Help getting into Chams

[Sowien]

Hi guys. Over the years I've raised a pair of iguanas, burmese python, ball python and a western hognose. My son just got into the scene by adopting his first ball python. Recently (after helping my son get started with his new ball) I decided I'de like to get started with a chameleon (either a Veiled, Panther or Jacksons) and that there were some questions I needed to figure out before I got started.

1) As far as his cage, I was going to start out buy getting a 24"x24"x48" right from the beginning but I was going to install a platform 1/2 way up (making his area 24x24x24). On the platform, I'm installing a pvc drain with a screen guard and a bucket below that to collect runoff from the mister, waste etc. I'm just wondering if the 24x24x24 is still going to be TO large for him. All together, the chams I'm looking at are ~ 4" nose to vent.
2) For gut-loading crickets, I've noticed both wet and dry versions have "calcium supplements" and "calcium supplements w/ vitamins" versions. Is there any benifit to one over the other ? Also, If I'm allready gut loading the crickets with a Calcium supplement+Vitamin feed, do I still need to dust them with another supplement ? For drinking & sprinkler I'm going to use a Exo Terra MonsoonRS400
3) Temps in my hose rang from ~74f at night to 85f during the day. I'm going to set up a basking light /area for him with its own temp moniter for that spot and a second elseware in the cage. I was just curious as to how close current ambient air temps in my hose would be with regards to general cham comfort.
4) The humidity is one issue I'm having some difficulty in understanding how to moniter. In a treefrog terrarium, it's simple enough as its enclosed, but Im not sure where exactly I would place my meter to get an accurate reading in a screen enclosure. I've heard/read Veils are more tolerent of humidity issues but its an situation I'de still like to work out regardless of the cham I get.
Well, thats about it atm, just trying to get as much info before I get started. I've no doubt tomorrow I'll have more questions. Actually have more now, but it's getting late LoL. Thanks all, any advice, ideas and or suggestions appreciated.

 

[Hoj]

First off hello and welcome.

A veiled or panther is alwasy a great starter cham, I would say the veiled is the most toerant to temp humidity and watering issues.
A 24x24x48 blocked down to 24x24x24 would be fin in my opinion for a veiled of that size.
I like to offer my cricket a mixture of wet and dry gut load.
There are many suppelelments on the market and you will want to use one. I would look into Repashy Calcium Plus it is a all i one formula that is used at most feedings and helps keep things simple.
Your temps will work well provided you still provide a basking site and the neccesary UVB lights.
I measure humidity with a digital gauge kept on the center area of my enclosures.
If you are using a automated mist system you should not have any issues working out a schedual that will maintain a good humdity level.
Feeder varitey, good lighting, and automation of lights and misting are three areas I like to point out for a close look.
Again welcome and KUDOS for doing the research first.

Hoj

 

[Ashleigh]

Hi guys. Over the years I've raised a pair of iguanas, burmese python, ball python and a western hognose. My son just got into the scene by adopting his first ball python. Recently (after helping my son get started with his new ball) I decided I'de like to get started with a chameleon (either a Veiled, Panther or Jacksons) and that there were some questions I needed to figure out before I got started.

1) As far as his cage, I was going to start out buy getting a 24"x24"x48" right from the beginning but I was going to install a platform 1/2 way up (making his area 24x24x24). On the platform, I'm installing a pvc drain with a screen guard and a bucket below that to collect runoff from the mister, waste etc. I'm just wondering if the 24x24x24 is still going to be TO large for him. All together, the chams I'm looking at are ~ 4" nose to vent.
2) For gut-loading crickets, I've noticed both wet and dry versions have "calcium supplements" and "calcium supplements w/ vitamins" versions. Is there any benifit to one over the other ? Also, If I'm allready gut loading the crickets with a Calcium supplement+Vitamin feed, do I still need to dust them with another supplement ? For drinking & sprinkler I'm going to use a Exo Terra MonsoonRS400
3) Temps in my hose rang from ~74f at night to 85f during the day. I'm going to set up a basking light /area for him with its own temp moniter for that spot and a second elseware in the cage. I was just curious as to how close current ambient air temps in my hose would be with regards to general cham comfort.
4) The humidity is one issue I'm having some difficulty in understanding how to moniter. In a treefrog terrarium, it's simple enough as its enclosed, but Im not sure where exactly I would place my meter to get an accurate reading in a screen enclosure. I've heard/read Veils are more tolerent of humidity issues but its an situation I'de still like to work out regardless of the cham I get.
Well, thats about it atm, just trying to get as much info before I get started. I've no doubt tomorrow I'll have more questions. Actually have more now, but it's getting late LoL. Thanks all, any advice, ideas and or suggestions appreciated.

I am in no way an expert, but I've had my little guy since he was 3 1/2 months old and he's a year now and doing great(male panther morph cross). But the idea of making the big cage smaller the way you are describing sounds like an awsome idea to me, i don't see why it would be too big at 24x24x24. For gut loading I use repashy bug burger dry and water crystals because they seem to eat the gut load better when dry for some reason. dusting I do at every feeding with repashy calcium plus that is an all in one calcium powder with vitamins and the kammers who have been doing this for 30 some odd years has been using it with great results, so I trust them(that's who I got my little guy from). For misting, I use a mistking so I can't give you an oppinion on the monsoon. I love the mistking though. For temp, my cage has a basking spot between 85 and 90 F and the rest is in the 70's and when it's cold outside, down to 68F or so at night. For humidity I have a humidifier next to the cage that is on a timer 30min on, an hour off all day, real plants in the enclosure, and the mistking that goes off 4 times a day for 5 min each and that gets my humidity up. I have a humidity gauge, but it's not really acurate and I'm trying to find one that is. I would place it in the middle of the cage somewhere if possible, I would think that would be a good place for acurate readings imo. Again, I am no expert, but this is what I do and it seems to be working out pretty good for my little guy! Good luck with everything!

 

[mirrinias]

On number 3, did you mean you were going to have two thermometers or two basking lights? if you meant the latter, he only needs one.

 

[Elizadolots]

3) Temps in my hose rang from ~74f at night to 85f during the day. I'm going to set up a basking light /area for him with its own temp moniter for that spot and a second elseware in the cage. I was just curious as to how close current ambient air temps in my hose would be with regards to general cham comfort.

Really? All year? With that type of temperature you don't need much in the way of a basking lamp. I do think you should provide one, but you might want to start with a 25 watt bulb and see what you get. Depending on the chameleon, you might want a light that only raises the temp a degree.

I think it would be better if the temps went lower at night. Would that be difficult to manage?

 

[Sowien]

On number 3, did you mean you were going to have two thermometers or two basking lights? if you meant the latter, he only needs one.

2 Thermometers. 1st is going to be mounted @ the spot set up for basking. If it reads to warm, I can move the light farther away. Not warm enough, move the spot closer / install a little more powerful lamp. The 2nd is going to be mounted mid cage to measure average air temp in the cage.

 

[Rottsko]

Everything looks good. As far as gutload, i use both a wet and dry gutload. i know money is always a concern but i wouldn't waste your money on that misting system. Spend a little more and get yourself a mistking. The starter kit is $99. Welcome to the forum!

 

[Sowien]

Really? All year? With that type of temperature you don't need much in the way of a basking lamp. I do think you should provide one, but you might want to start with a 25 watt bulb and see what you get. Depending on the chameleon, you might want a light that only raises the temp a degree.

I think it would be better if the temps went lower at night. Would that be difficult to manage?

Yupyup, I keep it pretty much constant here in the house all year as far as the AC / heater is concerned (Houston Tx). If I didnt have to pay for AC I'de prefer to have it much cooler at nites.... like around 65 LoL. but that would lead to a really scarey electric bill. If cooler temps at nite would be better, during the cooler monthes (like now) I could crack windows to lower temps a few degrees. But during summer monthes, nites rarely drops below 80-85 here so that wouldnt be a solution and I may be forced to lower the thermo a couple of degrees, depending on the requirements of the species, but I honestly dont think Ide go under 73-74 if I could possibly avoid it. Airconditioning a 2 story house down to below 73f is WAY expensive, LoL.

 

[Carlton]

Yupyup, I keep it pretty much constant here in the house all year as far as the AC / heater is concerned (Houston Tx). If I didnt have to pay for AC I'de prefer to have it much cooler at nites.... like around 65 LoL. but that would lead to a really scarey electric bill. If cooler temps at nite would be better, during the cooler monthes (like now) I could crack windows to lower temps a few degrees. But during summer monthes, nites rarely drops below 80-85 here so that wouldnt be a solution and I may be forced to lower the thermo a couple of degrees, depending on the requirements of the species, but I honestly dont think Ide go under 73-74 if I could possibly avoid it. Airconditioning a 2 story house down to below 73f is WAY expensive, LoL.

Your cham will require at least a 10 degree drop in temp at night ALL YEAR. Because they are arboreal they would be exposed to quite a temp shift from day to night. Can you shut the door to the cham's room and cool it with a portable AC instead? Move the cham to the coolest area in your house for summer? You won't have to chill it to the mid 60s, but to 70 might be enough.

 

[Sowien]

Your cham will require at least a 10 degree drop in temp at night ALL YEAR. Because they are arboreal they would be exposed to quite a temp shift from day to night. Can you shut the door to the cham's room and cool it with a portable AC instead? Move the cham to the coolest area in your house for summer? You won't have to chill it to the mid 60s, but to 70 might be enough.

Coolest area of the house would be the downstairs bedroom on the west side. I never considered that idea Carlton, thanks. Its consistently cooler downstairs as cold air sinks, I just never thought about it till I had a reason to I guess. I'll need to get acurate temps in that room first before I go any further. My Thermo is in the upstairs hallway,why? Idk thats where they put it. But with that in mind, it simply HAS to be cooler down stairs. Ill try dropping the thermo down a few degrees this evening and see what temps are in the room downstairs in the morning. If I cant get it down to 70-71, yes I would consider buying a small portable or window-unit that would do the trick.

 

[Sowien]

Ok, assuming I get the kinks worked out with regards to the temps, my next querry involves plants. I've allready gone over the "safe for chams" list on another thread here...very informative btw, and noticed I actually allready have some of them. Ferns (boston), schefflera, honeysuckle and hibiscus, though they will require propper "cleansing" before use.

1) While going through the list, I noticed 1 thing. Most all of the "trees" listed, asides from the ficus, were only available in a fairly large version eg. elm, cotton wood, birch, etc. Besides a Ficus, are there any other options for a smaller live tree that would compliment the cage and still be a healthy addition for a cham? Wisteria is a really nice woody/sturdy vine also, I'm just not sure yet as to wether it's "cham friendly" or not.
2) Years ago, when I had Spike & Malcom (my iggys) I was able to use branches from a red elm that I harvested and sanitized from my backyard as part of their habitat and it worked out wonderfully (Not to mention saved a few hundred $. These were seriously large and well branched out limbs. the enclosures were roughly 8' x 4' x 4').
Is the same possible with chams? Or would they be to sensitive? I would use either Fig or Red Elm this time as that's what I have access to. The Fig branches out really wide and offers some really nice coverage. The Elm tends to be more linear. When I made them for my iggys, I sanded them down to hardwood, then sprayed / misted that with a water/bleach solution several times over a week.. A friend of mine at the time suggested useing Nolvasan as opposed to bleach but said, in a pinch, bleach would work just fine. Just be sure to rinse several times and air dry a good bit. Yeah, he went to A&M and was interning at our vet here in Houston. Actually, we are still useing the same doc for our chocolate lab, Hayboy.