 10-13 feeders a day.

Awesome thank you!!!

 

[Beman]

Hi, little update! So I lifted the heat lamp up a bit but not the UVB yet since he got stressed out by me lifting the lamp. He seems to have liked it actually. I saw him drink water and he ate a small super worm. He's also been pretty active and moving around the enclosure more than usual (in a good way). I haven't seen him lift his head or anything. I made an appointment with the vet for tomorrow just to double-check everything on him though since I could be seeing very early signs and I would rather be safe than sorry. Just out of curiosity, I have seen some posts about using baytril with a nebulizer if this were the case. I heard it's a lot better on the system overall. Do you have any experience with that form of treatment or any other alternatives to baytril that don't impact the kidneys as much? Or is that even something I should worry about? I just don't know if I should be advocating for a better treatment than just baytril. Also, you said that stress could cause immune system issues. Would the trip to the vet and back stress him even more and potentially cause a deeper issue? He had a 3 hour drive to get home on Thursday so I just want some advice on how I should be handling this.

THe vet trip should be fine. Just ensure they know chameleons and know how to handle them. If they suggest a vitamin shot then say no. This baby would in no way need that. If you can push a branch about an inch up in a box poke a few holes in the box and have him travel that way. Again watch temps just like you did when you drove home with him. Not too hot in the car and not too cold. Baby should sleep in the box and this will reduce stress. No tape on the box to close it where baby can get to it. This is a big hazard with reptiles.

Most common treatment for RI are antibiotics. Because if you do not get to the core of the infection it gets worse rapidly.

Take a fresh fecal with you. Put it in a plastic baggy. Only the poo part not the white urate.

He may be more active just because it is not as hot for him now. Which is a good sign.

 

[spoogfps]

THe vet trip should be fine. Just ensure they know chameleons and know how to handle them. If they suggest a vitamin shot then say no. This baby would in no way need that. If you can push a branch about an inch up in a box poke a few holes in the box and have him travel that way. Again watch temps just like you did when you drove home with him. Not too hot in the car and not too cold. Baby should sleep in the box and this will reduce stress. No tape on the box to close it where baby can get to it. This is a big hazard with reptiles.

Most common treatment for RI are antibiotics. Because if you do not get to the core of the infection it gets worse rapidly.

Take a fresh fecal with you. Put it in a plastic baggy. Only the poo part not the white urate.

He may be more active just because it is not as hot for him now. Which is a good sign.

Great, I will keep all of that in mind! I really appreciate all the advice. I'll update after the vet trip tomorrow!!

 

[spoogfps]

I recently got this guy on Thursday, he's about 4 months old. He seemed alright but his appetite is low and he seems to do a weird mouth/body movement thing. I'm hoping it's not an RI but I also heard this could be pre-shed behavior and he seems a little more cloudy than when I got him. I just want to know what's going on. The average ambient daily temp is 72-78F with 49-56% humidity (85F basking temp). The average ambient night temp is 65-68F with 60-70% humidity. I've been giving him BSFL and extra small Dubias with light Pangeacal WITHOUT D3 (Have not used Reptivite with D3 yet). He's only eaten about 3-4 bugs since he came home. T5 UVB across the enclosure, lots of live plants, 2 min misting 30 min before lights on, 4 min misting 30 min before lights off. I think I'm doing everything right, I've watched countless hours of Chameleon Acadamy and Neptune the Chameleon. Lot's of hiding spots, good lighting, etc.

Edit: I have the Dragon Strand tall hybrid enclosure and everything in the Neptune advanced kit minus the fogger

Here are the vids please excuse the shaky camera I was holding it up in the corner so he wouldn't see me:
https://streamable.com/53xaax
https://streamable.com/udm8e8
https://streamable.com/53xaax

Please let me know if these links don't work

Update: The vet said he looked good and really couldn't tell if it was in fact an RI since he was too small to do tests on. I showed him some additional videos that I took last night and he thinks he was probably developing one. He prescribed Fortaz injections for 10 days. I'm so happy I ended up being proactive about this instead of waiting for further signs. Thanks everyone for all the advice and help!

 

[Beman]

Update: The vet said he looked good and really couldn't tell if it was in fact an RI since he was too small to do tests on. I showed him some additional videos that I took last night and he thinks he was probably developing one. He prescribed Fortaz injections for 10 days. I'm so happy I ended up being proactive about this instead of waiting for further signs. Thanks everyone for all the advice and help!

Did they show you how to do the injections?

 

[spoogfps]

Did they show you how to do the injections?

Ya they did. Upper body behind the head and inject at an angle. Did it for the first time after the vet and I think I was more scared than he was haha. He actually took it really well. I just felt so bad but it’s for his health. Also, I put a PC fan on the top of the enclosure to pull air out so hopefully that helps

 

[Beman]

Ya they did. Upper body behind the head and inject at an angle. Did it for the first time after the vet and I think I was more scared than he was haha. He actually took it really well. I just felt so bad but it’s for his health. Also, I put a PC fan on the top of the enclosure to pull air out so hopefully that helps

ok Yeah this would push my panic button if I had to do it.

 

[elizaann2]

Glad you were able to get your little one into the vet. Let us know how it goes!

 

[spoogfps]

Glad you were able to get your little one into the vet. Let us know how it goes!

Update: he’s been a lot more active today even more than before but he hasn’t been eating since the day we brought him back from the vet where he only at 1-2 bugs. So 2 days without food so far. It looks like he may have eaten 1-2 bugs today but it’s hard to tell from the cup. I’m just worried about him not eating since I know he should be eating closer to 15 bugs. Do you guys think it may just be due to stress or could it be something else?

 

[Beman]

Update: he’s been a lot more active today even more than before but he hasn’t been eating since the day we brought him back from the vet where he only at 1-2 bugs. So 2 days without food so far. It looks like he may have eaten 1-2 bugs today but it’s hard to tell from the cup. I’m just worried about him not eating since I know he should be eating closer to 15 bugs. Do you guys think it may just be due to stress or could it be something else?

The meds can reduce appetite. Are the insect sizes small enough? Did you get him crickets?