Fat and water soluble vitamins

[pigglett79]

There is a wonderful article I was given by my vet called chameleons and vitamin A, by roundtable journal of herpetelogical medicine & surgery vol. 13, nov 2 2003, I'm sure if you do a search it will turn up. In order to absorb the vit A, D, E,&K you need some fat. The article speaks of chams in the wild consuming smaller animals for fat so as their bodies can use the vitamins

I am having trouble finding the article, I am interested in reading their exact methods and findings.

 

[Cait0420]

I will try scanning and posting it tomorrow if my darn computer will work, I've been posting on my phone all week

 

[Psychobunny]

Dont crickets and dubia have some fat in them natually?

Sort of beggs the question, how much fat is enough for a cham?

 

[Cait0420]

I was told that after a few weeks start cutting back the cottonseed oil to once a month

 

[Lazy Boy]

Thank you Cait for the post. For sure looking into it more.

 

[Carlton]

Dont crickets and dubia have some fat in them natually?

Sort of begs the question, how much fat is enough for a cham?

It is a great question, but sometimes how the question is raised leads us unintentionally to a wrong answer. All our feeder insects need these fats as well. If we were depriving our feeder insects of the correct fats they wouldn't survive long enough to be eaten. Insect predators must be able to take advantage of the nutrients provided by healthy prey. What leads us to think our feeder insects are so deficient in fats our chams show the effects? Are the gutloads we use deficient in these fats? Do we even have a clue? I am not saying there isn't a problem, I'm saying it is probably not as simple as dabbing oil on a feeder.

I think back to all the chams I've kept over the years with NO eye problems as described so often here, and I was gutloading pretty much the same over that time. I tried to cover the nutritional groups in my feeder diets...dark leafy greens, fruits, fortified whole grains (including the nut types), and usually a superfood such as algae and bee pollen. Are we seeing a nutritional problem or an artifact of reporting?

I am usually leery about adding stuff to a cham's diet in a refined form or concentration they would not metabolize from a prey item. This has come up during discussions about using preformed Vit A versus beta carotene. Feed the prey item correctly and your predator will be healthy.

 

[Psychobunny]

Does anyone even know what the nutritional requirments for a cham are??

I think nutrition requirments have been established for beardies and maybe a few other reptiles, and manufacturers of comercial products probably use those requirments for chams also, even though chams are way different.

Requirments for dogs and cats are well known, but I dont think such a thing exists for chams?!

I tried feeding my cricks ground up nuts to suppliment their diet, but they would not touch it!!
Maybe I was using the wrong kind of nuts?!

 

[Cait0420]

Mine don't seem to like nuts either

 

[sandrachameleon]

Mine don't seem to like nuts either

Chameleons don't.
Or do you mean roaches? Dry grinding the raw nuts finely

 

[pigglett79]

I put various nuts, seeds, dried fruit, alfalfa, dried basil, spirulina and some of the other ingredients listed in sandra chameleons dry gutload recipe in a food processor and make a powder from it. All of my bugs eat it up.

 

[kinyonga]

This might help...
http://www.chameleonnews.com/02SepDonoghue.html

There are a few other articles on the chameleon news forum about nutrition.

 

[pigglett79]

Here is another good listing.

http://www.geckotime.com/nutritional-value-of-commercially-raised-insects/