downhill

fliver

New Member
:(
for those of you who haven't read my other posts,
our chameleon frank acquired mouth rot around the beginning of the month
we took him to the vet on the 9th
she said he had mouth rot and a swollen tongue
she gave us baytril and meloxicam
we've been syringe feeding it to him everyday
he hasn't been eating so we've been giving him bug juice mixed with pedialyte
he actually seems to like it
his mouth really doesn't look much better at all
yesterday we gave him his first shower
he fell right asleep
he seemed to really enjoy it, though he threw up once for the first time
hes started not drinking yesterday
we've noticed him being up at night opening his mouth
and today he just started doing this thing with his eyes... where he pretty much rolls his eyes so that you can't see his iris & pupil
he seems extremely tired (possibly from staying up at night?)
they're also like halfway closed
he seems to have no fight in him at all today
it makes me really upset to see him like this
i don't know what else there is to do besides keep feeding and misting him
i miss my healthy little frankfurt :(


pictures from yesterday
(poor little guy started shedding on his head, eyes, and face a couple days ago)

sickfrank025.jpg



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sickfrank004.jpg



sickfrank026.jpg



sickfrank024.jpg



sickfrank017.jpg
 
He is extremely dehydrated. Have you taken him back to the Vet? Maybe she could give him some sub-cu fluids...The whole mouth opening thing can be related to the dehydration.
 
i just sprayed him and right after he turned really dark
and passed away
:'(

i hope he rests in peace, poor guy :(
 
I am so sorry-it is so hard to lose them. The only good thing about this is that you learn alot so that you can prevent issues in the next one.
 
Plant

Is that a safe plant to have in your enclosure, especially him being a partial vegetation eater? I see he's definitely been nibbling on it. Anyone know if this plant is a safe plant or a toxic one? This is a sign he's been nibbling.
 

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thanks
its been really really really hard
apparently hes not completely gone yet
his limbs are completely limp
hes just laying on a towel
opening his mouth really wide to get air every once in awhile
with his eyes closed and sunken in
 
yea that was horrible
it took 4 hours
he took his last couple breaths outside in the fresh air

i miss him so much already
 
I certainly will! I want them to go to good homes. If you want to see the baby Daddy :) and Mommy click on my website in my signature and go to available chams!
 
those are some good looking parents :)
do you ship to michigan?
and are you ever gunna sell any of your pygmies?
 
Thanks! I will definitley ship to Michigan. As soon as I get a good herd of pygmies going I will be selling those also!
 
awesome!
pm me when the babies are ready & i'll let ya know if we'll take one
also about the pygmies

thanks
you were a big help with frank
i would love to get a chameleon from you
 
You know, so many chameleons with different injuries/illnesses die the same way following baytril treatments. Weakness, convulsions, "yawning", falling over, loss of balance... all this AFTER the baytril has started.

Was this the same way? did he go downhill AFTER you started the medicine?
 
wow really?
the medicine never seemed to help any at all
i'm pretty sure we caught it at an early stage
and it just got worse and worse after we started the meds
the vet really stressed him out too
we've always just let him walk onto us rather than grabbing him
and she grabbed him 3 times
he was so stressed out that it made his eyes sink in really far when she was handling him
and they went back to normal after he got back home
 
I have been told it is irresponsible to state this, but I am going to do it anyway.

your chameleon had an oral infection. With an injury like that, one would expect him to die very slowly, due to starvation as a result of not being able to eat. One would not expect him to die like that - I mean, really,why would an infectin of the mouth cause all that? Unless it went systemic so quickly.

My veiled, at about 2 years, got a SEVERE burn. Burnt about 20% of his body - most of an entire side - al the way to the bone. My reptile vet prescribed baytril - a medicine I have always been uneasy with. he was fine, perfectly normal, despite the massive burns. You'd not know he was hurt except from the black skin. A day after giving baytril, he stopped eating, became dizzy, fell off his branches, etc. I stopped the meds. THE NEXT MORNING, he was as good as new.

The thing scabbed up and fell off twice, he's permanatly crippled as a result of the burn (and possibly medication - his back legs stopped working correctly). He's now 7 years old. This massive burn healed just fine with topical antiseptic cream.

Mouth rot will heal on its own with topicals, provided the infection is kept local.

It's been my experience that general antibiotics kill chameleons much more than the localized infections they are supposed to contain.

Reptile vets, who have my respect, are for some reason, 100% clueless as to baytril's effect on chameleons. I spoke to a reptile vet in Black mountain, NC. he had no idea - he asked all th eother reptile vets on his network - all of them had similar experiences with chameleons just "dying" from small infections. but they attribute it to the chameleons succumbing to the infection, not the baytril.

I told him what I have seen (and it ain't just me), and he started to think that that made sense - they had so many chameleons die from small infections.

do some research, you'll see many of them died the same way.

They do go downhill fast when they die. But not like this.
 
My CB deremensis had surgery on an oral abcess. he recovered fine, and was acting normally. The next day, he was not himself. He went downhill - unable to hold himself up right - which was strange, as it was not weakness - he was simply unable to control himself, it was like he was drunk. He just lay down on the floor, thrashing around, bruising himself. For about 2 weeks.

He was fine after getting the abcess lanced - that day, I gave him his first dose of baytril. Baaaad move. Downhill from there.

I had a sick WC male come down with the same abcess on the inside of the jaw. I propped his jaw open with a Q-tip, cut th eabcess with a sterile scalpel, rinsed it out with betadine, and had him back in the cage within 2 minutes of getting him out in the first place! he was trying to eat immediatly.

Carlton Collins suggested mouth rot was often a result of a vitamin C problem - scurvy, esentially. I upped the vitamin supplementation, and it never came back.

And he was not a healthy animal - he was stunted from being imported as a baby.

The one that died was a healthy, strong captive bred animal.
 
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