Grabbing Legs

[iceman214]

i have a young veiled chameleon hes about 4 months old and he seems to keep grabbing hold of his own legs when he is walking somtimes he ends up in a heap on the bottom of the enclosure and he dont seem to let go of himself he also does this when waking around on his vines and plants is this normal and will he grow out of it

 

[FaunaBgirl]

Sounds odd to me. Does he show signs of retardation? I did see a retarded chameleon once in L.A.

 

[kinyonga]

They do this when they have MBD. I would take it to a vet...they can tell you for sure that it is MBD and treat it.

 

[iceman214]

They do this when they have MBD. I would take it to a vet...they can tell you for sure that it is MBD and treat it.

he dont do it all the time but he just looks silly when he does
he feeds and poos ok so i dont think there is a prob there

i dont think he has mbd either as he has his calcium regular too

 

[kinyonga]

Oops...sorry for the double post.

They do this when they have MBD....don't know if there can be other causes or not. I would take it to a vet...they can tell you for sure that it is MBD and treat it.

If it is MBD, you need to look at your husbandry to make sure that the chameleon is getting what it needs. Phosphorous, calcium, vitamin A and vitamin D3 need to be in balance for good bone health.

Is the basking area warm enough to allow proper digestion?

Does your chameleon get exposure to UVB light either from direct sunlight or from UVB tube lights? Neither should pass through glass or plastic. Exposure to UVB allows the chameleon to use the calcium in its diet.

Do you gutload the insects with a nutritious diet? Do any of the things you gutload with have phosphorous, D3 or preformed vitamin A in them?

Do you dust the insects with a phosphorous-free calcium powder at most feedings?

Do you use any vitamins on the insects? Do they contain vitamin A from a preformed source or beta carotene? Beta carotene won't build up in the system but preformed can. There is controversy over a chameleon's ability to convert beta carotene...so some people use one with preformed vitamin A once in a while. Too much preformed vitamin A will work against the vitamin D3 and can lead to MBD.

Do you dust with a D3/calcium powder? I don't think it is necessary if your chameleon gets exposure to sunlight...but because mine don't I dust lightly with D3/cal. twice a month. D3 from supplements can build up in the system...so don't overdo it.

 

[iceman214]

Oops...sorry for the double post.

They do this when they have MBD....don't know if there can be other causes or not. I would take it to a vet...they can tell you for sure that it is MBD and treat it.

If it is MBD, you need to look at your husbandry to make sure that the chameleon is getting what it needs. Phosphorous, calcium, vitamin A and vitamin D3 need to be in balance for good bone health.

Is the basking area warm enough to allow proper digestion?

Does your chameleon get exposure to UVB light either from direct sunlight or from UVB tube lights? Neither should pass through glass or plastic. Exposure to UVB allows the chameleon to use the calcium in its diet.

Do you gutload the insects with a nutritious diet? Do any of the things you gutload with have phosphorous, D3 or preformed vitamin A in them?

Do you dust the insects with a phosphorous-free calcium powder at most feedings?

Do you use any vitamins on the insects? Do they contain vitamin A from a preformed source or beta carotene? Beta carotene won't build up in the system but preformed can. There is controversy over a chameleon's ability to convert beta carotene...so some people use one with preformed vitamin A once in a while. Too much preformed vitamin A will work against the vitamin D3 and can lead to MBD.

Do you dust with a D3/calcium powder? I don't think it is necessary if your chameleon gets exposure to sunlight...but because mine don't I dust lightly with D3/cal. twice a month. D3 from supplements can build up in the system...so don't overdo it.

i do most of all that stuff to be honest other than this problem he seems in good health
ill take a pic and you can have a look at him

 

[iceman214]

how do i post a pic?

 

[marxous]

when replying to a post, there is the box you write all your text into, beneath that there is a list of options, you select "manage atachments" and it will bring youto a window... you might have to shrink your photos though, sometimes if they are too big you cant uplead them... I do this in paint. If you dont know how... just ask!

 

[iceman214]

how do i shink in paint then plz

 

[Creampuff]

on the paint program open up your picture. Go to edit at the top and "Select All" then decrease to the size u want by clicking on the little boxes and dragging. They are found top middle, right left and bottom then on the corners. Tinker around to get the size u want.

 

[Heika]

How long has your chameleon been doing this?

I have seen it before too, but not in chams with MBD. The ones that I have seen do it were either sick or getting sick.

Just to let you know.. when I see it, it scares the hell out of me.

Heika

 

[iceman214]

heres a pic of him while shedding last week
any idea what the sickness was?

http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/2365/s5000245ue8.jpg

 

[Brad]

I have also seen this behavior exhibited a few times by sick chameleons. I don't know enough to say there is a direct correlation, but I would be concerned if the behavior persists.

 

[Brian S]

Do you mean like as he's walking, does he king of grab himself like he's really not paying attention and then let go right after he does it, or do you mean he continues to hold onto himself for an extended amount of time?

 

[iceman214]

Do you mean like as he's walking, does he king of grab himself like he's really not paying attention and then let go right after he does it, or do you mean he continues to hold onto himself for an extended amount of time?

yes he tends to keep hold for a bit as if he dont know he has got himself


he has done this since i got him on and off somtimes he is fine and other times hes like this

 

[MdngtRain]

My guy did that and my vet had suggested it was mild MBD. He had no other symptoms at the time. I would recommebd a vet visit for it. It may be costly, but not as costly as a later vet visit will be.
Please don't ignore this problem just b/c it does not seem like a problem right now... it could be your cham's life.

 

[jleahl]

One of my brevs was doing that for a while...also sliding around on his belly, not exactly trunkal weakness, but not normal either. He had me really worried, but then he stopped and went back to normal behavior. If it had continued consistently I would have had him to the vet, but it only went on 3 days or so. I wonder if they go through a klutzy stage like most mammals do while they're growing...

 

[DrewNYC]

it does sound like MBD and the reason it happens is that without the correct bone structure their arms become like rubber bands and cannot direct where they want the limbs to go. i think a visit to the vet would help, if it is at the early stages it will be stoppable.
drew

 

[Heika]

it does sound like MBD and the reason it happens is that without the correct bone structure their arms become like rubber bands and cannot direct where they want the limbs to go. i think a visit to the vet would help, if it is at the early stages it will be stoppable.
drew

Hey Drew,

That seems like a good conclusion, but the first time I saw that behavior was in my panther chameleon Spencer. My vet prescribed a common medication that is supposed to help with digestive problems.. metronidizol. Spencer had been ill with a stomach related problem (obviously) but has never had MBD. He had a very poor reaction to the medication after only a single dose, and began grabbing his own legs, tail, etc. He fell several times, I was convinced he was dying, and he never took the medication again. After a couple days without the medication, that symptom went away.

Heika

 

[iceman214]

dont understand how it can be mbd as he has had his calcium since we got him

heres a pic what your guys think can you tell me if anything stands out
can someone tell me if you can give them too much calcium at the moment im giving him it on all his food

this was just as he was finishing shedding